Space Shuttle Launch Pad 39A with Challenger STS-6

[noeyedears]

holy poo-poo

Edited May 15, 2015 by Mike
Can we not try to circumvent the swear filter please?

[roma847]

I understand that as a and thus as a compliment, and say thank you.

Edited May 5, 2015 by roma847

[roma847]

Hi there,

but before I start tinkering these details to my so laboriously bent Firex-line, I tried different things in advance as a precaution, so there are no nasty surprises.

This concerned initially once the pre-drilling of the pipe and glue the spray nozzles. And when handling this specimen it actually came to feared kinking at one point that was drilled through.

That is why I again drilled in the next experiments only with a few turns and this time tried yet to gentleman's parts up the nozzle ends after gluing slightly. This is a bit tricky because of the danger of breakage and also risky, but it worked for these two nozzles.

Then still a couple of adhesive experiments with MEK, right with pre-drilling, and left without, so just put the profile and painted at the foot with MEK.

While this holds first, as you can see, the adhesive contact is not yet stable enough to manipulate on the part, and gave up his spirit.

Then I made up my mind, the two lateral nozzle behind the first bend, which are angled twice,

Source: NASA

Then I made up my mind the two lateral nozzles behind the first bend, which are angled twice, and have this first bent only normal, without hot air. Because they're so beautiful thin, I thought that maybe would be enough.

But after some time (30 min.) the nozzle had again bent back slightly.

Consequently, you have to help out more with hot air even when bending these thin profiles.

Next, I tried the support to a waste line, for which I have used Evergreen Strips (0,38x0,75 mm). For that I have short strips (each with slightly supernatant) initially glued under the line,

then also from behind,

and finally separated the supernatants.

Finally, I have glued even a clamping ring made of lead wire (0.3 mm) between the two supports, which is however hardly recognizable.

That would be something like the procedure, what I would have to perform well at my Firex-line a number of times. But in hindsight, I think that it will be more favorable from the assembly process when I first glue all supports, then after that the holes are pre-drilled and the last nozzle glued. Because the few nozzles already were standing in the way during sticking of the supports and cutting off the supernatants.

And in the same way the supports and the nozzles will be mounted on the front two branch lines. However, I'm still thinking if I previously glue these lines to the main line, or after gluing the front supports and nozzles, but probably the latter.

The final gluing of the entire line with all the bits and pieces around the SSME hole only can happen little by little, and support for support, and is likely to become probably quite stressful.

Edited May 6, 2015 by roma847

[noeyedears]

you are going to begin having nightmares about pipes!!

[roma847]

Yep, that's really a tricky matter.

[roma847]

Hi there,

so, today I will continue with the front two branch lines, the assembly process I have specified once more. Now I want to build the branch lines with the supports and nozzles separately and then mount on the main line, and finally all should be painted together.

In addition I have been a little bit experimenting with the structure of the supports. The supports are sitting on a base plate that is bolted to the Blast Shield, and support the tube only on the outside, as you can see in this picture.

Source: NASA

And this structure, I have tried to replicate in different versions in which the difficulty is that the parts are only in the millimeter range.

These are the two branch lines (1.2 mm diameter) with the mark for the supports.

For the base plates Evergreen Strips 1,0x0,25 mm are used again with sufficient supernatants to facilitate further assembly.

And these are my first test with 1 mm "long" profile stubs, applied on the outside of the line, from left to right:

0,5x0,5 mm, 0,75x0,75 mm, and 0,38x0,75 mm.

For another test I have made a T-beam and glued a strip 0,5x0,5 mm on a strip 0,25x0,75 mm.

Of this I have removed a 1 mm stub,

thus expanding my test series.

Since the differences in white plastic are hardly visible, I have the line painted provisionally gray, whereby you can see the contours better.

Here is the legend about this:

1: 0,5x0,5 mm

2: T-beam, foot 0,5x0,5 mm on 0,25x0,75 mm

3: T-beam, foot 0,25x0,5 mm on 0,25x0,75 mm

4: 0,75x0,75 mm

5: 0,38x0,75 mm

6: 0,5x0,75 mm

Now I just have to decide, but even though I might almost exclude the composite T-beams as this seems to be too much affectation that the effort not worth it.

What do you think?

