Muzz Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 (edited) I see this is down for release in 1/48 next month. Not seen anything mentioned about it on here but I take it it's a re-box of the Academy kit with the usual Eduard extras thrown in? Some interesting colour schemes on offer! Edited January 20, 2012 by Muzz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike V Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Pretty much an over-priced re-release and rebox of the Aacdemy kit; like the MiG-29s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintsPhil Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 135 Euros!! Surely not...the Migs were about half that with the same AM included, resin pit and 2 Frets of PE. I thought the Migs were a reasonably buy, it you tot up all the add ons plus decals, but that's a bit steep! Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike V Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Here in the US the Eduard MiG-29s retail for $80+; hardly a reasonable buy especially when I was buying the basic kit (in country) for $9-$12, back in the 90s-2003. It would be reasonable if the Eduard MiG-29s came with corrected Exhaust, Intakes, and for the single seater, a corrected Radome. I doubt a corrected nose is going to be included in the Eduard boxing of the Su-27. Ah; just looked at the Instructions PDF. Looks like some basic PE details, nice decal sheet, and a nice cockpit is all that's adde for extras. Not even corrected wheels are included! That leaves the modeler to aquire a correct nose, canopy, "full" Exhaust, wheels, as well as R-27R/ R1 / AA-10 Alamos, as the kit ones are terrible. Not what I would call a reasonable buy at $135 retail! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintsPhil Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 I think the prices are in Euro rather than dollars!! I don't see what you get over the Mig 29 kit that makes it worth 2x the price! Is the canopy and IRIS not incorrect as well?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike V Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 No, it's $135 retail alright: http://www.eduard.com/store/Eduard/Plastic...1-48.html?cur=2 http://www.greatmodels.com/~smartcart/cgi/...tem_num=EDU1167 and yes, Academy's Su-27 canopy is quite off; too shallow/underscaled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flankerman Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 Way back in the last millenium (1999) I built and reviewed the Acadmey 1:48 scale Su-27 Flanker B. The results are on Linden Hill's website here. One of the things I picked up on is the fact that if the kit were real, the main wheels would not retract because the wheel well was incorrect and needed modification...... Looking at Eduards downloadable instruction sheet, the same fault is still there....... The Academy cockpit tub was also too shallow - not sure if that has been corrected ??? 30 years after the types first flight (as the T10S), we still don't have an affordable, accurate Flanker kit IN ANY SCALE. Just my two penn'orth and first rant of 2012. Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fu_manchu Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 That seems very steep. I am in the process of getting the bits to do 2xsu-27 (one as a su-33). Base Academy Kit - £22 Aires Pit - £12 If you wanted to add some Eduard PE - approx £15, so about £47 all in. I am also getting Aires Exhaust (not really addressed by Eduard) Haneto replacement canopy (not addressed by Eduard) SAC gear as I found to my cost is needed to replace the flimsy gear (not addressed by Eduard) Begemot Decals All that together costs not much more than what Eduard are shipping this out for. Now, if the base kit was hard to get etc, I would probably be up for it, but it's the same as the Mig-29, cheap as chips base version still common, compared to the price for the 'upgrade', hopefully prices will re-align if Hobby boss do bring out their re-tool. Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
junco Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Does seem more expensive than all the recent upgrade sets, £76.60 on Hannants, even with a decent discount it's well over £60 quid!! Another essential upgrade is the Quickboost nose correction. Fortunately picked up a mega lot at Telford and the Wolfpack UB from here. Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike V Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I prefer the Pisco radome; a litte better profile wise than QB's. Way back in the last millenium (1999) I built and reviewed the Acadmey 1:48 scale Su-27 Flanker B.The results are on Linden Hill's website here. One of the things I picked up on is the fact that if the kit were real, the main wheels would not retract because the wheel well was incorrect and needed modification...... Looking at Eduards downloadable instruction sheet, the same fault is still there....... The Academy cockpit tub was also too shallow - not sure if that has been corrected ??? 