The Joy of (Train) Sets

[cjhm]

Anyone else catch this?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b01q9vhy

Only saw it was on 5 mins before it started

Very enjoyable, didn't make out people with train sets \ model railways were that odd in my opinion ....

[cmatthewbacon]

I thought it was rather well done. A good mix of model railway history and social history plus some interesting current modellers. And I thought the tone was spot on - not taking the mickey, but giving real enthusiasm a voice. And there was some pretty darn good diorama building and weathering going on there as well. Full marks to Stephen Mangan for the tone of the narration as well.

This "Timeshift" slot on BBC4 seems to be made for me -- it's where "Jet: when Britain ruled the skies" turned up, and the one about British Sports Cars that was on a month or so ago. All the same idea -- a mix of history and modern enthusiasts.

Mind you, my Tivo decided to record all of them that have been on in the last month or so, and there's a pretty wide range of subjects, let's say!

bestest,

M.

[Tony C]

Agreed, thoroughly enjoyed the programme and both Basset-Lowke and Hornby seemed to have their fingers on the pulse, as it were!

One thing that did puzzle me was when Pete Waterman mentioned 4mm as a scale, what does that relate too?

[cmatthewbacon]

4mm to the foot, IIRC.... 1/76 scale, or one or other of OO and HO...

bestest,

M.

[Bear13583]

i believe 4mm is '00'

[Tony C]

Cheers both, any clue as to what would 1/48 scale relate to is rail scale?

[Will Vale]

That'd be US O scale.

[Mal]

4mm is a catch all to describe any model railway item built in 1/76 scale. The description OO is used to describe a model that is built to a scale of 1/76 using a model track gauge of 16.5mm (gauge being the distance between the rails).The problem with this is that actual standard track gauge when modelled in 1/76 scale is 18.83mm,this means any 00 model has wheels that are too close together,equating to a 12% error!

To produce more realistic models in 4mm two other standards have been developed which are largely the preserve of the kit and scratch builder they are EM which uses a track gauge of 18mm and P4 which uses the correct 18.83mm gauge.

Of course this only relates to standard gauge track,narrow and broad gauge are different again,to reiterate 00 is a track standard not a scale.

H0 or 3.5 mm to the foot is the main Continental and American scale/standard using a scale of 1/87,with a track gauge of 16.5mm the correct gauge for 1/87 scale track.

I just build in EM

Malcolm

[heloman1]

My father bought my brother and I a Triang train set for christmas the one year, we actually wanted a Honby set. My uncle donated the board and some timber for a baseboard which as my father was non to handy with a saw etc, stood in the shed for a long while. So it got played with one the dining room floor for a while and then the dining table. I think the constant laying out and breaking down didn't help but we added to the set each week via out combined pocket monies. Eventually we had the layout on a shelf in our bedromm but our mother put a stop to the sides of the wardrobe being cut to make a tunnel I wonde rwhy?

When we left home everything got packed into a box and stashed in the roofspace, needles to say it didn't fair too well but eventually my nephew inherited it all.

I've come full circle, a couple of years back I helped a friend build a modest layouir for his grandson, you don't have to belive that! The gramson was not too enthusiatic and the layout sat for a while. My freind has subsequenly moved down to our village from Johannesburg and yes we have pland to build another layout. A modest 11 x 6 foot, with two through stations adapted from actual station layouts in the GWR region along with a good sized fiddle yard.

As my friend is into electronics he will sort out the automotion and blocking of the track system. I being an ex modelmaker wil concentrate on the scenery. But back to Triang, I was given an 0-6-0 GWR Pannier tank loco a while bacj but the level of detail is quite basic. So I'm going to add new handrails, step irons, the vacuum and heating pipes, the braking rods etc. I'll take a couple of pics of progress so far. All this in between my helicopter build threads.

Colin

[HOUSTON]

Very nice.

[snapper_city]

Cool. I'll watch this later.

[Seahawk]

Saw it and though it was well done. Nice that the tone wasn't patronising or sneering. The business acumen of Bassett-Lowke and Frank Hornby seemed most impressive. The programme seemed to recall simpler, more innocent times: do children still wave to trains?

