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1/48 - CAC CA-25 Winjeel resin kit by Planet Models/Red Roo Models - re-released


Homebee
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Planet Models is to release a 1/48th resin kit of the CAC CA-25 Winjeel - ref. PLT259

In association with Red Roo Models - ref. RRK48002

About the Winjeel: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CAC_Winjeel

Source: http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/234938325-148-plt259-cac-winjeel/

 

Resin.jpg

 

V.P.

 

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Edited by Homebee
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  • 3 years later...
  • 3 weeks later...

Love the Winjeel and I was looking forward to this release. Saw it at the Model Expo on the weekend for AU$150. Beautiful kit but can't justify that amount. I see the price has dropped to $130 but still not tempted.

Edited by tonyp
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  • 2 weeks later...

Or scratch build one if one is really inspired. I just wonder how Bill Koster could produce a 1/48 scale Fw200 (which included resin,metal, PE and decals in addition to the vacuformed parts...) for $70 USD (originally) yet so many of these wonderful subjects are being kitted at such high price points. Whatever the reason it will negatively impact sales. Perhaps the number of units was preemptively set low anticipating low interest in the subject, hence driving the ROI per unit higher?

That is one thing that vac tooling has over resin casting - it doesn't wear out and have to be repeatedly replenished.

R/ Robert

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It's a high price for the airframe size but it certainly looks worth it. I'm very tempted.

The web site price has dropped again. I like this plane so will buy one next pay day. Not mentioned above is a reference CD so all-in-all I feel it is fair value. My current project will end up costing more than that but it has kept me out of mischief for three months. I'd also mention that a decent meal out with the Girlie cost a LOT more....As to pricing well I'd rather pay and have more choice in the future rather than grab it while under-priced to make a decent profit resulting in the manufacturer going under or giving up.

I'd cite Execuform, Koster, Paragon Designs, Maintrack and others as examples.

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Using current prices and dollars the Winjeel is $17-50 more expensive than the FW200. Given the highly disparate nature of the kits this is not much. The main factor is the relative costs of resin and vacform tooling and resin itself is quite expensive stuff.

There's not a lot of point buying a Winjeel if you really want a FW200 and vice versa.

We were given incorrect tax advice on the transaction hence for a short time the cost was over-estimated - this affected only kits purchased at Model Expo. (www.modelexpo.com.au) We could have just kept the difference but we thought the right thing to do was pass on the savings to customers.

Indeed we want to be around and supplying high quality products at reasonable prices well into the future.

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Right on, Ed! Guess my point was to get more discussion going about exactly what is driving the cost of the Winjeel as compared to other production methodologies that folks might tend to compare it against. Being the cheap sweethearts' we modelers tend to be (X amount of funds, infinite desire for modeling goodness...), rationalization is the name of the game when putting down the piggy. Many times this turns out badly for us, but it is our nature (I *still* regret passing up on a $150 Aeroclub Vulcan I saw while on travel, thinking I'd 'get it back home'...) SleeperService provides an example with his personal rational for cost, namely the 'hours recreation per dollar' metric (certainly a common one used on SWMBO, I suspect!)

My mention of Bill Koster's Condor came from using an extreme example of a limited production kit of substantially larger 'parameters' when compared to the Winjeel - and of which I have personal knowledge. Both are of high quality and similar interest demographics (aka 'niche') though that is perhaps the end of any common ground. This was perhaps confusing - really apples and oranges on the face of it. Come to think of it, the Fw200 would be more correctly compared (as a kit) to OZMods Caribou. If I had more data, I might compare the Winjeel's cost parameters to say, HPM's Concorde kit which uses the same production technology (other than a fiberglass fuselage shell.) That aside, my earlier comment was truly aimed at *what* drives the costs so to help with the 'reasonable' test applied by many desirous of the Winjeel model. The Condor just shows what can be done in a rather spectacular way using its specific methodology.

So, back to specifics; the Condor kit has vac, resin, white metal and PE parts (plus decals), is well engineered & provides a full interior and even beats the pants off the Trumpeter release in all areas except perhaps ease of assembly (if you don't attempt to correct its accuracy issues, that is!) It is a complex product & Bill most likely did all the design, research, drawings and artwork personally in addition to making the vac & resin masters. However, it is not made of cast resin, which would have undoubtedly resulted in something like a $800 plus cost instead. Also, I have no clue how much Bill 'paid' himself for his work or whether he had a reasonable ROI on the Fw200 project. He did however continue making, IMO, more and even better kits, so we might assume he did okay with it.

