Dan Air Vickers Viscounts (type 700 version)

[phat trev]

Can anyone help with some information on 'early' type Vickers Viscounts used by Dan-Air
I am wanting to use the Glencoe 1/96 kit as a basis to build a Dan-Air operated airlner and as it is a type 700 I want to finish it as an early version (bulged cockpit and shorter fuselage)

I have called up a load of photos on airliners.net and they show a small number of '700' types but do state various model numbers '70'8 '724'
what are the differences between these versions?

hope someone can help.

thanks

[BritJet]

Basically they are customer numbers and identify the equipment requested by the airline. Boeing use a similar system eg 747-236 where the 36 identifies British Airways. Shouldn't cause too much trouble with Viscounts but look out for things like window configuration and external (slipper) fuel tanks.

Main thing to watch out for on Viscount 700s are the engines - some have bulged cowlings and these are the Ds eg 745D, but I don't think the Dan Air ones had them. Compare http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5184/5602706819_0713deb817_z.jpg with http://www.nwan.co.uk/images/bwgaruu.jpg

Hope this helps.

Steve

[garryrussell]

All Viscounts had buldged cockpits..i.t was actually a hood quite similar to a WW II bomber technology.

Dan air used 708 and 724

The 724 is the closest to the Glencoe kit.

The main change is adding a weather radar and reshaping the props.

If you make a 708 in addition to the above you need to change the rear cockpit windows, delet the ice lamp windows, add a radio officers window and add a large underfuse airscoop.

The Glenco Viscount windows are too small and slightly the wrong shape.

Check this site out

http://vickersviscount.net/

Edited April 26, 2013 by garryrussell

[phat trev]

Thanks guys, that website is good also.

Enlarging the windows might be tricky, any hints so as to keep them looking the same! (some photos show certain ones larger than others? unless its jus a trick of the light?)

All Viscounts had buldged cockpits..i.t was actually a hood quite similar to a WW II bomber technology.

Dan air used 708 and 724

The 724 is the closest to the Glencoe kit.

The main change is adding a weather radar and reshaping the props.

If you make a 708 in addition to the above you need to change the rear cockpit windows, delet the ice lamp windows, add a radio officers window and add a large underfuse airscoop.

The Glenco Viscount windows are too small and slightly the wrong shape.

Check this site out

http://vickersviscount.net/

[BritJet]

All Viscounts had buldged cockpits......

Don't think there was any doubt about that........

Steve

[garryrussell]

Don't shoot for answering a question

From the OP

I want to finish it as an early version (bulged cockpit and shorter fuselage)

Edited April 26, 2013 by garryrussell

[BritJet]

Sorry I missed that bit in the OP I wasn't having a go, just confused

Steve

[garryrussell]

All main windows were the same.

What you are probably seeing is window escape exits painted arround making them look bigger.

I just roll up some emery paper and gentle open them out...seems to works out well and quickly

[phat trev]

Don't shoot for answering a question

From the OP

I want to finish it as an early version (bulged cockpit and shorter fuselage)

The earlier versions (700's) look to have a more pronounced 'bulged' hood over the cockpit (this is what I mean)

Many of the photos (typing 'viscount dan-air in to goodle) look to be the later style with a longer fuselage but these photos from airliners.net show type 700 Viscounts I think.

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Untitled-%28Dan-Air-London%29/Vickers-724-Viscount/0511388/&sid=8fccc98b9ba91d039fcde372a26325ba

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Dan-Air-London/Vickers-708-Viscount/0217895/&sid=8fccc98b9ba91d039fcde372a26325ba

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Dan-Air-London/Vickers-708-Viscount/1169962/&sid=8fccc98b9ba91d039fcde372a26325ba

thanks for the info so far, much help is great in this instance..

[viscount806x]

The earlier versions (700's) look to have a more pronounced 'bulged' hood over the cockpit (this is what I mean)

Many of the photos (typing 'viscount dan-air in to goodle) look to be the later style with a longer fuselage but these photos from airliners.net show type 700 Viscounts I think.

