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Hello everybody,

 

but there is another interesting source, and this is this Airbrush Beginner Course CD by Heinz Wagner, which I had bought a long time ago and have now looked again. Therein my friend Heinz is presenting his Test method for testing and determination of the sprayability of colors that is simple yet ingenious. speak_cool.gif

 

First, I did insert a M5 Stainless steel nut as a mixing aid into all Vallejo vials, as described in the video by Jens Kaup in Post #1697, which surely can not hurt. 

 

up067553.jpg

 

Then I did shake each vial for three minutes, eek.gif

 

up067554.jpg

 

as recommended on Heinz Wagner's CD, whereby I could hear the clacking of the nuts when shaking the Model Air colors, but not at the two Model Color colors (2nd row on the right) what suggests that they are thicker and therefore not sprayable at all, as indicated in the video, which is why a diluting with water 1:1 to 1:2 should take place.  up045518.gif

 

0uu9iA.jpg
Source: Airbrush Beginner Course CD (Heinz Wagner)

 

And now to his simple Test method, whereby holding the vial on the top of a ruler (30 cm),

 

up067556.jpg
Source: Airbrush Beginner Course CD (Heinz Wagner)

 

and let dropping a drop from that height. huh.gif

 

up067557.jpg
Source: Airbrush Beginner Course CD (Heinz Wagner)

 

And if the diameter of this color point is between 11 mm and 14 mm, the color should be sprayable in the opinion of the Airbrush Guru. up046118.gif

 

G406NC.jpg
Source: Airbrush Beginner Course CD (Heinz Wagner)

 

And then I tried that, cool.gif

 

up067559.jpg

 

first for the Model Air 71.033 (Yellow Ochre). But to my astonishment the diameter of the color point was < 10 mm. smiley215.gif

 

up067560.jpg

 

And since the tests with the next three Model Air colors have shown this surprising result too,  

 

up067561.jpg

 

then I started carefully to add a few drops of the Vallejo Thinner step by step (3, 6, 10, 15 drops), then did shake again for three minutes smiley_worship.gif and retested, but without getting drops > 10mm, which has disillusioned me pretty much.  up051928.gif

 

up067562.jpg

 

During dripping I also noticed that sometimes at first only a bubble comes out of the dropper and only then the color comes, and that the drops of paint on the paper have sometimes even contained air bubbles, which may possibly falsify the result. 

 

The following tests I have done on glossy paper, the first tests on the other hand on normal copy paper, because the absorbency of the paper could probably also have an influence on the diameter of the color points, I think, right? up047089.gif

 

up067563.jpg

 

After that I was stumped and a nervous wreck  up046565.gif and have communicated these results Heinz Wagner, in the hope that he has an explanation.  up040577.gif

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Hello friends,

 

since the results so far have not convinced me, I have become more courageous and have according to the advice of Jens Kaup topped up the vial with the Model Air 71.077 (Wood) with Vallejo Thinner. top.gif

 

Then I did shake again for 3 minutes and then carried out the test. And lo and behold, this time the color points were at least approx. 11 mm in diameter, whith what I can better warm to. up039822.gif

 

JhZtU7.jpg

 

As a result, his tip seems to be correct, especially as it meets the criterion of Heinz Wagner (> 11 mm), according to which this color should be sprayable indeed, what makes me smile.  yahoo.gif

 

BTW, my friend Heinz has not commented yet, but I suppose he might be surprised by this result, I guess. up040577.gif

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I do love the way you are so clinical Manfred. I saw something that said "about the consistency of chicken noodle soup" once and this probably explains why any airbrushing I have done has been so hit and miss. Thanks for showing that there are more rigorous ways to do things...

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Posted (edited)

It is a complicated test, in fact. You are right that the texture and absorbency of the paper will have a significant effect.

Your thorough testing has given good results. I am used to the advice that for sprayability, the paint should be the consistecy of milk, which I find unhelpful... whole milk, 2%, skimmed? Some milk is like water! I think I have tended to use paint that is too thick and clogs or slows down quickly.

