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RAF Artwork to be banned


paul178
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I thought this nonsense had died the death it deserved. Apparently not. This country really has gone to the dogs when they can waste time & money on this sort of crap. They really should find something better to do with their time....

Keef

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Copied and pasted from another forum, sheer madness!

http://forum.keypublishing.com/showthread.php?t=115793

I was thinking of doing a painting of a certain British aircraft(I'm afraid to specify which one in case I get sued),

does this mean that I will be in breach of copyright if I do so?

BB

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I was thinking of doing a painting of a certain British aircraft(I'm afraid to specify which one in case I get sued),

does this mean that I will be in breach of copyright if I do so?

BB

As someone mentioned on the other thread - are they going to sue every artist that exhibits a painting of a RAF/RN/Army aircraft in this years Guild of Aviation artists show? I somehow doubt it.....

Keef

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I suppse with the Defence cuts, they had to figure out another way to get the money they need to have a vaguely serviceable airforce.

How long before the kit manufacturers find it uneconmic (due to licensing costs) to produce models of British aircraft with British markings. I suspect this could hit the limited run kit industry pretty hard.

Will there be a time when a kit is released of a British aircraft with no markings to keep the cost down.

If as is found in some models a roundel is produced with just the Blue and White, with the Red being a separate "dot" on the sheet, is that infringing the copyright as the roundel is then not necessarily a British one (if other centres were provided).

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I thought this nonsense had died the death it deserved.

I thought so too. I remember reading that there had been a test case regarding the roundel appearing on some "mod" style clothing. The court ruled that the roundel had been used as a fashion icon for too long for anyone to now claim it was intellectual property.

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This reminds me of a very old joke ...

What do you call 50 lawyers at the bottom of the ocean? ...

A good start!

I'd be interested to know if the MoD registered the design before it was first used or within 12 months of its first public use. If they didn't, can it be registered under copyright law?

In a period where we are bordering on recession it seems we can always find work to increase the misery of the majority of the people at the expense of a few. :angry:

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Any willing decal manufacturer fancy making a few sets of Luftwaffe markings for my Spitfires and Hurricanes? I will put a hold on finishing my Fairey Battle for now until I am sure I wont be dragged off to the nick! Japanese Beufighter anyone?

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Talk about a joke gone horribly wrong, MoD really has their craniums pretty far up their rears with this one. Lord willing, after enough outrage is expressed, things might end up dying down. I have a feeling the ramping up of things is probably related to the London Olympics as the government tries to get their grubby paws on as much tax revenue as they can for the next few months.

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I'd be interested to know if the MoD registered the design before it was first used or within 12 months of its first public use. If they didn't, can it be registered under copyright law?

That's the irony, the MOD attempted and failed to get the markings copyrighted a couple of years ago therefore this is another poor attempt at litigation which is destined to fail at great expense to the taxpayer.

Consider this, every photo taken of British military aircraft taken infringes this copyright if it is posted for others to see.......oh yes that's right, there is no cash involved in posing on a forum but just try putting them up for sale!

The manufacturers of any after market decal sheet would be liable, ad nauseum.

This is an indication of the litigant mentality of the corporate lawyers only in this case aggravated because they are using taxpayers money for the court case!

Edited by Phartycr0c
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It must be a great relief to the many thousands of our service personnel currently engaged on operations that their actions and sacrifices enable civil servants like this to sleep safely in their beds a'night, get up and go to work to produce such crass stupidity as this.

Now we know what we are fighting for lads! The MOD's right to charge copyright!

Perhaps the MOD might look to save money instead by making its bloated, inefficient and possibly corrupt procurement sytem work well enough that kit our chaps need might be ordered efficiently and quickly, and to ensure it works and is fit for purpose?

Nah -pipe dream - far easier to fleece the public for a few shekkels on the back of some idiotic copyright law.

Good grief

Jonners

MOD - Ministry of Richardheads

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Bureaocrats....This is moronic. Should I take the roundels off the planes in my paintings?

Strictly speaking...this would apply to model aircraft as well, decal manufacturers and all.

Edited by seadog
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I just won't do any more RAF or British military aircraft anymore! As has been said above, this country has gone to the dogs ,,,or worse!

Edited by Paul J
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You'd better change your avatar too....!!

K

I just might!

It looks like the looney left have penetrated the looney right!!!

Edited by Paul J
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I seriously doubt that whatever royalty and license fees the MOD Copyright Gestapo manage to raise will be wiped out many many times over by the finaincial black hole that is defence procurement. Still it enables another level of incompetance to be added to an already defunct department.

Shakespeare was right about what to do with Lawyers.

:giles:

Darius

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I thought we must be taking the lead from the Americans on this as they are the litigation society par excellence. But no. It seems that in the US most government logos are automatically public domain - which seems refreshingly sensible.

From reading more it would seem that the MOD are not able to claim copyright in the roundel (though a bit of sabre rattling may scare off a few users) but are claiming copyright for unit badges and that corporate logo which is getting stuck on things like display aircraft and UAVs. What they hope to gain from it I really don't know. They may get a little bit of money, but as for protecting their "brand" I suspect they will achieve the opposite effect.

As for blaming "lawyers" the MOD legal advisers may advise the MOD on what rights they can enforce, but the final decision will be an economic/moral/practical one made by a civil servant.

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From reading more it would seem that the MOD are not able to claim copyright in the roundel (though a bit of sabre rattling may scare off a few users) but are claiming copyright for unit badges and that corporate logo which is getting stuck on things like display aircraft and UAVs.

The nasty cynic in me wonders whether the whole point of slapping that ghastly corporate logo onto RAF aircraft is so that breach of copyright can then be claimed for any image featuring it. Haven't heard the same arguments being made re the Royal Navy: presumably they are more sensible. Another good reason, if one were needed, for modelling the FAA instead.

BTW this sort of issue is not entirely new. John Rawlings' Fighter Squadrons of the RAF has reproductions of all the squadron badges (as you might expect). His follow-up Coastal, Support and Special Squadrons (1982) does not: "It is my great regret that we have had to omit the squadron badges from this volume owing to the disproportionate reproduction fees now charged".

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Seem to remember same kind of thing with the Simulation IL2 years ago who decided just to remove some American planes from the sim. (like the TBF avenger) Its not just a British thing. Big merrycan companies are at it as well.

Cant help but feel a a sense of sensationalism with these stories. harumph harumph harumph. I didn't get a "harrumph" out of that guy!

Edited by Pilgrim_UK
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BTW this sort of issue is not entirely new. John Rawlings' Fighter Squadrons of the RAF has reproductions of all the squadron badges (as you might expect). His follow-up Coastal, Support and Special Squadrons (1982) does not: "It is my great regret that we have had to omit the squadron badges from this volume owing to the disproportionate reproduction fees now charged".

Could that be something to do with the College of Heraldry (or whatever it be called)? I seem to recall reading somewhere that official squadron badges have to be approved by, & then registered with, them & then reproduction fees become due...??

Keef

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Seem to remember same kind of thing with the Simulation IL2 years ago who decided just to remove some American planes from the sim. (like the TBF avenger) Its not just a British thing. Big merrycan companies are at it as well.

But 'big merrycan companies' are private enterprises - the MOD & our armed forces are not. They also need to remember that old argument of who "actually pays their wages"....

K

Edited by keefr22
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