New Airfix Harrier GR1

[Selwyn]

They are remarkably clean gunpods.

That clickie is having to load the cameras by feel, as you couldn't get your head in there to see. And even if you could, it would be too dark.

Now think about the poor plumbers who have to fit that blasted recce pod. A panel has to be removed from the side of the pylone before the pod is fitted. The cables have to be connected up - again by feel. Chances are that too much cable has been pulled through from the belly of the beast and the panel won't go back on, so you have to disconnect the cables, push the excess cabling back up and re-connect the damn things. Sometimes two or three times. The plumber sits in the same position that the clickie is using,but has to reach even higher. Usually it means bringing your face into very close proximity with a filthy gunpod, leaving an oily smear down your cheeck and a barnet dripping with engine oil. Remember, a Harrier which doesn't leak oil is a Harrier that is empty...

And you don't wanna know about fitting the guns...

Enzo

Fitting recce pod we all believed a extra joint in your arm was required to get the plugs in.

As for guns, my record with my mate Taffy on a aircraft generation exercise on the OCU (pulled when basically all our aircraft were fitted with strakes no tanks and we had a armourers flu epedemic!) was 22 sets of guns fitted in 7 hours, We were absolutly totalled at the end!

Then at endex they had to take them all off again. (fortunately some other mugs got that job!)

Going back to the picure You say the gunpods look clean, I agree but look at the oil smears on the fuselage just above the gun muzzle.

Selwyn

[Enzo the Magnificent]

As for guns, my record with my mate Taffy on a aircraft generation exercise on the OCU (pulled when basically all our aircraft were fitted with strakes no tanks and we had a armourers flu epedemic!) was 22 sets of guns fitted in 7 hours, We were absolutly totalled at the end!

I'm not surprised! That's some achievement. Were the guns already fitted in the pods or did you fit pods first and guns later?

For the uninitiated, they are swings and roundabouts. Fitting guns in pods may be quicker, but it is very difficult manhandling the pods into place - especially if the jet is slightly twisted. Yes, Bedlam... I am looking at you!!!

On the other hand, chucking an empty pod at the jet is relatively easy, but fitting the guns afterwards was time consuming. Nevertheless, I think I would prefer the empty pod route - basically because I was very good at fitting guns...

On an APC at Deci, we had a feed mech failure while cocking in, just as the jockey arrived to take the jet... The gun basically crushed a half-fed round. So... I cleared the stoppage, dropped the gun, fitted a new one and loaded it in the time it took the jockey to do his walkround. It took longer for the line sneck to bring the paperwork for sig than it did to change the gun! strutt.

That's fine for one gun, but it gets to be a nause when you have dozens of 'em to do. Deployments were always great fun, but the worst time for plumbers was when we got back to Gut. Every other trade would drop and run, but plumbers had to regenerate the jets. In order to reduce weight and stress on the jets, the guns were removed in the field. This was not necessarily a good thing. The jet felt light and more like a fighter, so some of the younger growbags tended to treat them quite harshly in this condition. Yes, Bedlam... I am looking at you!!! But when they got back to camp, the guns had to be put straight back in so that they jets were combat ready as soon as possible. So the plumbers stayed behind to fit guns, usually about four hours after everyone else had gone home...

[Selwyn]

I'm not surprised! That's some achievement. Were the guns already fitted in the pods or did you fit pods first and guns later?

For the uninitiated, they are swings and roundabouts. Fitting guns in pods may be quicker, but it is very difficult manhandling the pods into place - especially if the jet is slightly twisted. Yes, Bedlam... I am looking at you!!!

On the other hand, chucking an empty pod at the jet is relatively easy, but fitting the guns afterwards was time consuming. Nevertheless, I think I would prefer the empty pod route - basically because I was very good at fitting guns...

On an APC at Deci, we had a feed mech failure while cocking in, just as the jockey arrived to take the jet... The gun basically crushed a half-fed round. So... I cleared the stoppage, dropped the gun, fitted a new one and loaded it in the time it took the jockey to do his walkround. It took longer for the line sneck to bring the paperwork for sig than it did to change the gun! strutt.

That's fine for one gun, but it gets to be a nause when you have dozens of 'em to do. Deployments were always great fun, but the worst time for plumbers was when we got back to Gut. Every other trade would drop and run, but plumbers had to regenerate the jets. In order to reduce weight and stress on the jets, the guns were removed in the field. This was not necessarily a good thing. The jet felt light and more like a fighter, so some of the younger growbags tended to treat them quite harshly in this condition. Yes, Bedlam... I am looking at you!!! But when they got back to camp, the guns had to be put straight back in so that they jets were combat ready as soon as possible. So the plumbers stayed behind to fit guns, usually about four hours after everyone else had gone home...

Enzo

About half were guns in pods. The others came out of the bay but we fitted them before loading the guns/pod assy.