[RichO]

I vote for #4. I think it looks closest to the photo. Good Job.

[roma847]

Thanks Rich,

Hey Guys,

and because I love this tricky details so, I have dared and decided for this T-shaped pipe supports on the Firex-line

Source: NASA

and therefore measured the geometry on the basis of the close-up image again in more detail.

Source: NASA

Then I've made a new T-beam by gluing an Evergreen Strip 0,5x0,5 mm on a handcarved Styrene Strip 0,2x0,7 mm, from which I carefully have tapped off 1 mm "long" stubs. That worked still relatively good, but the gluing of these midgets was then nothing for the faint hearted and succeded only with bated breath between two heartbeats.

After that, the supernatants were still tapped off, and the branch line was completed, ie almost, because the Nozzles are missing still, but also will come.

And then I wanted to have a look on this line on the MLP and am more than satisfied with the result.

But now I have to get some fresh air for now.

[roma847]

Hi there,

today I will continue.

At the branch line in front of the LH2 TSM still missing the spray nozzles. For that I have used the thinnest Evergreen rods Ø 0.5 mm and sharpened the front slightly. And on this occasion I have mounted the clamping ring of 0.4 mm lead wire at the end.

Then I carefully pre-drilled the holes, then plugged in the nozzle stubs and glued with MEK.

And so does the environment around the SSME shaft around slowly take form.

So far so good, and so as not to come only out of practice, I have done the supports of the other branch pipe in front of the LOX TSM in the same way, as usual.

Now missing only the four nozzles,

Now missing only the four Nozzles, and then it goes on to the rear main line with the local supports and nozzles.

Somehow these small stuff is pretty stressful, but that uses all nothing, needs must.

Edited May 15, 2015 by roma847

[roma847]

Hello guys,

and thus continue on the back of the Firex main pipe where there are similarly structured supports and a lot of nozzles. The difference can be seen well on the next two panorama pictures, although you have to look closely.

Source: NASA

The base plate is screwed just at the end on the Blast Shield, the front is significantly narrower and the rear supernatant is minimal.

Source: NASA

Consequently, my supports look somewhat different from the front and consist of three parts. For the substructure I've composed a Styrene Strip 0,25x1,0 mm (length) and a strip 0,25x0,75 mm (short) and glued with MEK.

Now we continue on the template where I first marked on the line the numbered positions of the nozzles. The ten red marks indicate the location of the supports, the green belong to the clamping rings.

Then I lined up the lower parts and fixed with tape and glued the vertically standing buttocks (0,38x0,75 mm).

This angles, I then placed under the line to the red points and glued with MEK, initially in the right half,

and after re-clamping in the left half.

And now also the supernatants can be tapped off,

first the parts in front of the line,

and then behind them.

And so have already done the ten supports.

And as you can see, it all fits together well and still does not look bad.

And tomorrow it will become funny, then the tension rings and the remaining nozzles are waiting for me.

[RichO]

AMAZING!!!

[roma847]

Hi there,

first I have to add the nozzles on the branch line in front of the LOX TSM, with which the two branch lines are now complete.

Then, as already announced, now to the clamping rings I've bent of 0.3 mm lead wire. On the back of the Firex main line there are six of them, two of them sit in the middle, next to the two single supports,

and the other four between the support pairs.

Then I pre-drilled the holes for the nozzles (Ø 0,5 mm). Since one can easily slip during drilling on the thin line (1.2 mm diameter) but that line was fixed again in a proven manner.

And then I started with the nozzles which have been seen more often.

Source: NASA

These are first of all the 12 about 3 mm long stubs on the back of the line, which are aligned obliquely forward towards the orbiter, and the three longer angled branches respectively right and left at the end behind the bows, and in the middle.

And even on these thin nozzle pipes there are clamping rings.

And the two angled nozzles in the last picture are sitting at this point here, where the space probably should be very narrow.

Source: NASA

And as you can see, behind this nozzle there is also a small support with a holding ring and a further clamping ring, and these things were then also still done.

Since there are also such clamping rings in front of the TSMs, these were also done.

And after that I tried on this angled nozzles,

and glued together with the three nozzle pipes with MEK.

And now to the nozzle stubs,

whereby the insertion of these tiny parts with the tweezers into the holes was extremely stressful,

which has not always worked right away.