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Untitled-%28Dan-Air-London%29/Vickers-724-Viscount/0511388/&sid=8fccc98b9ba91d039fcde372a26325ba

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Dan-Air-London/Vickers-708-Viscount/0217895/&sid=8fccc98b9ba91d039fcde372a26325ba

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Dan-Air-London/Vickers-708-Viscount/1169962/&sid=8fccc98b9ba91d039fcde372a26325ba

thanks for the info so far, much help is great in this instance..

The cockpit hood shape was the same from the first to last Viscount built as Garry says. Read his posts carefully because he is a man who knows his Viscounts! What is different in the early build hulls like 'RIR which you have two pictures of, is the layout of the side cockpit windows (DV- direct vision) and rear fixed window, as seen on 'RC. These later a/c have a sliding triangular opening DV window with a another fixed triangular window behind. The early a/c have a slitty DV window with a small fixed pane above and below it and NO further windows to the rear. Your thoughts about a different shape cockpit are due to the optical effects of this different side window layout.

Here are two models of the later followed by earlier style of cockpit windows, both from the Glencoe kit. The later (BKS) one is a bit in error with the lack of the bulged Dart 510s as fitted to the 700D series in real life. Someone was supposedly coming up with a set of replacement 510 engine nacelles for this kit but no sign as yet unfortunately. That set if it ever gets done will also open up posibilities for V800 series conversions from the Glencoe kit so I hope they appear eventually.

Enjoy building your 'Vimys' anyway, the Glencoe kit is very good in many ways and when it is considered that it appeared in the 1950s, well it must have been a real stunner in its day.

[garryrussell]

The only difference was the panel containing the DV as V.806x says.

Either the original horizontal DV or the later type DV could be fitted.

The early TAA Viscounts had the earlier DV and had the later fitted after they entered service.

The first BEA Viscount G-ALWE trialed the latter type during test before being fitted with the standard horizontal DV of the early Viscounts.

[phat trev]

Looking forward to actually starting the build now. Thanks to all contributors here

[garryrussell]

You're welcome...and...anything, just ask, no matter how trivial you might think the question.

TBH it's the trivial detail be it an aerial type or a window that can turn a good model into a masterpiece.

.

[bzn20]

Here are quite a few good pics of Dan air Viscounts

http://www.danairremembered.com/dan_viscount_page.htm

[phat trev]

they look good, thanks bzn20

[phat trev]

Building a Vickers Viscount or Jumbo and the Jet Set with these wings!?!

[viscount806x]

Building a Vickers Viscount or Jumbo and the Jet Set with these wings!?!

Can I assume that that is your Glencoe kit out of the box? If it is, it is much the same as all the ones I have built. In addition, some (funnily not all) of them also feature a twisted and short fuselage half. They do go together OK with a little help from clamps, hot water, swearing and progressive gluing however. A mate of mine sent a kit back to me that I had given him saying it was unbuildable because of this. Not so. Be patient and get on with it. Good luck.

[phat trev]

Can I assume that that is your Glencoe kit out of the box? If it is, it is much the same as all the ones I have built. In addition, some (funnily not all) of them also feature a twisted and short fuselage half. They do go together OK with a little help from clamps, hot water, swearing and progressive gluing however. A mate of mine sent a kit back to me that I had given him saying it was unbuildable because of this. Not so. Be patient and get on with it. Good luck.

yes the wings are straight from the box. they just need clamping and gluing and a bit of TLC (i hope) as for the fuselage it is in good condition and although a few cm's in the middle of the body my need a bit of TLC to get them lined up the majority of the two parts look to have a good fit.

(actually how would the parts have become so warped whilst packed? they have no 'bend' marks or stress marks??)

[garryrussell]

I have twelve unmade Glencoe Viscounts and all have Curtiss Condor transparencies.