30 years after the types first flight (as the T10S), we still don't have an affordable, accurate Flanker kit IN ANY SCALE. Just my two penn'orth and first rant of 2012. Ken They still haven't addressed that "main wheel well ledge" problem, as it was still in their recent Su-30 kit. When I first built the kit ion 96, it was quite obvious to me that the ledge didn't belong there, so I cut it out and blended in the intake notch. However, I would see the error not addressed in many other Su-27 builds for years to come. I'm disappointed that even after 3 attempts at identifying the ledge issue over the main wheel wells to Academy and later MRC ,that they still have yet make a note of it in the instructions. I seriously doubt Academy correct their overly shallow cockpit tub for the Eduard release. You get a new 2 seat tub in the Su-30 kit, but they are as shallow as the original. Another reason why I don't care for the Wolfpack cockpits, as they are near as shallow as the kit's, which also means under-scaled seats. We probably won't see an accurate 48th Flanker family for some time, as I doubt the likes of Trumpkinboss will get it right even if they took a stab at it. Even so, most of the Academy kit problems can be addressed with AM; radome, canopy, cockpit, exhaust, wheels, etc... which can still turn out a nice Flanker in 48th. The same really can't be said about their MiG-29 though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flankerman Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 We probably won't see an accurate 48th Flanker family for some time, as I doubt the likes of Trumpkinboss will get it right even if they took a stab at it. Trumpeter's 1/72 scale J-11B is quite good - in fact the most accurate 1/72 scale Flanker to date.... IMHO It has a few issues - the canopy is too tall and 'pointy' and it has 12 hardpoints instead of 10 - but the outline shape is good. If they were to scale it up to 'Girls Scale' (1:48) I'm sure it would fit the bill. Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintsPhil Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 The Eduard release does come with a resin replacement pit, so assuming they have the correct depth that would fix that issue. Hopefully they'll release that as a stand alone item, as they've done with the Mig 29. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintsPhil Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 Of course there's already all the Neomega resin cockpits http://www.neomega-resin.com/su27.htm Anyone know how they compare depth wise? From nosing around the Eduard site this morning I notice that they have released the PE as a seperate item. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike V Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 (edited) I'd like to see the Eduard Su-27 pit as a stand-alone item. I'm one of the few that's not “overly impressed” with Neomega’s cockpit line, overall. Having a lot of their cockpits, (to include the MiG-29, Su-27, and Su-30) I found the knob and switch detail to be quite chunky or over scaled and many of their instrument panels to be proportional off as far as gauge alignment. I found when there's an Aires, Black box, or now Eduard equivalent, these are usually better in overall detail and dimensionally more accurate. Don’t get me wrong, as Neomega cockpits are quite nice (much better than WP) and typically fit decent, but they’re just not as outstanding as they're hyped up to be. That being said, the Neomega 48th Su-27 and Su-30 cockpit indeed have the proper depth, however Neomega made the console sidewalls too shallow in the process. Cutting Edge, KMC, and Aires have a more accurate console depth or floor-to-console-to-sidewall proportions. Trumpeter's 1/72 scale J-11B is quite good - in fact the most accurate 1/72 scale Flanker to date.... IMHOIf they were to scale it up to 'Girls Scale' (1:48) I'm sure it would fit the bill. Ken Dunno; scaled up to 32nd, the Trumpy Su-27 kit is well hosed up requiring some expensive Zacto corretions. Maybe they could do it better in 48th, but 10:1 they hose thr canopy again and the cockpit will probably be poor as well. Edited January 3, 2012 by Mike V Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintsPhil Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 I would think they will, maybe once the special editions are sold, of you've gone to expense of making the masters moulds etc why not sell them! I notice the PE interior set is there too though, But then I think both are available for the Migs. Neomega do a nose correction too I notice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flankerman Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Dunno; scaled up to 32nd, the Trumpy Su-27 kit is well hosed up requiring some expensive Zacto corretions. Maybe they could do it better in 48th, but 10:1 they hose thr canopy again and the cockpit will probably be poor as well. The first Trumpeter 1/32 scale Su-27 release was inaccurate - it required corrections in the radome, intakes and canopy - which Zactoman supplied. So with some major work, a decent Su-27 could be made. Then Trumpeter 'stole'/copied some of the Zacto corrections and re-issued it - but it still isn't 100% accurate. Trumpeter's 1/72 scale J-11B Flanker is almost spot-on in outline (apart from the canopy). What I am saying is, if they SCALED UP the 1/72 scale J-11B to 1/48 it would be a good representation of a Flanker. If they SCALED DOWN the 1/32 Su-27 kit it would not be as good. Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giorgio N Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 What I am saying is, if they SCALED UP the 1/72 scale J-11B to 1/48 it would be a good representation of a Flanker.If they SCALED DOWN the 1/32 Su-27 kit it would not be as good. Ken Sorry to hijack the thread a little, but would the J-11B box be ok to build a standard Su-27 ? Are the differences in detail only or is there any major difference ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flankerman Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Sorry to hijack the thread a little, but would the J-11B box be ok to build a standard Su-27 ? Are the differences in detail only or is there any major difference ? The J-11B contains cockpit parts for a Su-27 - but not the decals (they are J-11B specific). It also includes jet nozzles and a radome for a Su-27 (as well as different ones for the J-11B) The biggest problem would be the weapons and wingtip launch rails - they are only J-11B specific. You could make a Su-27 - but you would have to change the front instrument panel and the coaming on top (the real thing has a slightly different shape) - plus you would need to find Su-27-style wingtip launch rails plus the Russian missiles. Trumpeter are doing a Su-27 - presumably with the right bits - but I suspect you will still need to alter the panel and coaming to be 100% correct. Oh! - and the J-11B is incorrectly fitted with 12 weapons pylons instead of the correct 10 - and again, I suspect it will be wrong in the Su-27 kit. My build of the J-11B is here And now back to our scheduled discussion about Eduards 1:48 scale Flanker........ Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giorgio N Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Ken, thanks a lot for the infrmation !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintsPhil Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 This makes interesting reading: http://www.eduard.com/store/out/media/Info...o-2012-01EN.pdf Says that the base Academy kit has been re-tooled a month ago for this release! Maybe the price starts to look better value... Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fu_manchu Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 This makes interesting reading:http://www.eduard.com/store/out/media/Info...o-2012-01EN.pdf Says that the base Academy kit has been re-tooled a month ago for this release! Maybe the price starts to look better value... Phil Hmm, very interesting, I can't see anything on the Academy website about it. I wonder what they have done and if they will actively publicize it? Otherwise, if they have made any changes it might be pot luck as to if you can get the update. Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 Ken, thanks a lot for the infrmation !!! They don't call him Flankerman for nothing you know! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintsPhil Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 Hmm, very interesting, I can't see anything on the Academy website about it. I wonder what they have done and if they will actively publicize it? Otherwise, if they have made any changes it might be pot luck as to if you can get the update.Ian Can only assume its been re-tooled to fix some/all the errors and Eduard get first dibs! The blurb says on 1500 to be made and little chance of a re run! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flankerman Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 Hmmmm...... Academy released two Flanker kits - way back in the late 90's - of the single-seat Su-27 'Flanker-B' and the two-seat Su-27UB 'Flanker-C' Last August, Academy released a kit - which they called the Su-30MK - which was the Su-27UB kit UPGRADED to incorporate the changes necessary to make a Su-30MKK. It has bigger fins, twin-wheel nosegear, offset IRST ball, IFR probe and other minor changes. We discussed it over on ARC Unfortunately the fins are wrong and the outline shape is not brilliant - see post #29 in the above link. Wolfpack have released a correction set for it. AFAIK, no upgrades have been done to the single-seat Su-27 kit by Academy - but I could be wrong. I wonder if Eduard - or anyone? - can point out what the 'upgrades' are??? Or are they being a bit disingenuous and using the fact that the two-seat Su-27UB kit was 'upgraded' - to imply that the single-seat Su-27 was also ??? Note also that nowhere is the word 're-tool' used - merely 'upgraded' - whatever that word means. Caveat Emptor!!!!! Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike V Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 I wouldn't put to much faith into that claim. I seriously doubt Academy corrected any of its shape inaccuracies that would require "retooling" such as; radome, canopy, and cockpit. What Academy has done was updated the kit with new parts for the Su-30; of which some parts could be carried over to the standard kit and/or Eduard issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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