But finally all 25 nozzles were then installed, and the sight of this bizarre structure will be quite impressive, I think.

And for today as a crowning finale the picture with two TSMs which compensates for all effort.

That's it for today.

Edited May 19, 2015 by roma847

[noeyedears]

looking more awesome

[roma847]

Thanks for your nice compliment,

this Firex line with its tiny supports and nozzles was a crazy stuff, but the effort was worth it and I'm very happy with the result so far.

[roma847]

Hi there,

the question of the space for the SSWS line above the angled nozzles but has left me no rest, so I had to check out right now of its dimensions.

Here you can see this place. For the thick ring line (24''), coming from the left, I will use a rod with Ø 4,0 mm. The tubular transition then has Ø 2,5 mm and tapers in front of the TSM to Ø 1,8 mm, where are sitting further eight nozzles.

Source: NASA

And here I have tried with such a profile Ø 1,8 mm if that still will fit through the gap under the ladder and behind the angled nozzle,

and it fits actually what now makes me feel relieved and confident.

[RichO]

I sure am enjoying watching this Manfred! I have need of some small water lines just like this, for my Revell Mercury launch pad kit "Everything is Go" Thanks for the clinic Doc!

[roma847]

Thanks Rich,

well, then have fun and do it!

Edited May 27, 2015 by roma847

[roma847]

Hi together,

so, let's go to at last thicker SSWS pipes and the associated supports.

For this I can initially resort to my erstwhile pull-ups before the conversion of the SRB holes when I had started already with the SSWS.

Unfortunately, I can forget my former pipes (1:160) as they are a little too narrow and too short for the 1:144 holes.

In the following general layout drawing the position of the pipe supports of the 24'' line (Ø 4,0 mm) is marked, and there are respectively 18 supports around each SRB hole.

Source: NASA

At the green marked points 14 supports are located with closing clamp bands to replace these line segments as needed or to service, as can be seen in the next picture.

The remaining 4 supports on the red marked points having no such clamp bands. When evaluating the photographic material I have discovered some supports (1, 3, 8, 12, 14) and supplemented, which are missing in the drawing.

Source: NASA (Streetview)

Furthermore, it should be noted that all supports are standing on the MLP deck, while no. 10, 11 and 12 are on the Blast Shield. Accordingly, these supports have a shorter foot and also slightly different structure.

Source: NASA

As has been shown in a previous post (#365), the 24'' pipe (Ø 4,0 mm) behind the support 1 tapers to 14'' (Ø 2,5 mm) which is why the local support has a special structure too.

Source: NASA

All remaining supports have otherwise the same structure as it is clearly seen here.

Source: NASA

Such support I had at that time already been scratched, I actually had quite liked,

but from today's perspective the dimensions (L=5.0 mm, W=3.2 mm), and in particular its clear height (4.0 mm) seem to be a bit too large.

And with that problems in determining the scaled dimensions inevitably reveal, which unfortunately is often difficult due to perspective distortion of reference photos.

In David Maier's Paper kit these supports are unfortunately only hinted, whereat the clear heights of 2.5 mm respectively 1.5 mm appears to be too low.

Consequently, I made again a lot of measurements and estimates based on different images and perspectives and now I tend to a clearance of 3.5 mm on the deck, respectively 2.0 mm on the SRB Blast Shields, that are 1.5mm high with me.

This arrangement I have now simulated with my old pipe in a test, for this I have used provisional support dummies of corresponding height. And in order to see how and to what height the line arrives at the inner corner of the TSM, I have provisionally glued the two tapers at the front end.

As this support arrangement actually fits quite well and I also like the look, I will now try to scratch build two matching support patterns.

[James G]

Incredible work, superb!

[RichO]

Still always amazed at your ability to locate just the correct photos for your current build section. It's like you were there to take the reference photos in person!

[roma847]

Thanks James for your nice words.

Hi Rich,

yep, good reference photos you need necessarily, if you want to scratch build those special details.

But then comes the much more difficult part of the exercise if you want to build all this crazy stuff, because it requires the dimensions of the parts. And this is an extremely difficult and time-consuming chapter, because I do not have such beautiful templates as you.

But so far I have always found a fitting solution and I hope that this remains so, I'm not finished yet.

