canberra kid Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 I'm going to have a crack at the Airfix B.57G, but I'll be using the forward fusalage nose section from the CA B.57B as I have one spare I want to do it with the canopy open and the Airfix one is that bad I could never use it unless it was closed. I've seen a few photos of the Airfix G built up on various forums and one thing that stands out to me is the LLTV housing under the nose, it's never looked right, it just doesn't have the right bulk of the real thing. So I scald up ahead on photo and surprise, surprise; Airfix got it wrong!!! It is as you will see from the following photo 2 foot too narrow! So I've let in a 1/2 inch plastic card strip. This now means the window will be too short as well. So at some point I'm going to have to decide, do I make a new window or fit the red FOD cover? I will decide that later. Deconstruction time! I've now turned my attention to the office, As I'm using the forward fuselage from the CA kit I'm also using the resin tub from the kit. The tub as it is, is a good representation of a B.57B cockpit, but the G is a quite different particularly in the back, I got the Edward PE set to help with the build and although the main instrument panels are quite good some of the other detail for things like the side consoles are wrong so I'll only be using the parts that are right for the G. I'm keeping the side consoles in the front as they are, there is no significant differences between the B and G in this area. The back is where the mod's are required. Out as to come the all the equipment on the starboard side this is the controls associated with the Shoran bombing computer, also for the chop is the Navigators fold down table. After the work as been done, I've also removed the vertical part on the tub, as the side consoles are horizontal all the way to the fuselage sides, this is the only thing Airfix got right with there cockpit tub! For some strange reason there is no detail supplies in the Edward set for the right hand side of the rear cockpit apart from one black box that is not appropriate to the G or if it is it must have been added after 1970 when my copy of the flight manual was updated! I have built up the side with card I will copy the accurate detail from my B.57G flight manual. Another problem with the Edward set is the detail supplied for the rear console on the port side looks more like the set up for the B.57E or C, so I'm keeping it as supplied my CA with the only modification being the removal of the special weapon controls. John 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canberra kid Posted March 20, 2013 Author Share Posted March 20, 2013 Aside from the problems with the nose another big problem with the Airfix B.57 and I must say in common with all other kits of the American Canberra with the part exception of the Classic Airframes and the very old Revell kit's is the lack of acknowledgment of the fact that the B.57 has guns in the wing and these guns need servicing. I can understand to a point Airfix wanting to use as many common parts of the Canberra kits as possible but the guns and the mod's to the wings are a key aspect of the B.57, now, another thing to say in mitigation for Airfix is that there is a huge gap in the published information on this part of the American Canberra, this could be why CA and Revel only got it partially correct. So, to this end I set about gathering the necessary information using my collection of USAF and Martin produced manuals. There are two basic types of B.57 wing, the 8x.50 Cal wing applicable to the B.57A/RB.57A's and early B's&C's and the 4x20mm cannon wing applicable to late B's C's E's and G's. There are also quite marked differences in the skin panels covering the wing. Another problem with the Airfix wing is they have got the position of the under wing pylons very wrong! The following photo shows the Airfix slots and the holes I've drilled for the correct position. So after all this work, my finished 20'mm cannon wing. John 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nik W Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 This is one I've been following over on the Canberra SIG site, glad to see it here though as well, means I can get a daily dose of Canberra here too! I've got a B-57 from Airfix tucked away in the stash, but looking at the amount of work you're having to put in to get things right with that front end, I may re-think my plans to do it as a 'G' - did CA do a G model B-57? I know their kits are a good deal more work, but the their B-57s are still relatively easy to track down from what I can tell, so that might be one option. Failing that though I'll just use this as a reference for the surgery that my Airfix one is going to need! Keep up the good work! Nik 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robvulcan Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 Great read and work Canberra kid. I do live canberras this tempts me to start my 48th airfix b2. I see the other day in hobbycraft looks like revell have repopped the old matchbox pr9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canberra kid Posted March 20, 2013 Author Share Posted March 20, 2013 This is one I've been following over on the Canberra SIG site, glad to see it here though as well, means I can get a daily dose of Canberra here too! I've got a B-57 from Airfix tucked away in the stash, but looking at the amount of work you're having to put in to get things right with that front end, I may re-think my plans to do it as a 'G' - did CA do a G model B-57? I know their kits are a good deal more work, but the their B-57s are still relatively easy to track down from what I can tell, so that might be one option. Failing that though I'll just use this as a reference for the surgery that my Airfix one is going to need! Hi Nik Unfortunately CA only did the B, the only way so far to do a 1/48 G would be the way I'm going or pure Airfix. The CA kit needs far less corrective work than the Airfix kit but it's still not 100% by a long way. Rob, The B.2 is a much easier prospect than the B.57 you go for it! John Keep up the good work! Nik Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canberra kid Posted March 20, 2013 Author Share Posted March 20, 2013 Back to the wings, one other thing that Airfix and Italeri in there 1/72 Canberra's have got wrong concerns the