I like the advice here, and I will try it next time. 😊

Edited by Mustermark

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Thanks Kirk and Mark for looking in on me again and for your kind comments. bow.gif

 

BTW, the same tip had a modeler at ARC Forums, who said that the paint needs to be at the consistency of milk to spray through the airbrush. speak_cool.gif

 

This might be an appropriate comparison, but what does that tell me when a Vallejo Model Air Color stands in front of me whose consistency I do not know? hmmm.gif

 

Unfortunately I do not have that milky feeling yet, and as one can see, even the experts' opinions are drastically different. analintruder.gif

 

Or another good tip: The best way to test is to put a small amount into the airbrush and try spraying it ... up045518.gif

 

Okay, but this would mean a tricky trial & error approach for me, because everybody knows how fast an Airbrush nozzle clogs when using too thick paint, which is not sprayable. And then one has to clean the gun before the next attempt ... smiley_worship.gif

 

That's why I first prefer a measurable test that somehow can communicate this feeling to me, especially now I want to use a new and better airbrush equipment. That's why I have to slowly approach ... top.gif

 

BTW, the test itself is very simple and not complicated, I think. up040577.gif

 

The proof of the pudding is in the eating ... hunger.gif 

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Hello everybody, 

 

still under the impression of the many colorful Easter eggs eier-faerben-smilies-0008.gif I 've grabbed the brush and started to mix the first ET colors. cool.gif

 

I started with the sprayable-thinned Vallejo Model Air 71.033 (ochre), which I wanted to darken a little with the help of the Vallejo Model Air 71.034 (sand brown).

 

qbLyYR.jpg

 

For this I have filled 4 drops of the MA 71.033 in a crown cork and placed it next to my test drop on the image, whereby this shade corresponds pretty well with the bright ET color tone in the lower part. up039822.gif

 

g0iCYk.jpg

 

Then I added a drop of the MA 71.034 to it and mixed it with the brush, what corresponds about a shade between MA 71.033-B-30 and B-40

 

MaIDOJ.jpg

 

whose test brushstroke I've put on the lower ET area, 

 

L9Dyik.jpg

 

and in front at the Nose cone that of pure color MA 71.033.

 

d4C6Kn.jpg

 

And already with this mixture, some of the shades can be quite well represented, I think.  up045518.gif

 

BAm8H3.jpg

 

And so I will now also test the shades of the other two colors MA 71.076 (skin color) and MA 71.077 (wood).  up040577.gif

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Very clinical Manfred and a good method, albeit I personally find the milk consistency measure to be better for me. When in the cup of the airbrush (i use pipettes) if its a milk consistency and gives an even coverage on the side of the cup without the film of paint breaking its just right. 

This is about the best way I can describe it, if its nice and even and the surface tension doesn't break the film of paint like in the image below then its good. 

112583788-grunge-vector-texture-of-spill

 

I generally go with this, even though its more touchy feely, I've found it a better all round when working with a variety of paints, e.g. i don't know if your drop method would work with other paints, Tamiya paints have a very good pigment and basically sprays well in a wide range of thinning ratios and air pressures, their lacquer paints in particular I found are idiot proof, I've over and under thinned them, and sprayed at everything from 12-15 psi all the way up to 45-50psi, and it comes out just fine.

 

On another note, I would spray your colours onto a material that better represents what you will be painting, like if you plan to prime with grey, then spray the number of coats you plan to spray on the model onto a grey primed example, the shade of primer under your paint can make a difference especially when using such bright low coverage paints, depending on how many coats you plan to give it.  Brush painting will give you a slightly different look/shade. Looking forward to see the main booster painted, excellent work as always :) 

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Thanks Mark for your experience and helpful comment. bow.gif

 

As I know from Heinz Wagner, one can use his Drop Test Method for all kinds of colors to test and adjust their sprayability. speak_cool.gif

 

As for the color of the Primer, I can fully agree with you. That's why I've used the same white Vallejo primer for testing on my ET Dummies, coated with flour, which I will use later on the ET of the Shuttle stack too.  