Edited May 28, 2015 by roma847

[roma847]

Hello together,

on the problems arising from the perspective distortions of the images when determining the dimensions of the items needed for the supports I had already pointed out.

As an illustration, I have this image of the thick 24'' pipe whose diameter (4 mm) usually was the reference value for the conversion to the model scale.

Source: NASA

BTW, the estimation of the clear height especially had given me a lot headache, but that is important, especially since it is identical to the height of the support.

As you can see here, the clear height should then be roughly equivalent to the pipe diameter, or about 4 mm. Because the evaluation of other photos from different perspectives with better resolution but gave predominantly smaller values by 3 mm, I'd at the end spoiled for choice and had to decide. And as already mentioned, I have now committed myself to 3.5 mm respectively 2.0 mm.

Source: NASA

And so now, but the actual work.

For the most frequently occurring support (Type 1) next to the thick 24'' ring line I've been thinking about the following structure, which consists of five elements on which I've fiddled for a while. Therefore, at first I was interested to see whether this structure would be realizeable at all.

Source: NASA

As a basic element (1) I will this time use an Evergreen channel (2,5x1,1 mm), and for the two crescent-shaped supports (2) and the base plate (3) Styrene (0,25 mm). The foot consists of two parts, the upper part (5) is a jewelry pearl (Ø 1,3x1,2 mm) and the lower part (4) a Styrene disk (Ø 1,5 mm).

While the elements of the lower part (1, 3, 4, 5) should guarantee a uniform height, it will in particular depend on how to achieve the small crescent supports possibly with precise curves and always with the same height, so that all 30 supports at the end are also the same height. And these sickles I'll punch with my Punch & Die Set, the maximum diameter accidentally is 4 mm.

Although on the reference photos everything looks relatively large in the measurement and scaling, at the end there are but rather small parts. And from the punched sickle remains at the required height and width also not much left.

The uniform spacing of these crescents results from the fact that they are glued on both sides with MEK to a Styrene Strip (0,25x1,5 mm), which is then glued to the Evergreen Channel what I have previously tried it out with two test strips.

And so here are the necessary parts. To assemble the foot parts I've been thinking about, to thread them on a pin through a centering bore and then to glue in order to ensure a uniform alignment.

After alignment and fixation the items of the upper part gluing was made again with MEK, which has really proven for such mini-contacts.

The gluing of the foot parts, however, is a little more difficult, since the glass bead must be carefully glued with CA, but this can remain unfortunately also stick to the needle.

This has also so far worked, so I was initially glad in view of the feasibility of construction.

After detailed contemplation of my respectable result but I have decided to enlarge the disks on the base plate to 1.7 mm in diameter (left), what should better fit into the picture.

But my joy did not last long unfortunately, because in the next handles the support disintegrated again in two parts.

So I had to think about another solution instead of the CA gluing, which has been obvious actually. For why should I not stay with the MEK gluing and use a Styrene rod Ø 0,5 mm as a centering aid, which could remain in the support? Why did I come not immediately to this solution ...

And so one of the Nozzles has offered itself that was still close.

No sooner said than done, this little rod I first glued into the upper part, then strung the lower part and glued,

then only separated the rest under the base plate, and the case was settled.

And this support is now hopefully more stable and can withstand a little more.

[Kallisti]

How many do you need to build?

[roma847]

Hey Kallisti,

thanks for your interest and staying tuned.

As you can see in this picture, there are 15 supports of Type 1 for each SRB hole, which are standing on the MLP deck, so 30 in total,

Source: NASA

and in each case 3 supports of this Type 2 (no. 10-12), which are standing on the SRB Blast Shields, so 6 in total.

Source: NASA

So this is all in all still manageable and doable.

BTW, there are still some other supports at the thinner pipes, but more on that later.

[RichO]

Nice solution with the little beads. More found objects, I like. Type 1, and type 2 supports appear to be generally, the same shape, just different heights. With that many supports to build it's time for mass production. Keep up the great job!

I understand about photo distortion also. I have been researching photos of complex 14 launch pad (Mercury 9) and old photos are not the best to work with. sometimes with smaller scales I have to just "wing it", and use what looks good.

Yours always looks good tho, now back to the grind.