stevehnz Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 I think an Airfix Beaufighter in either 1/72 or 1/48 scale, preferably the former, of their later quality & prices that would undercut both Hasegawa & Tamiya by plenty, would blow the eastern brands out of the water, in fact just like the Beaufighter used to do. Steve 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wez Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 (edited) I hate to be the Bringer of Cold Water, but if I were Airfix, I'd be looking at the Hasegawa and Tamiya Beaufighters...and do something else. My own picks would be a 1/48 Spitfire XIV, and a 1/350 World War I battlecruiser. Go where the competition isn't. The current Airfix Beaufighter has been trotted out by them time and time again, therefore Airfix must think there's a market for it. Secondly, given the statement in GregB's recent report that another kit of the same subject isn't a bar to Airfix considering a subject gives me hope. The fact that Airfix are replacing subjects in their line with new kits regardless of competition (Lancaster, Fw-190, P-51D etc) is another cause for hope. Finally, its been said time and time again, Hasegawa's and Tamiya's Beaufighters don't make money for Airfix! I'm confident we'll see a new Beaufighter from Airfix, if not next year in the coming years. Given the silly prices of Hasegawa kits, you could probably buy 2 or 3 Airfix kits for the same money. Given their continuing rise in quality that's good enough for me and I'd suggest the majority of the market! Wez (who would also like to see a Spitfire XIV and a WW.I battlecruiser - maybe HMS Tiger ) Edited September 3, 2013 by Wez 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keefr22 Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 I hate to be the Bringer of Cold Water, but if I were Airfix, I'd be looking at the Hasegawa and Tamiya Beaufighters...and do something else. My own picks would be a 1/48 Spitfire XIV, Go where the competition isn't. As we are frequently informed by 'those in the know', we forumites make up but a tiny portion of the kit market with the vast majority caring little of the things that may concern us - therefore the competition is already there for the XIV in the shape of the Academy kit. So your argument also holds good for that model.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 I hate to be the Bringer of Cold Water, but if I were Airfix, I'd be looking at the Hasegawa and Tamiya Beaufighters...and do something else. What, such as a 1/48 Blenheim? Can't believe no one has mentioned a Blenheim yet... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaddy Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 I hate to be the Bringer of Cold Water, but if I were Airfix, I'd be looking at the Hasegawa and Tamiya Beaufighters...and do something else. My own picks would be a 1/48 Spitfire XIV, and a 1/350 World War I battlecruiser. Go where the competition isn't. We go down this road time and again. The fact that another manufacturer markets a particular model does not make any money for Airfix. If Airfix adopted that stance they would never market any of the "popular" subjects. Two examples would be the Revell Lancaster BI/III and the Dambuster. According to your argument Airfix would never produce either of those because Revell already does. The same is true many more subjects by Tamiya, Revell and Hasegawa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fea Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 Ayup All... I can't believe that Airfix have wasted a shedload of money in bringing us a 48th Javelin, much as I love the subject. What WAS always being talked about over the show table, was that a 72nd Jav re-issue was wanted, and would have been bought in shedloads had it been done. But no, its been kept from us for the Frog clones to take its place as and when. And I haven't seen many of those on tables either. Then people got to openly 'Dreaming' of a 48th, and somehow, for some inexplicable reason, Airfix took it that it WAS a 48th Javelin that was wanted and has made a Bugger ! Given the excellent jobs done of the 'Bankers' (spit, Hurri, 109 etc) so far, how the hell we didn't get a new 72nd Javelin is beyond me. (although I'm sure those 'In the know' will tell us) I think the money spent on a large Javelin would maybe have paid for another TWO re-tools, maybe of the Javelin AND Beaufighter, which also seems to be an Aircraft much in peoples minds at the moment. Certainly, every time i put THIS on the table, it always exacted the same comment. 'When is Airfix gonna re-release it ?' But NOT in 48th. I'm sure it'll be amazing to see such a large version of this on a table, but in the end, my experience was a desire from folks for the 72nd. I can't see Little Johnny getting many of these at Xmas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mackem01 Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 How about some early British helicopters in 48th, eg: Sycamore, Belvedere? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 How about a 1/72 Boston you can actually build.....Or a 1/72 Beaufighter you can actually afford? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbit Leader Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 Ayup All... I can't believe that Airfix have wasted a shedload of money in bringing us a 48th Javelin, much as I love the subject. What WAS always being talked about over the show table, was that a 72nd Jav re-issue was wanted, and would have been bought in shedloads had it been done. But no, its been kept from us for the Frog clones to take its place as and when. And I haven't seen many of those on tables either. Then people got to openly 'Dreaming' of a 48th, and somehow, for some inexplicable reason, Airfix took it that it WAS a 48th Javelin that was wanted and has made a Bugger ! Given the excellent jobs done of the 'Bankers' (spit, Hurri, 109 etc) so far, how the hell we didn't get a new 72nd Javelin is beyond me. (although I'm sure those 'In the know' will tell us) I think the money spent on a large Javelin would maybe have paid for another TWO re-tools, maybe of the Javelin AND Beaufighter, which also seems to be an Aircraft much in peoples minds at the moment. Certainly, every time i put THIS on the table, it always exacted the same comment. 'When is Airfix gonna re-release it ?' But NOT in 48th. I'm sure it'll be amazing to see such a large version of this on a table, but in the end, my experience was a desire from folks for the 72nd. I can't see Little Johnny getting many of these at Xmas. Although, I'm excited about the 1/48 Javelin, I must agree with Fea that it's probably a liitle too big for my slowly growing collection. I am still not sure if I will ever get one of these, however would have certainly pre-ordered one (or two) had it been released in 1/72 scale. Then again, perhaps there is still some hope as the 48 scale Lightning has been round for a few years and will soon be joined by its younger 72nd scale brother. The Spitfire XIX is also available in both scales. Maybe there are plans for smaller Javelins & Sea Vixens in 2014-15. Cheers .. Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XV107 Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 I tend to agree that the 48th might be a bit large, but I may find myself buying one to complement the Sea Vixen (although since that's cheaper than the Javelin, I treated myself to more than one of those). I'd have thought that a Spitfire XIV in 48th would be a decent addition - in time for the 70th anniversary of it entering squadron service, if memory serves. It's a Spit, the only obvious competition is Academy (or the Hobbycraft kit...) and there's an anniversary to link it to. It does seem rather odd - but I'm not complaining, as a photo of the pile of boxes in my stash of these kits would show - that we have a Spitfire XII, 22/24 and a Seafire XVII but not the most common and arguably most-impressive of the Griffon engined wartime Spitfires. Personally - and I know there are good commercial reasons why they wouldn't necessarily want to do this - I'd be entirely content to see Airfix doing new tools of the Battle, Defiant, Blenheim, Beaufighter and Tempest in both 48th and 72nd (after the 48th Spit XIV) between now and the 100th anniversary of the RAF (asking for new tool Hampdens, Wellingtons, Stirlings and Halifaxes might look a little greedy). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HMSLion Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 To be honest, I have no idea why Airfix chose to do a Sea Vixen or Javelin in 1/48. Prop aircraft do well in that scale, but it's honestly too large for jets. Yes, there's an overall trend to larger kits, but I think people forget the question of where you put the blasted things once you build them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Headroom Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 A high back Spit XIV in 1/48 must be a banker (for 2014?) as they are 90% there with the XIX. Lets face it a Spit XIV is nearly as brutal looking as a Beaufighter...... Trevor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keefr22 Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 To be honest, I have no idea why Airfix chose to do a Sea Vixen or Javelin in 1/48. Prop aircraft do well in that scale, but it's honestly too large for jets. Yes, there's an overall trend to larger kits, but I think people forget the question of where you put the blasted things once you build them. I agree, which led to me selling off almost all my 1/48th jets earlier this year. So I have no idea why I have a Javelin on pre-order...!! My main problem with Airfix doing things like the marvellous Sea Vixen (& hopefully to be equally marvellous Javelin) in 48th is that they then either take 20 or more years (Lightning) or never (Seafire 47) to scale down their best efforts to date to 1/72nd scale. As they've done all the work it can't be that difficult to do. Can it? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keefr22 Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 Personally - and I know there are good commercial reasons why they wouldn't necessarily want to do this - I'd be entirely content to see Airfix doing new tools of the Battle, Defiant, Blenheim, Beaufighter and Tempest in both 48th and 72nd (after the 48th Spit XIV) between now and the 100th anniversary of the RAF That makes two of us at least!! (asking for new tool Hampdens, Wellingtons, Stirlings and Halifaxes might look a little greedy). No harm in being greedy now & then - let's ask for them anyway! And a good new tool Sunderland (don't mention that Italeri thing!) wouldn't go amiss either!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rafwaffe Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 What about a new tool halifax III in 1/72? Surely the old kit is due for replacement... Oh and ill second that beaufighter! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff_B Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 What about a new tool halifax III in 1/72? Surely the old kit is due for replacement... Oh and ill second that beaufighter! Yeap its overdue but i think Revells recent kit may have put any plans back a bit in case Revell then announced a radial version whilst Airfix started to develop a new kit. Somebody was hinting that Revell were looking to address some of the shape issues with the recent kit, so if thats true then i suspect Airfix will focus on other retools or new kits until they are ready to address replacing their Halifax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enzo the Magnificent Posted September 4, 2013 Author Share Posted September 4, 2013 My main problem with Airfix doing things like the marvellous Sea Vixen (& hopefully to be equally marvellous Javelin) in 48th is that they then either take 20 or more years (Lightning) or never (Seafire 47) to scale down their best efforts to date to 1/72nd scale. As they've done all the work it can't be that difficult to do. Can it? That period you have mentioned was when Airfix was in the doldrums with parent companies which didn't seem to care. These days, Hornby obviously does care and their release schedule shows that they are being quite aggressive. I'd say we will have 1/72 versions of the Sea Vixen and Javelin sooner rather than later. However... you need to look at Airfix's current short-term strategy, which is to replace old tools of guaranteed sellers in 1/72. They have never done Sea Vixens or Javelins before so, although I think they will happen within the next five years, I think that Beaufighters and P-47s will be here first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JagRigger Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 How about the aircraft the Air Training Corps use ? Boxed set of Vigilant, Viking and Tutor ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SleeperService Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 My main problem with Airfix doing things like the marvellous Sea Vixen (& hopefully to be equally marvellous Javelin) in 48th is that they then either take 20 or more years (Lightning) or never (Seafire 47) to scale down their best efforts to date to 1/72nd scale. As they've done all the work it can't be that difficult to do. Can it? Yes but this is not that Airfix, now it is Hornby. A great deal else has changed in production methods, and the new team are getting things togeather. I think (hope?) the different (and wrong in different places) TSR 2 incident has been learnt from. Talking to the Airfix people at several shows suggests that they are looking at each range as a separate thing and not just transferring 72nd scale items into 48th for example. For Airfix I suspect the smaller 48th kits are seen as a transition for beginners on the way to the larger and more expensive kits. They are a step in a progression all the new audience will follow. Everytime they build something and enjoy it they'll want to do it again. Some of the old mould offerings may been seen as booby traps, not because of accuracy but because they were hard to assemble well, somebody who got one of these as an early kit will disappear from the hobby. Ease of build get Airfix the cake, accuracy gets the extra icing from us 'forumites' TM keefr22 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keefr22 Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 That period you have mentioned was when Airfix was in the doldrums with parent companies which didn't seem to care. These days, Hornby obviously does care and their release schedule shows that they are being quite aggressive. I'd say we will have 1/72 versions of the Sea Vixen and Javelin sooner rather than later. However... you need to look at Airfix's current short-term strategy, which is to replace old tools of guaranteed sellers in 1/72. They have never done Sea Vixens or Javelins before so, although I think they will happen within the next five years, I think that Beaufighters and P-47s will be here first. Good points. However, Airfix wasn't in the doldrums for a number of years until after they first released the Lightning - they had plenty of time to have done the deed before the ill winds caught up with them. And they still haven't announced new tool 1/72 small tank versions of the Frightning either...!