Also have (fond?) memories of removing the Guns for deployment, I hated fitting those wooden "Tit" blanks in the front fairings!

At Deci I arm started a jet off to the range. Just got my brew from the tea bar when we got the message: "The range, she is closed!" Aircraft is returned and in circuit.

I Collected one Flem and my GS to see it in and unplug it, and stood at the slot ready. 1/4 hour later no jet.

Nipped into the line hut.

"So where's this armed jet then?"

One phone call later lots of ATC people seen on the ATC balcony with bino's searching the airfield.

Meanwhile intrepid growbag is taxying in thinking to himself,

"Whats all these airliners doing here?"

He's only landed at Cagliari airport by mistake - in an armed jet.........................!

Selwyn

Edited August 29, 2013 by Selwyn

[Selwyn]

Not wrong there, 2" rocket pods missing in all scales. Not sure how close they are to CRV-7 pods as I seem to remember someone did those

The CVR7 pods are very different design to SNEB and 2" pods. CVR 7 are basically the same as a US LAU3/A pod. The 2" and SNEB pods were loaded from the rear, the CVR7 & LAU 3 from the front.

however The LAU 3 could pass quite well as a 116 SNEB launcher as long as it had the frangible nose dome and rear blast skirt fitted, but I only ever saw them fitted to harrier once as they were for war use only.

Selwyn

[XV107]

Well got my new harrier yesterday and I like it.

I really hope airfix are not reading all the well I wish it had xxx, or yyy and they could have added zzz,

It will make them wonder why they bother. Instead we should be saying thanks for a decent new tool affordable harrier.

If you wanted all the extras they cost somewhere along the line and it take the kit out of the affordable bracket for a lot of people.

Julien

Since I raised it: First, I wasn't talking about the GR1 kit, but the GR3 and the sprue shots and, second, I was merely saying that the AIM-9s seem an odd choice, not least given that bombs were a key part of Harrier GR3 weaponry. I hardly think that counts as complaining about the quality of the kit or making Airfix wonder why they bothered.

But it makes me wonder why I bothered. I'll keep my thoughts on such matters to myself in future.

Edited August 29, 2013 by XV107

[Dave Fleming]

I tend to agree with XV107 - I'd have liked to have seen 2 " rocket pods, or LGBs instead of Sidewinder for the GR3. If we don't moan we won't keep them on their toes!!

[Enzo the Magnificent]

Meanwhile intrepid growbag is taxying in thinking to himself,

"Whats all these airliners doing here?"

He's only landed at Cagliari airport by mistake - in an armed jet.........................!

That story is legendary! There was even reference to it on the Deci Wall.

[AnonymousAA72]

I tend to agree with XV107 - I'd have liked to have seen 2 " rocket pods, or LGBs instead of Sidewinder for the GR3. If we don't moan we won't keep them on their toes!!

For whats its worth , so do I. The 'winder fit is really only relevant to 'post-war' deployment at RAF Port Stanley......so only represents a short 'window' of use.

Is it moaning though? Hmmm yeah - why not!!?

[Shar2]

Ah Deci, that brings back some memories. Sitting in the cockpit of a SHAR testing a Sidewinder and getting it to lock on the chief bombhead as he walked past. Shame it wasn't a live round.

[Dave Fleming]

For whats its worth , so do I. The 'winder fit is really only relevant to 'post-war' deployment at RAF Port Stanley......so only represents a short 'window' of use.

Is it moaning though? Hmmm yeah - why not!!?

Or one day during the war on Hermes!! (Also post war on the ship)

The box art shows a recce pod, which I'm sure wasn't used in the war!!

Edited August 30, 2013 by Dave Fleming

[SaintsPhil]

Maybe Airfix are tooling up to give us a separate weapons set, or something along the lines of the bomber resupply set....

[Rob P]

Maybe Airfix are tooling up to give us a separate weapons set, or something along the lines of the bomber resupply set....

I can see it now...

Unimog, tow bar, Bedford MK with an open back. And then the weapons.

[sloegin57]

For whats its worth , so do I. The 'winder fit is really only relevant to 'post-war' deployment at RAF Port Stanley......so only represents a short 'window' of use.

Is it moaning though? Hmmm yeah - why not!!?

Or one day during the war on Hermes!! (Also post war on the ship)

The box art shows a recce pod, which I'm sure wasn't used in the war!!

"You can please some of the modellers all of the time

You can please all of the modellers some of the time

But you can't please all of the modellers all of the time"

1. Ain't that the Truth !!

2. See:- Fleming's 2nd Law of the Modelling Internet

Dennis

[AnonymousAA72]

Or one day during the war on Hermes!! (Also post war on the ship)

The box art shows a recce pod, which I'm sure wasn't used in the war!!

yeah - yeah - whatever...............

[Enzo the Magnificent]

I can see it now...

Unimog, tow bar, Bedford MK with an open back.

