1/48 Mustang in RAF colours

[Tim T]

This will be my entry to the GB:

I will also (hopefully) be using these bits as well

These are the decals. I will do the middle one with the blue tail and stars

Does anyone have any idea what the blue is? Model Alliance refer to it as Mediterranean Blue. Is this the same as Azure Blue or is it different again?

Tim scratching his head.

[pte1643]

Does anyone have any idea what the blue is? Model Alliance refer to it as Mediterranean Blue. Is this the same as Azure Blue or is it different again?

Not the same colour.

RAF Med Blue is slightly darker than RAF Azure.

[Tim T]

Not the same colour.

RAF Med Blue is slightly darker than RAF Azure.

Brilliant. Thank you. I knew that someone would have the answer!

[Basosz]

cool! I have the Trumpy 1:32 one and just yesterday I decided that mine will have the same scheme. I even think it's the exact same aircraft.

[Bertie McBoatface]

Go RAF! Well, we are Britmodeller after all!

[wellzy]

Yes good to see a RAF Mustang good luck your build

and good luck with all that resin

wellzy

[Tim T]

Yes good to see a RAF Mustang good luck your build

and good luck with all that resin

wellzy

Thanks. I think I might need it! I am not sure whether or not I will use it all. The wheel wells look a particular joy for the wet n dry and Dremel....

[Jon Kunac-Tabinor]

Nice choice of scheme Tim - how are you going to do the fin fillet?

Cheers

jonners

[Tim T]

Nice choice of scheme Tim - how are you going to do the fin fillet?

Cheers

jonners

That Jonners. is an excellent question. My first thought was good old Milliput. I am wondering if a fillet of plastic card needs to go on first to give the shape and then Milliput around it. I will need to fiddle once I have the fues together. I find things make more sense to me when I see them in front of me if you see what I mean!

[chaddy]

Excellent choice of model. I have one in my stash, so I'll be looking forward to seeing yours built.

[Kallisti]

Can you explain or link to more about this "fin fillet" of which you speak? I'm planning on having a go at one of these as well so would be interested to find out more about what needs "fixing" in the kit...

[Tim T]

Can you explain or link to more about this "fin fillet" of which you speak? I'm planning on having a go at one of these as well so would be interested to find out more about what needs "fixing" in the kit...

If you look at the picture on the first post, you will see that the leading edge of the tailplane extends further forward than the other RAF machine. It looks more like the D variant pictured below, but extends slightly further forward (look at the panel line). The tail is something of a hybrid and the Tamiya kit depicts the tail as per the top picture not the bird I wish to model. Therefore, some surgery is needed to get the two to marry up. It is not a tricky fix (he says) but it is noticeable.

Hope that helps.

Tim

Edited November 20, 2011 by Tim T

[Jon Kunac-Tabinor]

If you look at the picture on the first post, you will see that the leading edge of the tailplane extends further forward than the other RAF machine. It looks more like the D variant pictured below, but extends slightly further forward (look at the panel line). The tail is something of a hybrid and the Tamiya kit depicts the tail as per the top picture not the bird I wish to model. Therefore, some surgery is needed to get the two to marry up. It is not a tricky fix (he says) but it is noticeable.

Hope that helps.

Tim

Just to add a bit here too Tim, the fin fillet on B & C models was added to as a field retrofit ( though some Dallas built Cs might have had this added on the production line). The shape of the fillet is not the same as the D fillet - it extends further forward and has a more curved shape to its top edge too.

I'd think a plastic card insert, faire din with some milliput of similar would do the trick on the Tamiya model, though the Accurate Miniatures 1/48th C model did include this as an optional part.

From what I understand the fin fillet retro-fit on the B & C models was contemporary with the decision to add the fillet to the Bubble top Ds ( though this of course was incorporated into the production line for Ds and Ks). The purpose of the fillet was to counter yaw instability problems with all models - the Merlin engine was powerful enough that it could throw the aircraft into a nasty snap roll if the juice was applied too rapidly, and on the Ds at least this had resulted in some tailplane failures I beleive - with rather terminal results.

As a result - and I guess also because the D was replacing the B/C, you dont see that many photos of B/Cs with the fillet, but its a very noticeable feature on the high back models that really stands out, and in my opinion makes the high back version look far more aggresive too. A B or C with fin fillet and Malcolm Hood looks particluarly cool too!

RAF and RAAF Mustang IIIs in Italy seem to feature these fillets quite widely - though you do see them on USAAF B & C models too.

