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Jesse_

Experts in Dagger and PJ Productions Mirage III/V kits?

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Hello all, my first post at this great forum!

Maybe this has been discussed before, but I didn't really find exactly the answer I wan't from prevoius threads. I want to do an Argentinian Dagger A during the Falklands/Malvinas war in 1/72. I plan on getting the PJ Productions injection molded Mirage III E or Mirage V BA/BR. I know the Dagger/Nesher is a copy of Mirage V, but how similar are Mirage IIIE and Mirage V BA/BR?

So the main question, if I want to do an Argentinian Dagger in 1/72, is it best to buy the PJ Productions Mirage IIIE kit or Mirage V BA/BR? Are there any differences in the two kits regarding sprue content, or is it just the decals that differ?

I know High Planes has released a Dagger, but that is not an option since it's harder for me to get and it's a more expensive resin kit if I'm correct(?).

Cheers!

/Jesse

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If you're talking injected plastic, then the PJ and the HPM Mirage are the same plastic, so in theory the HPM Dagger would be the one to buy as it already include Argentinian decals. Unfortunately in Europe the HPM kits become really expensive once delivery and import taxes are added.

The PJ models also add some resin and PE bits, so are even better value for money in this part of the world.

All boxes include the same plastic, so it does not really matter which one you buy. I don't know for sure if all the resin bits are the same though.

In theory the best box for a Dagger would be this one:

http://www.pj-production.be/fr/142-721028-amd-mirage-iiirrz5f-plastique-injecte.html

The reason is that it allows to build a Mirage 5F. The Nesher was a copy of this version that is recognisable for the thinner nose with low mounted pitot tube and the fillet in front of the tail.

The belgian 5BA has a similar but different nose, with the pitot mounted on the nose tip, and no fillet. The III has a bulged nose for the radar (absent in the Mirage 5/Nesher/Dagger)

All kits have the same plastic though

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Off-topic, but ...

The III has a bulged nose for the radar (absent in the Mirage 5/Nesher/Dagger)

- except for the Egyptian 5SDE, the Libyan 5DE, and the Abu Dhabi 5EAD. This is a trap for the unwary. You may be thinking, why are these even called Mirage 5s? Well, so am I.

Not that it makes the slightest difference to the question, mind.

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Great, thanks Giorgio N! When I look at sprue scans on the III E and V BA both kits have choices of noses, with at least one example with the pitot tube mounted lower. I guess it's there for use in a Nesher/Dagger? Or are there other versions with lower pitot tube but were the nose is noteably different from the Dagger? Good picture of sprue in here: http://www.hyperscale.com/2012/reviews/kits/pj72020previewbg_1.htm

/Jesse

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Hi Jesse,

The plastic parts are the same in all the High Planes and PJ boxings, but you get asome resin and photo etch in the PJ ones making them slightly more expensive in the UK. However you can get the HPM Dagger from their UK importer currently at 25% off retail price, and they also stock (my) Freightdog Dagger Falklands weapon's set to. Links to both items are here;

http://www.model-craft.co.uk/catalogue/High-Planes-72nd-Scale-Dagger-Falklands-7271.cfm?lastMenuId=1

http://www.model-craft.co.uk/catalogue/IAI-Dagger-Falklands-Weapons-Set.cfm?lastMenuId=99

They will also ship worldwide to. Hope that helps!

Colin

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Off-topic, but ...

- except for the Egyptian 5SDE, the Libyan 5DE, and the Abu Dhabi 5EAD. This is a trap for the unwary. You may be thinking, why are these even called Mirage 5s? Well, so am I.

Not that it makes the slightest difference to the question, mind.

True, didn't think of those as for me they are really Mirage III-E. IIRC Dassault at some point started calling Mirage 5 every export version, so the ones you mentioned and another couple are Mirage 5 in name even if they look like a III-E.

Jesse, of the two noses with lower pitot shown in the sprue shots, you need the one with parts on the left, without those little strakes. This is the part of the original Mirage 5 and the Nesher/Dagger. The nose with lower pitot and the strakes on the side is for other versions that are likely to appear, like the Cheetah and the Chilean Pantera.

Have to say however that the offer shown in Colin's post is quite tempting: for £19.50 you'd have no resin parts but the kit with the right decals

Edited by Giorgio N

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Hi Jesse,

The plastic parts are the same in all the High Planes and PJ boxings, but you get asome resin and photo etch in the PJ ones making them slightly more expensive in the UK. However you can get the HPM Dagger from their UK importer currently at 25% off retail price, and they also stock (my) Freightdog Dagger Falklands weapon's set to. Links to both items are here;

http://www.model-craft.co.uk/catalogue/High-Planes-72nd-Scale-Dagger-Falklands-7271.cfm?lastMenuId=1

http://www.model-craft.co.uk/catalogue/IAI-Dagger-Falklands-Weapons-Set.cfm?lastMenuId=99

They will also ship worldwide to. Hope that helps!

Colin

Nice! Very nice! :-) Don't need any extra resin parts and great to get the right decals right away. But it would be nice to get the photo etch ladder provided in the PJ kits. I'll have some serious thinking to do...

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It's not a Dagger but I have built this PJ Models Mirage 5 BR

http://z15.invisionfree.com/72nd_Aircraft/index.php?showtopic=3530

Patrick

Very nice! And the Dagger in the link provided by luis pacheco as well! I'm really starting to like the shape of the Mirage III-family. Perhaps I'm gonna get two kits, the Mirage III E from PJ to get the ladder and make a FAA Mirage III EA, AND the Dagger from HPM! Thanks for all the good info guys!

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I know the Dagger/Nesher is a copy of Mirage V, but how similar are Mirage IIIE and Mirage V BA/BR?

One 'correction' here, if you don't mind:

Namely, all the Nesher/Daggers were manufactured in France, by Aérospatiale. Indeed, they also have Aérospatiale's manufacturer plates.

Therefore, using ESCI's or Heller's Mirage 5F usually results in excellent reconstructions of Argentinean Daggers too.

Edited by Tom Cooper

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