The Winjeel on the other hand uses more modern production methods & tools like 3D CAD (perhaps even 3D printing of masters?) plus, as noted, it is made primarily using significantly more costly RTV mold/ urethane resin casting techniques. How much more costly? Well, material costs will obviously vary depending on location, availability and quality as well as the detailed tooling design & implementation. Also, resin casting is essentially a hand-layup process (though there are injection machines for resin, I don't expect Red Roo to be using such equipment...), each kit produced is mostly hand made. The mold and casting materials also have limited shelf life so it is tricky to purchase & manage since it must be used in relatively short order. Any unused could go to waste. This is why you can find small casting operations only doing 'to order' production. I expect it is more a tight-rope walk than most manufacturing tends to be... a logistical headache at the least. However, unless someone were the make a 1/48 Winjeel kit of comparable quality - in Oz - using other media, there is no real yardstick to work with other than comparison to kits of other subjects of similar size and complexity.

Being the Winjeel is about the size of a T-28 'Trojan' or P-47 Thunderbolt, perhaps a High Planes Rare Bear kit could be used for comparison. This would be a limited-life tool, injection molded kit with white metal parts and standard screen-print, water-slide decals. An example of the Bear kit is offered by 'Victory Models' in Coral Cable, Florida for $39.99USD. The Winjeel is showing at $118.18 less 'GST' on the Red Roo website. I'm not sure if this is USD or AuD since it isn't indicated. It is possible the AuD is being converted automatically (somehow detecting I'm in the US) but if not then the cost would be about $88USD. This is lower than previously indicated by web sources, including Brett Green's nice First Look preview which well illustrates the kit's high quality. Against the Bear, the 'Jeel has PE, very crisp & well detailed moldings, 6 decal options, optional tailwheel, much better engine detail & lower parts count, which only helps the runaway 'lead' in the build-ability department. Apparently the 'documentation' provided is far better in the Winjeel kit given it is provided on a CD vice a one sheet instruction set.

So, out of the box, the Winjeel will likely provide a much better result with much less effort - given that many builders rate ease of assembly very highly, considering their time valuable - and ignoring that fact that it is a Winjeel which can only be had by using the reportedly crude and now "ancient" NKR kit (1988?) or by scratching it entirely. Comparison to a Roden T-28 kit is a bit closer from a 'competency' standpoint, but since it is a full injection molded kit produced in the thousands, a price comparison simply reinforces the unit cost advantages of modern injection molding (and looking at my example of same, I'd expect the Winjeel would again win as an easier build.) The flaw in this, though, is that likely, a Roden Winjeel would not sell in the thousands, making it a financial failure.

I would say Red Roo's Winjeel will likely be the penultimate release of this 'bird' in 1/48 - or perhaps any - scale and hence desirable to anyone interested in the subject. The purchase decision will come down to whether the individual can afford it, not whether they want it. Certainly the kit itself won't disappoint (unlike, sadly, some PendOrielle kits I've got in the stash...)

Regards, Robert

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"I would say Red Roo's Winjeel will likely be the penultimate release of this 'bird' in 1/48"

Sorry, I meant to say "ultimate release"... apparently I have been misusing/misreading 'penultimate' for a while!

I have been made aware that my comments about are being taken as negative (my mistaken vocabulary not helping...) but to be clear, I am of the opinion that the Winjeel is a fine production that certainly should satisfy anyone building it. My intention was to get readers to consider the factors that impact the kit's cost instead of simply dismissing it. If one wants a Winjeel, the high fidelity of the castings & the consequent expected ease of construction certainly represents good value if the time & effort spent scratchbuilding one (the only other realistic option) to the same standard is taken into account. Red Roo has done all the hard work already.

The nature of resin kit production may have been obvious to many experienced modelers but perhaps not so to everyone. In any case, I apologize for any confusion I may have caused.

Regards/ Robert

Edited by rbeach84
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  • 4 months later...

This time under Planet Models label we can expect the soon re-release of this CAC CA-25 Winjeel kit

Source: http://www.specialhobby.net/2020/07/novinky-ze-special-hobby-072020.html

Quote

 (...) In the summer, we will offer modelers the CA-25 Vinjeel 1/48 resin model from the Planet Models series. (...)

 

V.P.

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  • 1 month later...

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