 

up066914.jpg
Source: modellbaukompass.de

 

And therefore I will also test now the selected color shades on my ET dummy. up040577.gif

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27 minutes ago, roma847 said:

Thanks Mark for your experience and helpful comment. bow.gif

 

As I know from Heinz Wagner, one can use his Drop Test Method for all kinds of colors to test and adjust their sprayability. speak_cool.gif

 

As for the color of the Primer, I can fully agree with you. That's why I've used the same white Vallejo primer for testing on my ET Dummies, coated with flour, which I will use later on the ET of the Shuttle stack too.  

 

up066914.jpg
Source: modellbaukompass.de

 

And therefore I will also test now the selected color shades on my ET dummy. up040577.gif

Cool I thought you would be doing so :)  being so thorough in everything else :)  Just from the example pictures of the paints brushed out on the strips of what looked like paper I was worried ;) :) Excellent stuff as always

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Thanks Mark for your nice support, it's all okay. :worthy:

 

Hello everybody,

 

and so the mixing went on. top.gif

 

As previously announced, I first tried mixing the lighter color shade, namely from the two colors MA 71.076 (Skin Tone) and MA 71.077 (Wood)

 

heFT6e.jpg

 

whereby I have dripped one drop of each color in the crown cap, which already run into each other here. huh.gif

 

zevOba.jpg

 

And so the mix of both colors looks like.

 

21a2Fm.jpg

 

And as one can see in the reference photo, the shade of the mixture (1:1) is almost perfectly hit right away. speak_cool.gif

 

UtCf4C.jpg

 

Then I also tried mixing the darker color shade of the IT for which now still the color MA 71.034 (Sand Brown) comes into play, which I've mixed together with the MA 71.077 (Wood) in several tests with different proportions MA 71.077: MA 71.034, whereby I've slowly felt my way, from 1:1, over 2:1 and 3:1, up to 4:1. huh.gif

 

poWDG3.jpg

 

Here is the comparison in the mixing ratio 3:1 to see, which already fits relatively well to the IT's color shade, whereby 2:1 looks similar. up045518.gif

 

pGeIXb.jpg

 

And here all previous color shades are to see once again. up039822.gif

 

rdcIWA.jpg

 

After comparing the Mix shades on paper now the comparison on the white primer on the Flour&Strip Texture of the ET Dummy is to be done, which will give yet the final indication of how well the shades actually fit the reference photo, whereon I'm very curious.  up040577.gif

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Hello friends,

 

here are the first pictures of the Mix color shades on the both floured and partly twice primed dummies with the five different Stripe patterns, cf. Reply  #1671
, whereby I have applied the colors not by airbrush, but with the brush. top.gif

 

In the foreground of the following color-tone comparisons stands my favored Pattern 2, consisting of single turns of 0,75 mm Tape (distance 0,5 mm), glued as a continuous spiral (Barber pole).

 

up066909.jpg

 

The three Mix color shades in the following picture correspond to the last preferred MA Mixtures

 

Mix-1 - MA 71.076 (Skin Tone) : MA 71.077 (Wood) - 1:1

 

Mix-2 - MA 71.033 (Ochre) : MA 71.034 (Sand Brown) - 4:1

 

Mix-3 - MA 71.077 (Wood) : MA 71.034 (Sand Brown) - 3:1

 

3iB94P.jpg

 

here again from a slant position. 

 

MpZv3a.jpg

 

And this is the comparison on the short dummy, which was both once and double floured, cf. Reply #1680

 

gL4vco.jpg

 

And this is the Mix-1 on the once-floured area. 
 
PDJs9c.jpg

 

These are the Mix color shades on the two dummies in a vertical arrangement, first on the big dummy, 

 

oGiW0T.jpg

 

0yuXYe.jpg

 

and here on the short dummy, where the simple flour state seems to me almost as sufficient.  