Or with a Houchin on the back. And we need a trailer with a couple of demin water butts on it.

[Selwyn]

I can see it now...

Unimog, tow bar, Bedford MK with an open back. And then the weapons.

Bedford MK? You must be a new boy.

Bedford RL for Gutersloh! or as my sarge used to call his truck:

"A four and a half litre drophead coupe with capacious boot!"

Selwyn

By the way you can get a Unimog and Demin tanks from BW models, admittedly in 1/76 but they go well with the 1/72 scale harrier.

[Col.]

I can see it now...

Unimog, tow bar, Bedford MK with an open back. And then the weapons.

I'd buy that.

[Dave Fleming]

"You can please some of the modellers all of the time

You can please all of the modellers some of the time

But you can't please all of the modellers all of the time"

1. Ain't that the Truth !!

2. See:- Fleming's 2nd Law of the Modelling Internet

Dennis

[Rob P]

Phimat adaptor?But there doesn't seem to be a Phimat pod.A bit of trivia. During the late 80s, Harrier missions were flown by a formation of four jets. Three carried the air-ground ordnance and the fourth was known as a "stinger". It carried a Sidewinder and a Phimat pod on the outboards - the 'winder was usually on the starboard outer. The stinger would take up a random position in the formation, the intention being to deter any attacking aircraft as they would not know which Harrier could fight back.There were experiments with two 'winders on the outboards and a Phimat on the centreline, but it was found that a large proportion of the chaff would end up in the back hatch and would short out the comms systems. The chaff that didn't end up in the back hatch would abrade the rear fuselage as it was released. Centreline Phimats didn't last long.

Found a photo, except it shows Phimat on starboard outer.

http://www.fourfax.co.uk/wpg2?g2_itemId=4945

Courtesy of Fourfax.

[Westie7]

Just got mine through today.

Shows how much work I have to do on the panel lines on the Sword T-Bird!

[John Aero]

Was the No1 Sqn badge still on the Decci wall? I painted that in the middle 70's.

John

[Enzo the Magnificent]

Was the No1 Sqn badge still on the Decci wall? I painted that in the middle 70's.

Very probably. Pretty much every unit added something on each deployment. The good thing was that no one ever overpainted another unit's contribution. It did mean that when the Wall was full, we had to find other areas to paint. By 1989 the roof of the ACMI hut was covered, and we had started filling up the pan!

[Albeback52]

Since I raised it: First, I wasn't talking about the GR1 kit, but the GR3 and the sprue shots and, second, I was merely saying that the AIM-9s seem an odd choice, not least given that bombs were a key part of Harrier GR3 weaponry. I hardly think that counts as complaining about the quality of the kit or making Airfix wonder why they bothered.

Agree with you on this. With regard to the actual kit, think the choice of weapons provided was very miserly . Would including a wide selection of ordnance have really made the kit unaffordable for a lot of people as suggested in another post? I suggest not. Were the Harrier GR5/7/9 unaffordable despite having a bigger & better choice of weapons?

Maybe Airfix are tooling up to give us a separate weapons set, or something along the lines of the bomber resupply set....

I sincerely hope NOT!. We should not be having to pay extra for items that should (in my view) be included in the basic kit. I was singularly unimpressed with Airfix's suggestion that we buy a Bomber Resupply set just for the privilege of bombing up the new Lancaster BII. Would including a sprue of bombs have made THAT unaffordable? I suggest not. Even the 1981 retool of the Lanc had a full bomb load

Allan

Edited August 31, 2013 by Albeback52

[Enzo the Magnificent]

Agree with you on this. With regard to the actual kit, think the choice of weapons provided was very miserly . Would including a wide selection of ordnance have really made the kit unaffordable for a lot of people as suggested in another post? I suggest not. Were the Harrier GR5/7/9 unaffordable despite having a bigger & better choice of weapons?

Are we sure that there isn't a wider choice of weapons in the box? The two extra sprues seem to be on a sprue tree that has space for a third small sprue. It could be that this third sprue has the additional weapons.

[Albeback52]

Are we sure that there isn't a wider choice of weapons in the box? The two extra sprues seem to be on a sprue tree that has space for a third small sprue. It could be that this third sprue has the additional weapons.

You could be right Enzo. In that event, I'm happy to stand corrected. I'm actually delighted with the GR1 kits ( I have 3!!). I just feel that in this case the lack of whizz bangs has slightly spoiled the proverbial ship for the equally proverbial ha'penny worth of tar. It's my personal view that the inclusion of same would have made a great little kit even better. I'll certainly still buy the GR3 when it becomes available. I'd rather pay a bit more for a good selection of ordnance in the kit rather than see airfix go down the road ( and I hope they do NOT) of having us buy weapons as separate items. Again, just a personal take on the matter.

Allan

ps - I hope Airfix also manage to do the AV-8A at some point

Edited September 1, 2013 by Albeback52