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denford Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 For Airfix I suspect the smaller 48th kits are seen as a transition for beginners on the way to the larger and more expensive kits. Remember too 1/48 is the preferred scale in some countries eg USA. There was a thread about this earlier this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbit Leader Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 Remember too 1/48 is the preferred scale in some countries eg USA. There was a thread about this earlier this year. Doubt they know what a Javelin is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denford Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 Doubt they know what a Javelin is? Agree absolutely: some years back there was a post from a modeller in Houston who bought an Airfix Sea Vixen because it 'looked interesting' or (something similar) even though he'd never heard of it! He wrote favourably (or favorably) so perhaps he'll buy a Javelin too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Procopius Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 Steady on! (I only build 1/72, however.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spence Posted September 5, 2013 Share Posted September 5, 2013 Doubt they know what a Javelin is? You're kidding me, right? It's not as though the Javelin is a one-off prototype is it? This aircraft was the mainstay of British air Defences for years, flying with many squadrons during that time - anyone with even a tiny interest in Cold War aviation will have heard of it! So here we go again, the naysayers offering up reasons why Airfix should have chosen this that or the other and feeling that because a particular kit has not be created/reissued/planned, they are going to hell in a handcart. If that's what you think, then lets offer up a few counterpoints shall we... Firstly, do you really think that a company such as Hornby would have allowed the use of hundreds of thousands of pounds to create a kit, if they believed that that kit would not sell enough to repay the bill? Of course not. They will have done the sums, worked out the orders and interest in advance and then - and only then - signed the cheque. Secondly - the argument that reissuing the old and by Twenty-First Century standards, poor, 1/72 Javelin FAW.9 kit, would make Airfix more money than a new-tool kit manufactured using cutting-edge ideas and techniques, is utterly preposterous and I can't for the life of me understand why anyone would hold on to such an idea. The modelling world is littered with individuals who stand on platforms announcing that this, that or the other kit would sell by the thousands if it was reissued and that is simply not the case; those that do want it are in the minority and those that would, soon realise that their memory of these old dinosaurs is not quite what they remember and move on. And before anyone tries to argue me down, twenty years in the industry meeting thousands of modellers and having endless conversation has proved this time and time again. It's the wrong scale and thus a waste of money. Well that's a valid argument if you only ever build one scale I guess, but the argument that by not fitting in with a particular modeller's collection as a result is a thin reason at best - there are just as many modellers working in 1/48 as there are in 1/72, so the market is there. Of course the counter argument to this is the Airfix Nimrod; this was a kit that was on the list of most-wanted kits for years - especially amongst the 1/72 aficionados - and sales tanked, many of these kits staying on model shop shelves for months. Let's make it clear, the Airfix Javelin will be a major hit for this company. Once the kit hits the shelves and the pages of the world's magazines, websites and forums the air will crackle with excitement. Why? Because simply put, this is the best kit Airfix have ever created - outstripping the much-vaunted Spitfire 22 and Lightning along the way. When I built the 24th Mosquito I wondered how they would match it in terms of detail and moulding quality, but having seen the full-spec Javelin kit last night, I have to say that it is an entirely different class, detail, fit and features being simply astonishing. The naysayers will always rag a kit like this, but I do think that a sense of perspective needs to be brought into the debate. They need to remember that decisions are not made lightly when releases are decided upon and that when they are, they have already covered all bases to ensure that they are a success. The Airfix Javelin will be a success because of its incredible quality - and you can quote me on that! Spence 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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