gas vent for the engine starter cartridge. One the two kits they have moulded two vents as it is with the Canberra's using the Avon Mk.1 in fact the J.65 should just have one. On the plus side Airfix have done a very respectable job with the generator intakes. John 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamS Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 Oh yes - look forward to this one....... Graham Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nik W Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 Hi Nik Unfortunately CA only did the B, the only way so far to do a 1/48 G would be the way I'm going or pure Airfix. The CA kit needs far less corrective work than the Airfix kit but it's still not 100% by a long way. John Hi John, That's a sod about them not doing a G - was certain I'd seen one somewhere, but it looks like I've completely made it up! Still, with your thread here to follow and all the info on the SIG site, I should hopefully be able to knock something together that looks a bit more like a G than the Airfix kit straight out of the box! Cheers! Nik Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robvulcan Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 Indeed I know little if the b57 only I made one airfix one as a kid but was always disappointed as I wanted a raf machine. Now I'm older I appreciate the b57 for what it is in its own right Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canberra kid Posted March 20, 2013 Author Share Posted March 20, 2013 Hi John, That's a sod about them not doing a G - was certain I'd seen one somewhere, but it looks like I've completely made it up! Still, with your thread here to follow and all the info on the SIG site, I should hopefully be able to knock something together that looks a bit more like a G than the Airfix kit straight out of the box! Cheers! Nik Nik, I can't recall ever seeing anything other than the B.57B from CA if there was a G it passed me by. If you don't want to have the canopy open, then if you follow the method covered in the other Airfix B.57 build on the SIG site it should, with the other mods look a lot more like. Indeed I know little if the b57 only I made one airfix one as a kid but was always disappointed as I wanted a raf machine. Now I'm older I appreciate the b57 for what it is in its own right Rob, it took me a long time to come around to the allure of the Martin Canberra, but now I have I must say it's become a big favourite of mine it will never beat the PR.7 in my affections but I'm very much enjoying the journey of discovery that is the Martin B.57 Canberra! John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canberra kid Posted March 20, 2013 Author Share Posted March 20, 2013 In common with all 1/48 Airfix Canberra's the tail planes in the kit are totally devoid of detail so I have now scribed the detail and added the Stabilizer Flow Regenerators. The What? I hear you say, yes the SFR's I had no idea these things existed until recently. They appear to be something like vortex generators. The bad news is now I've found them I had a look around and I think they my be applicable to all B.57's! John 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canberra kid Posted March 21, 2013 Author Share Posted March 21, 2013 I've been working on the office, I've added the hand held fire extinguisher made from a bit of sprue and positioned on the rear bulkhead, also the SO's map case. I'll be fitting the first aid kit to the rear port console later. I've also copied the circuit breaker panel from the illustration in the Flight Manuel, this is one of the things missing from the Edward set. This goes on the rear starboard side wall. The rudder peddles have been modified using the Airfix part and the PE part from the Edward set. John 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canberra kid Posted March 22, 2013 Author Share Posted March 22, 2013 With the wings now to all intent and purposes finished I thought I'd get the fuselage moved on a bit. The CA nose has been mated to the Airfix fuselage with out too much problem. John 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canberra kid Posted March 22, 2013 Author Share Posted March 22, 2013 Another issue with the Airfix Canberra's concerns the tail planes, on the Canberra the leading edge on the tail planes is a strait line up to the fuselage, as in the above drawing. On the kit there is a kink in the leading edge. If you wish to use them there are some very good replacement parts out there like Two Mikes set to correct this, but being a tight-fisted Yorkshire man I've found a way using the kit parts. What I do is cut about 3mm from the tab on the kit part, this enables you to slide the tail planes back thus created a step that if you cut back will straiten up the leading edge. After a bit of trimming and re profiling, you end up with a tail plane that looks as it should. Another thing that Airfix and as far as I can remember all other Canberra kit manufacturers have done is mould a elevator shaped stub fairing on the fuselage, this dose not exist on any Canberra and should be removed. And John 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonC Posted March 22, 2013 Share Posted March 22, 2013 Looks like it's going well; very neat work. What exactly did you use for those regenerators? Looks like copper strip of some sort? cheers, Jason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fritag Posted March 22, 2013 Share Posted March 22, 2013 Wow, hate to admit it but I know precious little about the Canberra save that it's an iconic British design, a gorgeous aircraft, looks like it must have been a joy to fly and a I know a few blokes who flew it. But I love this thread and I'm learning loads! Can't be bad. Thanks John Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robvulcan Posted March 23, 2013 Share Posted March 23, 2013 Well your doing some dn amazing stuff here canberrakid I remember a few years back stumbling accross some of your builds which were very nice and obviously memorable too. So I'm keen to see this and look at what goes into creating a stunner of a build. I like what you have done with the map and fire extinguisher Cheers rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canberra kid Posted March 23, 2013 Author Share Posted March 23, 2013 Looks like it's going well; very neat work. What exactly did you use for