 

LfNB7e.jpg

 

6uLPRO.jpg

 

TQH9LQ.jpg

 

And finally still the comparison of the three Mix color shades with the reference photo, whereby the Mix-1 fits best to the brighter areas of the Closeouts.  speak_cool.gif 

 

IjxCe5.jpg

 

In contrast, in my opinion at the Mix-2 for the LH2 tank

 

gKQCBp.jpg

 

and even more so at the Mix-3 for the Intertank is missing a little bit of Orange

 

NspmAo.jpg

 

These two color shades came out much better on paper, 

 

up067707.jpg

 

wherefore I have still to modify their mixture by adding a bit more Orange.  up040577.gif

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Hello friends,
it must go on, and that's why Get to work! andiearbeit.gif 

 

For a change, I've went back again to the ET, on which still some things are to be removed, before it becomes serious with the final Flour coating. huh.gif

 

But first I had to fill some places on the glued seams of the two tank parts, for what I have used the white Quick-Putty of Simprop, which can be quite well processed and after about 30 minutes be sanded both dry and wet. speak_cool.gif

 

While I first used coarse and finer grinding sticks after drying the filler, the final sanding step was done wet with Tamiya Abrasive Sponge (2000), which therefor is suited outstandingly. top.gif

 

nGKbID.jpg

 

Then I have begun to remove the Press. Line and the Cable Tray on the LO2 Tank, which I did bit by bit with the Chisel cutter, which was quite tedious. smiley_worship.gif 

 

T2TEky.jpg

 

7XoXGd.jpg

 

Then the Press. Lines and the Cable tray on the LH2 Tank came under the chisel knife, whereby I've first cut off the Cable tray piece by piece and then the two Press. lines.

 

QJZi3b.jpg

 

VK9wBm.jpg

 

While remaining remnants can easily be scraped off with vertical standing chisel blade, cool.gif

 

Nf02Wv.jpg

 

the fine sanding followed again wet with the sanding sponge, after which nothing remains of remnants to see.  up045518.gif

 

s9xPBQ.jpg

 

The four Supports of the LO2 Feedline can remain in place because they are sitting in exactly the right place. It just lacks the front Support immediately behind the Intertank, which will be scratched.  up040577.gif

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Thanks Kirk and Rich for looking in on me again surreptitiously. :worthy:

 

Thanks Mark and stay cool - Haste makes waste! up040577.gif&key=327a20a361d18ad6d35cabf

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Hello everybody,

 

so everything would actually be prepared so far that I could start with the gluing of the continuous spiral (Barber pole) from the 0,75 mm wide tape strip, with which I wanted to simulate the SOFI Pattern, which is followed by the Flour coating as well as priming and airbrushing. cool.gif

 

But since I'm still not completely satisfied with the quality of the Flour Coating, I wanted to try a few things before yet. smiley215.gif Therefore, I will do another Flour coating attempt, for what I have first looked at the local flour varieties in the supermarket. 

 

And as I stood in front of the shelf with the many flour bags and was spoiled for choice, stood next to me an elderly woman, who somehow looked competent in terms of baking. And then I asked her briefly if she knew which flour would be especially fine-grained.  hmmm.gif

 

And her tip was Rice flour or Cornflour, whereupon I then searched for.  cant-believe-my-eyes-smiley-emoticon.gif Bur since faced with so many bags I haven't seen any Rice flour but only found the cornflour, a coworker could show me the rice flour.

 

At home I then made the comparison to my so far used wheat flour by Heimatsmühle (Type 405),

 

up066804.jpg

 

the sample of which can be seen on the right in the next picture, whose loose bulk is similar to the cornflour, with both varieties lumping a bit. rolleyes.gif In contrast, the Rice flour actually seems to be more fine-grained and trickles rather than lumping, which gives me hope for a better result in the Flour coating. speak_cool.gif

 

nO5rcZ.jpg

 

Then there was the unanswered question as to whether I should glue the Ice Ramps for the two Press. Lines  before or after the Flour coating, whereby I meanwhile tend to the first variant. cool.gif

 

But then it is necessary to mask the glued Ramps before Flour coating, which is why I tried the Maskol by Humbrol, whereby I was amazed and frustrated that the stuff in the jar was almost completely lumped, because it was probably already too old.   up043952.gif

 

Here one can see a few drops of the residual liquid on a Styrene plate and on a glued small piece of Evergreen profile.  

 

CYLbv9.jpg

 

After drying, one can easily peel off the rubbery skin. 

 

OLEWhy.jpg

 

Then it was time for the preparation of the new Flour coating test, for which I've used the now no longer needed Airfix Intertank, on which I've glued the 0,75 mm wide tape strip as a continuous spiral (Barber pole).  