That and the above, does make me wonder about quality control

[viscount806x]

I have twelve unmade Glencoe Viscounts and all have Curtiss Condor transparencies.

That and the above, does make me wonder about quality control

I think I can beat that Garry. I have built about 5 or 6 and have another dozen put by. Some have the Condor windows too but as I ditch the transparencies anyway, that's no problem. What are your thoughts on a V800 conversion and later Dart 510/520/530 engines for this kit?

Incidentally, Mastercasters 1/72 HP Victor or Vulcan wheels are just right for these models mainwheels, enough in one set for several Viscounts.

Trev, I think the warping may be a combination of very soft plastic and over enthusiatically premature removal from the moulds. Certainly not all of the kits are so badly warped as others.

[chris57]

Anyone care to comment as to the accuracy of the Viscount plans in Aviation News vol 7/14 by Martin Harrison. Reason for asking is i picked up a 1/72 resin Viscount at a show( comprising fuselage, wings(one piece),two tailplanes and prop spinners), which i promptly compared to these plans at the time and it was a dead fit for the 800 series model. however after seeing this thread and revisiting the kit, i think the fuselage might be a tad short. any costructive comments welcome please gents. cheers chris

[phat trev]

I was considering altering the kit to make a type 800, I guess I could just cut and extend the fuselage a little and build up the engine bulges.

All depends on the final Dan-Air scheme

[garryrussell]

Dan Air only used one standard V.800, G-CSZB, limiting you to one livery, plus the ABC V.808PCF with the double front door. The others were 810's

For the 800 in addition to the engines you need to add a weather radar.

For the 810, you'd need to also add the weather radar, alter the rear undercarriage doors and enlarge the fin slightly.

The 800/810 also had a slightly different tail plane incidence to 'pick up' the longer nose, but I'd doubt anyone would notice.

As far as Dan Air is concerned, the V.724, G-BDRC, is the closest to the kit.

[viscount806x]

Dan Air only used one standard V.800, G-CSZB, limiting you to one livery, plus the ABC V.808PCF with the double front door. The others were 810's

For the 800 in addition to the engines you need to add a weather radar.

For the 810, you'd need to also add the weather radar, alter the rear undercarriage doors and enlarge the fin slightly.

The 800/810 also had a slightly different tail plane incidence to 'pick up' the longer nose, but I'd doubt anyone would notice.

As far as Dan Air is concerned, the V.724, G-BDRC, is the closest to the kit.

And all that is before Garry tells you about the variations in window locations and fwd door sizes....

For me, the stopper of a V800 conversion is the engine problem. I think the only viable way would be to turn them up on a lathe. Maybe some resin pods will appear one day. I have a couple of Frog kits put by but robbing the engines from them might be a bit cavalier. Not sure they are that good anyway, in fact the Frog kit dates to about the same as the Hawk/Glencoe but it (Frog) is very toylike by comparisan. The Glencoe is a good enough and a robbery of a second kit fuselage section could provide a plug to give V800 length but the engine problem remains, drat it.

Chris, I remember those AN plans and used them in the late '70s to help me build the old Kader kit (don't even go there!) but they were a bit off in places as I recall. At the time, I had real V806Xs and V802s on tap at work to compare them with and I remember being quite unimpressed.

Nige

I

[phat trev]

Dan Air only used one standard V.800, G-CSZB, limiting you to one livery, plus the ABC V.808PCF with the double front door. The others were 810's

For the 800 in addition to the engines you need to add a weather radar.

For the 810, you'd need to also add the weather radar, alter the rear undercarriage doors and enlarge the fin slightly.

The 800/810 also had a slightly different tail plane incidence to 'pick up' the longer nose, but I'd doubt anyone would notice.

As far as Dan Air is concerned, the V.724, G-BDRC, is the closest to the kit.

I will see what i feel like doing i guess when it comes to it. will probably end up doing a 700 series (will see what the decals look like when they arrive)

Edited May 7, 2013 by phat trev