Handley Page Harrow - some questions

[CarLos]

I purchased the Sanger kit some time ago, separated the main parts from the plastic sheets and put them again in the plastic bag. Recently I took it off again and now it is on my desk, in the company of several projects that I'm making simultaneously.

I don't mind a not perfect kit, but this one if very far from that, as it has problems that require main surgery. To start, the wings are very thick at the tips and the airfoil curvature is at least strange, being shallower in the upper surfaces. The engine cowlings are molded in halfs, and after gluing them I verified that it would be much easier to make a new pair from scratch. The fuselage has also many problems (misalignment's, assymetries...) but I think they can be easily corrected. The wheel spats are absolutely horrible, a fiction - however, the scale drawings that comes with the kit compares very well with photos.

I've been gathering references, and I have all that was published in Aeroplane Monthly and in Air Enthusiast. On the internet I've found some very useful manual pages and good photos of the structure of an aircraft damaged by fire. If someone has the full manual I'l like to hear from him.

This two movies are also interesting; The first one shown the civil registered airctaft I want to do in a air refuelling scene; This other one shows the prototype, most probably.

Flight Magazine comes with a four-page article on flight refueling starting here.

I've seen published data on wing airfoil related to several Handley Page aircraft, but not on the Harrow. If someone knows about the profile it would help a lot. My plan is to use the lower half of the wings to make the upper halfs and make new lower parts with plastic card.

I also need a good photo showing the central part of the wing. The plans show a center section with constant thickness, of the width of the fuselage, but in the kit the dihedral starts at the middle. I guess that the drawings are correct, but I would like to be sure.

Also the converted bombers had no dorsal turret, instead the hole was covered for some hatch. I also would appreciate a good photo of it.

Some pics of the small progress up to date:

I always put some plastic guides on the fuselage that helps to maintain the correct alignment of the parts while you open and close it to make the interior. Easy to do and a great improvement that saves a lot of time and trouble. I do it also in injected kits when there are no pins.

Fortunately I save all kinds of plastic tubes.

I even rob the children!

If someone can help on the details above it would be great!

Carlos

Edited January 25, 2012 by CarLos

[miduppergunner]

Hello Carlos,

Have not got anything but you might like to try the War Museum at Duxford because coincidentally I was told by someone who I have reason believe that they do have a lot of HP plans but for some reason are coy about admitting it!! I am not sure however if that is only the more recent stuff as my enquiry was WWII. Otherwise you might try Hendon if you have not already.

You may have to be a bit persistent because I worked as a volunteer at the National Maritime Museum in the draught room and I was entering the draughts they had on the computer. I was amazed to hear people there saying "No we have not got any drawings for that ship" when I knew they had and also knew that they knew!!!!

You probably know that Handley Page produced a Harrow type E - a biplane - yours is of course the HP51/54. I only have a small 3 view but from that I am pretty sure the "crack"in the wing for DH is not in the centre.

Best of luck - keep me posted though.

[John Aero]

Carlos

The centre section is flat topped and the wing taper starts from the fuselage shoulders. The wing section is relatively (almost) flat bottomed with the ratios of 2/3rds above the chord centre line to 1/3rd below the line. The drawings probably come from Vol one of Aircraft of the Fighting Powers. I don't know if this kit has been modified from the original Contrail but Sangar (Elliott) regularly gets his wing sections (such as they are) upside down.

John

Edited January 25, 2012 by John Aero

[CarLos]

My thanks to both. I think I will take John's info and make an approximative wing, based also in the known photos. Another detail not present in the kit is the rib effect behind the spar - noticeable in flight, not so much landed.

Carlos

[CarLos]

I made some progress in the wings, and it really isn't very difficult. I started by adding a spar at about 1/3 of the chord, and followed Johns advice of 2/3 - 1/3 above and bellow chord line. I added two more spars at the location of the flaps and ailerons. I used eyeball Mk.2 for this. Then I added ribs. (I often use printed plastic - from old movies posters - because I can easily scribe on them)

I payed special attention to the leading edge; As I will open the HP slats I reinforced the inside of the molded plastic and made a thick underside where the skin will sit. Flaps and ailerons will be made from scratch, and new tips will also be carved from solid plastic.

The structure is very solid, but capable of some torsion. Before gluing the skins I will investigate if there is any wash-out on the Harrow wings. The skin will maintain the correct wing "torsion", I hope.

I fell now much more comfortable about correcting the Airways VC-10 wings!

Pics:

SWAMBO won't notice if you take some of those hangers for skirts...

I'm working also on the tail surfaces, photos later.

Carlos

[woody37]

You have my full admiration. So far this is the only kit I've every given up on and binned. Way beyond my abilities

[CarLos]

You have my full admiration. So far this is the only kit I've every given up on and binned. Way beyond my abilities

Thanks for the nice words, but your work in the Halifax shows well that your skills are more than enough! But I understand you, at first I thought it would be a waste of time to try to build the kit. I'm still not sure if it's not...

A small update: I made new wing tips from laminated plastic, the wing leading edges are sanded to a proper airfoil, but I still have to make the flaps, ailerons and slats. I used the kit parts to make the tail surfaces, but they were considerably nodified. I still need to finish them - ribs, hinges, actuators, tabs... The parts are not glued, just positioned using pins made from paper clips.

I also started correcting the kit spats (I may end making new ones). A photo from Aeroplane Monthly shows the wheels dimension, but I'm not sure about them; 1200 - 440? 1265 - 440? In any case, what is the meaning of the numbers? My spares box is not so well furnished as I thought, I don't have nothing near of what seems to be the size I need. I may have to scratch new ones.

More pics when I have more to show. I want to finish the wings before starting with the fuselage interior.

Comments and suggestions welcome!

[John Aero]

The overall dia of the tyre is 1265 (50") and the 440 refers to the the width of the tyre (17.5"), but this can be misleading as part of this is hidden by being inside the flange of the wheel hub which will be around 26" dia (so your wheel in scale should be close to 17.5mm overall dia and a hub of 9.5mm dia with a width of aprox 6mm ). Excellent work by the way. Modelling at it's most pleasing.

John

Edited February 9, 2012 by John Aero