Zero detail colours

[Foxbat]

I'm having a whale of a time building Airfix's A6M2b, but they are shy about colours in a couple of areas, and Techmod don't make things any clearer in the painting guide with their decals, so I thought I would come to the experts:

1. The decking behind the pilot under the fixed part of the canopy. Should that be cockpit coloured, fuselage coloured or something else?

2. This has been discussed before at length, but I can't find the thread using search, so I need a quick reminder. For Mitsubishi built airframes the wheel wells match the underside, but for Nakajima ones they are always grey. Is that right, a bit wrong or complete rubbish?

3. Were orange-yellow leading edges applied retrospectively? The intended scheme for my second build is a Nakajima built 2b operating in Japan in 1943. It still wears the (amber) grey scheme in use at Pearl Harbor, rather than the green I would expect on a new build but has white edged Hinomaru. So, stripes or no stripes?

Cheers,

Andy

[SeventySecond]

I am just starting the Tamiya Zero and from the research I have done I think I can answer the first two questions, although it does feel like at times that there is no absolute certainty on Zero colours

My understanding is that the decking should be the same colour as the cowling which on Mitsubushi A/C is a black/blue and on Nakajima A/C is Black/Grey (I think they both start off black but they fade to these colours fairly quickly, but I could easily be wrong on this)

On Wheels wells Mitsubishi A/C are the same colour as the undersides and on Nakajima A/C they are atoke the blue/green translucent preservative sprayed over aluminium.

While on the subject of Zeros does anybody know what the inside colour of the cowling is? It is the one area that nobody seems to have discussed on all the articles I have read, I am guessing either Atoke or the outside black colour.

Regards

Steve

[JOAN]

Andy, look here :

http://www.cybermodeler.com/aircraft/a6m/a6m2_walk.shtml

- 1. I would go to Mitsubishi interior green for everything under the hood.

- 2. Don't know that point.

- 3. I don't know the exact date for introducing the leading edge yellow but all I see have orange-yellow in 1943 :

A6M3 in 1943.....

I will look at the excellent Burindo ( FAoW ) serie and hope to clarify your answers.

Olivier

[Seawinder]

Andy, look here :

http://www.cybermodeler.com/aircraft/a6m/a6m2_walk.shtml

- 1. I would go to Mitsubishi interior green for everything under the hood.

- 2. Don't know that point.

- 3. I don't know the exact date for introducing the leading edge yellow but all I see have orange-yellow in 1943 :

The walkaround photos from the link provided are for a restoration, which IMHO is not reliable for accurate colors. Note for example the Aotake wheel wells, which, according to everything I've read, should be the airframe color. I think Steve is correct about the rear cockpit area being the same as the engine cowling -- not the interior green.

FWIW, here's a couple of paragraphs I downloaded from one of Nick Millman's posts:

"Mitsubishi - wheel wells and undercarriage covers painted in the amber-grey airframe colour. Retracting yoke on small inner doors painted gloss black. Struts gloss black with painted aluminium torque links and wheel hub covers. Tail wheel assembly amber-grey but tail wheel well aotake, covered with black or dark green canvas cover. Tail hook - front mounting and hook gloss black, shaft aotake or amber-grey depending on contractor.

"Nakajima - wheel wells and small inner doors aotake. Retracting yoke on small inner doors painted gloss black. Main wheel doors inner sides amber-grey. Tail wheel and hook same as Mitsubishi."

Hope any of this helps.

Cheers,

Pip

[Foxbat]

Thanks for the great responses - plenty to get me started there.

Steve, oddly given how much they miss Airfix do mention the inside of the cowl, and according to them it is the same colour (50:50 H15 midnight blue and H85 coal black) as the outside.

Pip, I think that's the post I was searching for and couldn't find earlier.

I think I'll go with the yellow leading edges since it'll add a bit of colour and contrast nicely with its 'naked' companion.

Andy

Edited October 4, 2013 by Foxbat

[Murph]

An obviously unrestored cowling, and it appears the interior color is the same as the exterior.

Regards,

Murph

[SeventySecond]

Thanks Murph for posting the picture, doesn't get more conclusive than that.

Andy - thanks for answering as well - good luck with the build

Kind regards

Steve

[Nick Millman]

I think I'll go with the yellow leading edges since it'll add a bit of colour and contrast nicely with its 'naked' companion.

Andy

I think that is a sound decision. The photograph of Iwamoto's オヒ-101 in flight does not show this detail clearly. The order for leading edge IFF strips was issued in August 1942 (see translation below), applied to aircraft in Japan and authorised yellow or red strips for aircraft which were not camouflaged. There are examples of both for the A6M2 so your choice.

“[Japanese] Army-Navy Agreement With Regard To Distinguishing Markings For Friendly Military Airplanes”

“Naval General Staff Order No.162, 21 August 1942

Military Most Secret

Copy 930

Issued By:

[Fleet Admiral] NAGANO, Osami; Chief, Naval General Staff

[Field Marshal] SUGIYAMA, Gen; Chief, Army General Staff

I. Distribution [Omitted]

II. This agreement applies in JAPAN, MANCHURIA, occupied territory and theaters of operation.

III. Markings on airplanes are as follows:

A. The wings and fuselage of airplanes will be marked with red roundels [HINOMARU].

B. The red roundels on the fuselage of camouflaged airplanes will have a white rectangle or roundel as background.

C. The inner half of the leading edges of wings will be painted as follows:

1. Yellow for camouflaged airplanes.

2. Red or yellow for airplanes which are not camouflaged.

D. Trainers and experimental airplanes will be painted yellow with the red roundel as in A [above].

E. In addition to the markings mentioned above, markings which cannot be confused with enemy markings will be painted on the tail and other parts of the airplane to distinguish the different air units."

( Source: Allied Translator and Interpreter Section (ATIS) Advanced Echelon No.2-10 June 1944, Received ATIS SWPA, 15 June 1944.)

The museum recreation and the Aero Detail profile of オヒ-101 do not have the strips but given the above order and time frame that seems a less likely option.

Nick

[Foxbat]

Thank you for that Nick, always good to have your input. Interestingly, the Hasegawa 'Super Ace' combo just arrived, and amongst the schemes not on the lid is the one I mentioned above - including the yellow leading edges. Not definitive I know, because (whisper it) kit makers aren't infallible, but their decals and your evidence build enough of a consistent picture that I'm happy to go with it.

They also suggest black for the cockpit decking and make the differentiation between Mitsubishi and Nakajima wheel wells, so a few of my questions would have been answered if I'd waited a couple of days. Of course several others wouldn't, and I would have missed the extra detail included here - especially that cracking engine picture from Murph which means a quick repaint.

Right, to the workbench!!

Andy

[Nick Millman]

Andy

The cockpit decking wasn't black as such but the same anti-glare blue black as the cowling. It was to a standard IJN specification of four parts carbon black to one part ultramarine pigment (similar to RAF 'Night') and most of the differences attributed to MItsubishi and Nakajima cowlings arose from the way the procured paints weathered and degraded.

Whilst the cowlings got regular maintenance the decking rarely, if ever, did so on in service machines it often ended up looking flatter and greyer over time.

Nick