Also very good was the 2-part series called something like "The Golden Age of Steam Railways" compiled mainly from cine footage of the early days of the railway preservation movement and narrated by Jenny Agutter (who else?). The first covered narrow gauge railways and the second standard gauge. Again a more innocent time, untroubled by the heavy hands of Health and Safety, indemnity insurance, etc, etc.

[AndyC]

Nice to see the 3-rail Hornby Dublo, which me and my Dad used to have in the loft before going 2-rail as a kid. I saw a working Dublo layout at an exhibition a coup,e of years ago and suddenly remembered the smell of those Dublo trains as they ran - nothing smells like them. Fab stuff.

[mcdonnell]

Hello,Friends - I dearly love Aviation and I love Railways and Model Railways too.And I'm proud of it!! Hornby Dublo,Triang etc. - Pure nostalgia.Pure innocent fun.Thank goodness for such great interests.All the best,Paul.

[Bigglesof266]

One thing that did puzzle me was when Pete Waterman mentioned 4mm as a scale, what does that relate too?

Hi Tony C

1/76, OO gauge and 4mm infer different things in the model railway world vernacular.

Use of the term "4mm" refers to 4mm to the foot. When used in model rail vernacular to distinguish it from OO gauge or 1/76 scale, it refers to "true 1/76 scale consistent throughout the layout". There is no currently available RTR 4mm scale. Everything 4mm has to be kit/hand built by the owner/operator from track through locos and rolling stock to fit 4mm track. It is a true scale. Whilst we'd all wish for that, because of the unavailability of 4mm in RTR and long standing establishment of OO gauge with Hornby and Bachmann Branchline as de rigeur, instead it enjoys a small, purist following only.

Why the discrimination?

In an ideal world, OO gauge as it is wouldn't exist. In the pragmatic one in which we live, it predominates British outline MR as by far the most prolific and popular scale.

OO gauge (pronounced, double "O") isn't a true scale. OO gauge came about long ago as a compromise. Brevity deters the lengthier explanation as to why here. The models are 1/76, with their frames and chassis adapted to run on 1/87 scale width track. 1/87 is HO scale used in most of the world outside the UK where both track width and models including chassis are 1/87 scale. In RTR track there are different types, and what is referred to as SBG (radii) aka OO gauge isn't scale either. i.e. inaccurate sleeper spacing, rail height, geometry, etc.

1/76 generally is not a term used in MR. It is however, the same scale of 4mm, but "4mm" is the term used preferably to discern true 1/76 throughout from "OO gauge" because 1/76 is coincidently overall approximate scale of "OO gauge" items not adapted to fit the 1/87 "OO gauge" track spacing of HO gauge per se. e.g. Vehicles, buildings, figurines. In model rail's heyday of the 1960's when most households with children had at least one Tri-ang Trains electric train set sometime during that decade, typical ancillary kit products from Airfix frequently came annotated HO/OO gauge on the box rather than either 1/87, 1/76 or 1/72 including toy soldier and civilian figure sets usually actually modelled in 1/72 scale.

[Tony C]

Thanks for that and while I think I understand, I'll try tomorrow reading it again, when I'm alcohol free

[Bigglesof266]

Cheers both, any clue as to what would 1/48 scale relate to is rail scale?

In Model Rail, "O" gauge is the closest at a scale of 1/43. There is no 1/48 TMK. AFAIK, "O gauge" is true to scale as no compromises were necessary due to the larger size capable of accomodating electric motors of the era when it came about. In my much older brothers' day, tinplate clockwork "O gauge" was it. Back then, train set track wasn't to scale per se, and track sleepers as such were minimal. Today, "O gauge", which is what Pete Waterman runs, is just a beautiful if expensive and impractical scale for an average home layout unless similarly wealthy. Cost and space are prohibitive for rank and file budget railway modellers.

[Bigglesof266]

do children still wave to trains?

No. As regrettably a truth as it is negative, today's generational concept of peer impressing 'cool' is to throw rocks at them anywhere an overhead pedestrian bridge isn't enclosed with a mesh cage, or 'tag' them with a spray paint can given half an opportunity. How did society degenerate to this from a relative childhood innocence of 'copping loco numbers' and Ian Allan Club code of behaviour?

OK, we kids weren't angels completely absent of minor mischief then either, although comparitively from the antics we got up to, one would be completely exonerated in believing it so.

That world has changed, and as much as change is inevitible, in so many ways it might be argued, not for the better..