 

2FAvrE.jpg

 

This time, I have dispensed with the 0,5 mm wide spacer strip and glued the strip by eye and pressed on each winding immediately a bit stronger, whereby I have even reduced the distance even slightly.  

 

wuQP8Q.jpg

 

This brought the strips even closer to the estimated Valley-to-Valley distance of approx. 1,3 mm. top.gif

 

For this complete gluing of the IT I needed about 1 h , which was certainly pure stress for my still sharp eagle eyes, smiley_worship.gif whereby I'm amazed at how evenly I have managed this.  speak_cool.gif

 

WXCJ4t.jpg

 

Here are two more shots in daylight. 

 

U95H5q.jpg

 

C4kEDR.jpg

 

Next to come are the 'masked' Ice Ramps. up040577.gif

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Hello everybody,

 

and now to the announced Ice Ramps from the Newware-Enhancement Kit (NW131), which I wanted to glue on before Flour coating and therefore had to mask, in order to protect them, for what I used Maskol. cool.gif

 

These are two of the Ramps (R23), 14 of which sit on the LH2 Tank. I've glued the left ramp directly onto the tapes with Pattex-CA, the right one directly onto the uncovered place, to see how far the ramps and their openings for the two GH2/GO2 Press. Lines will be covered by the flour coating. huh.gif

 

kCsj0y.jpg

 

Here are the two Press. Lines (2'' in reality), for which I'll use Nickel silver (Ø 0,35 mm).

 

0nvXjh.jpg

 

Afterwards, the ramps were masked with Maskol, whereby I hope that the masks can still be removed well after the Flour coating. top.gif

 

C4FUPZ.jpg

 

And so nothing stands in the way of Flour coating with Rice flour, on the result of which I am already curious. up040577.gif 

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Gluten-free modelling. This may catch on, although I expect it to be around 20% more expensive than the regular styrene sort and a little dry, so probably best to pour an extra beer or two... :winkgrin:

 

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Thank you Kirk, then let us toast. smiley177.gif

 

Cheers!

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Hello friends,

 

after the Flour coating with the Rice flour, I can now show the images too. cool.gif  

 

Here the Intertank Dummy already hangs in my tried and tested Flour chamber,  

 

id7xLi.jpg

 

and is waiting for the UHU glue spray mist,

 

gIromM.jpg

 

which has covered it here after some turns from all sides. top.gif

 

t8mZmF.jpg

 

And then followed the generous Flour coating with the rice flour by using a sieve,

 

0nSIml.jpg

 

whereby the flour was pressed smoothly between several times with the finger, which this time everything went much looser from the hand.  speak_cool.gif

 

4kulJg.jpg

 

Finally, the loose flour was removed by tapping at the rotating rod,
 
Rr1wMO.jpg

 

so that everything can dry thoroughly first, and then tomorrow the excess flour will be brushed off.  up040577.gif

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Hello everybody,

 

now I can also present the pictures after brushing off the surplus flour, which have pleasantly surprised me, speak_cool.gif

 

yoWhou.jpg

 

because now the proportions of the SOFI-Patterns fit much better to the diameter of the Intertank, which results in a completely different and more realistic look of the texture,  top2.gif 

 

w3myqn.jpg

 

especially since the floured surface looks much finer and smoother this time, which is certainly due to the finer Rice flour. top.gif And if I now imagine this structure with primer and painting, then this should presumably give a quite acceptable overall picture. smiley215.gif

 

C5KitH.jpg

 

And then I carefully subtracted the Maskol bonnets from the Ramps,

 

MR0TSo.jpg

 

7FwTDU.jpg

 

whereby I had to realize that the ramp, glued onto the tape strips (left) had no proper hold and has gradually peeled off during unmasking. rolleyes.gif

 

aLmot6.jpg

 

Consequently, the splices for the Ramps should be exposed before the Flour coating and covered separately either with a piece of masking tape or with Maskol and then the Ramps to glue only after Flour coating. up045518.gif

 

And with these positive impressions, I can now continue with a clear conscience. up040577.gif 

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Well, I never thought I'd be impressed by someone putting masking tape on a model...... :clap:

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