those regenerators? Looks like copper strip of some sort? cheers, Jason Thanks Jason, The regenerators are made from fine plastic rod, in reality they should be 'L' shaped as per the drawing, but I can't find anything that looks in scale so this will have to do. Ones it's painted I don't think it will matter that much. Wow, hate to admit it but I know precious little about the Canberra save that it's an iconic British design, a gorgeous aircraft, looks like it must have been a joy to fly and a I know a few blokes who flew it. But I love this thread and I'm learning loads! Can't be bad. Thanks John Steve Shame on you Steve! if you want to delve in to the Canberra more take a look at my site, http://ipmscanberrasig.webs.com/ Well your doing some dn amazing stuff here canberrakid I remember a few years back stumbling accross some of your builds which were very nice and obviously memorable too. So I'm keen to see this and look at what goes into creating a stunner of a build. I like what you have done with the map and fire extinguisher Cheers rob Thanks Rob, this build thread as it is at the moment an edited version of the full build I'm doing on my site http://ipmscanberrasig.webs.com/apps/forums/topics/show/8621422-1-48-airfix-classic-airframes-13-bs-b-57g- when I catch up I'll be posting the two at the same time. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canberra kid Posted March 23, 2013 Author Share Posted March 23, 2013 Now the fuselage is together my first job will be to correct the two aerial fairings the domed shaped lumps aft of the bomb bay. Airfix is right to include two of these, for a latter B.57B but again for reasons best known to Airfix they have moulded them as different sizes when they should be the same. The one on the underside is the more correct of the two. Unfortunately for any one wishing to build a B.57G the bottom one needs to be removed this will leave you with the one on the top which you need to keep, but of the two it is this one that is the wrong size! To get around this problem I will be removing the Airfix one and replacing it with one from the CA kit. I've also filled in the three fictitious fuel filler points on the starboard side of the fuselage as well as the front one of the three on the port side as the B.57's only have two. As you can see the major fuselage components are now together. I'll need to do some filling and re engraving of the panel lines, as with the wings the fuselage of the B.57 were skinned in a different way to her British sister. The first phase of filling is done, I'm quite pleased with the way it's looking the joint between the Airfix and CA fuselage appears to be quite good John 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robvulcan Posted March 23, 2013 Share Posted March 23, 2013 excellent work. can i ask your advice what is the best way to fill panel lines as on the WIP section im converting two dragon vulcans to a b1 and b2 i have many little lines to get rid of only to rescribe a few new ones. i have milliput but not sure this is really the best way. i need to thin the wings out so i thought maybe just sand them off. but i have heard about stretched sprue and i dont really know what that is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canberra kid Posted March 23, 2013 Author Share Posted March 23, 2013 (edited) excellent work. can i ask your advice what is the best way to fill panel lines as on the WIP section im converting two dragon vulcans to a b1 and b2 i have many little lines to get rid of only to rescribe a few new ones. i have milliput but not sure this is really the best way. i need to thin the wings out so i thought maybe just sand them off. but i have heard about stretched sprue and i dont really know what that is. Hi Rob I've never had much success using milliput for that type of filling as when I've used it I've found it tends to fall out! plus it is harder than the plastic so when you rub it down you could risk removing more plastic than milliput. As for stretched sprue, this is the process of heating a piece of the plastic frame that the kit parts come on. You warm the plastic up over a gas ring or candle/ lighter until it goes soft but try not to set it on fire! Then holding it with each hand slowly drawing it apart, by controlling the speed at which you pull you can alter the thickness of the sprue. It's not easy to start with but ones you get the knack it's a very useful technique. To use it for filling you lay the stretched sprue into the panel line run liquid poly over it then when dried rub it down. I hope that helps? John Edited March 23, 2013 by canberra kid 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robvulcan Posted March 23, 2013 Share Posted March 23, 2013 Ah so that's how you do it. I know what you mean about milliput once it fully cured personally I love the stuff but I tend to wet smooth it or wet sand it about 2 hours into the 3 hour dry time. I'm just looking for possible easy solutions. Having only ever used plasto before milliput I've not tried many fillers, plasto is truly horrific nasty horrid stuff to use on my experience it melts plastic destroys your fingers drys and crumbles and probably the reason my victor stalked for 5 years as I hate sanding the chalky stuff. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canberra kid Posted March 23, 2013 Author Share Posted March 23, 2013 I'm going to address another of Airfix's fictions, this time the ridge that runs along the top edge of the bomb bay. This is quite correct for the British Canberra's, but it is not applicable to the B.57, so off it comes! More work on the fuselage, working from my manuals to check accuracy, I've engraved the doors that are associated with the operation of the rotary bomb bay. Also the hatches on the crown of the fuselage that allow access to the fuel cells for maintenance and removal and reinstalling. John 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robvulcan Posted March 23, 2013 Share Posted March 23, 2013 Beautifull work how do you go about marking out accurately and taking account if the curvature I'd love to get my hand on aircraft manuals for certain aircraft Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snapper_city Posted March 23, 2013 Share Posted March 23, 2013 Watching, Learning, Loving.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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