Cheers

Jonners

[Tim T]

Just to add a bit here too Tim, the fin fillet on B & C models was added to as a field retrofit ( though some Dallas built Cs might have had this added on the production line). The shape of the fillet is not the same as the D fillet - it extends further forward and has a more curved shape to its top edge too.

I'd think a plastic card insert, faire din with some milliput of similar would do the trick on the Tamiya model, though the Accurate Miniatures 1/48th C model did include this as an optional part.

From what I understand the fin fillet retro-fit on the B & C models was contemporary with the decision to add the fillet to the Bubble top Ds ( though this of course was incorporated into the production line for Ds and Ks). The purpose of the fillet was to counter yaw instability problems with all models - the Merlin engine was powerful enough that it could throw the aircraft into a nasty snap roll if the juice was applied too rapidly, and on the Ds at least this had resulted in some tailplane failures I beleive - with rather terminal results.

As a result - and I guess also because the D was replacing the B/C, you dont see that many photos of B/Cs with the fillet, but its a very noticeable feature on the high back models that really stands out, and in my opinion makes the high back version look far more aggresive too. A B or C with fin fillet and Malcolm Hood looks particluarly cool too!

RAF and RAAF Mustang IIIs in Italy seem to feature these fillets quite widely - though you do see them on USAAF B & C models too.

Cheers

Jonners

As usual Jonners you are a veritable mine of information. I wasn't aware they were a field fit, so that is an interesting piece of info. I was fondling the plastic earlier (oo-er) and I think my first instincts are in line with yours - plasticard fillet carved to shape and faired in with Milliput. The tricky bit will be extending the rivets and oval panel line around the front of the tail. Might have to order a scribing template...

Regards.

Tim

[Kallisti]

Thanks for the explanation guys, thats what I love about this board, always someone knowledgeable willing to share!

[RNoAF Aerobatic Team]

I really like the Mustang in RAF colours. BUT it has to be in camo colours!

[RZP]

Go RAF! Well, we are Britmodeller after all!

This was an Australian unit... 3 Squadron RAAF. The rudder has the stars of the Southern Cross.

And be careful, the artwork for that aircraft has an error. The spinner on this aircraft should be red not blue. Red was the identifying marking for Allied fighters in the Med.

Cheers,

Richard

Edited November 25, 2011 by RZP

[ColFord]

The rudder colour was not a standardised colour, but a close mixed approximation to the blue used in the RAF/RAAF ensign, and was mixed using the available RAF Roundel Blue and RAF Roundel White that was held in stores for the Squadron. There is a warbird CAC built Mustang flying in the colours of another Mustang of this unit which received the 'stamp of approval' of its wartime pilot as being an accurate depiction of his aircraft. A lot of research went into getting the scheme and colours used accurate.

Red Roo Models in Australia do the decals for this one so you can complete it as either the wartime original, or the current warbird - complete with tiny civil registration under the tailplanes.

Regards,

[chaddy]

Whilst looking for something else in my loft, I came across a few old copies of Camouflage & Markings, from way back, which I thought were long gone.

One of them is "N A Mustang - RAF Northern Europe 1936-45".

If anybody is interested it gives full details and refs for interior colours etc.

Edited November 26, 2011 by chaddy

[Tim T]

This was an Australian unit... 3 Squadron RAAF. The rudder has the stars of the Southern Cross.

And be careful, the artwork for that aircraft has an error. The spinner on this aircraft should be red not blue. Red was the identifying marking for Allied fighters in the Med.

Cheers,

Richard

Thanks Richard. Red Spinner it is!

Whilst looking for something else in my loft, I came across a few old copies of Camouflage & Markings, from way back, which I thought were long gone.

One of them is "N A Mustang - RAF Northern Europe 1936-45".

If anybody is interested it gives full details and refs for interior colours etc.

Chaddy, I would be very interested to see that. Is there any chance of a scan?

Tim

[chaddy]

Tim,

No prob. Check your messages.

[Fandango]

Tim,

Sorry to go slightly off topic, but does that decal sheet suggest a kit for the P51A option in dark earth / dark green? That scheme has really caught my imagination and I want to track down the decal sheet and the right kit to build it. I know Accurate Minitures and ICM both do P51A's but I'm not sure if the ICM kit which appears to have 4 x 20mm cannon would be suitable for an RAF bird? If the decal sheet offers any suggestions i would appreciate it.

Cheers

Tom

[Tim T]

Tim,

Sorry to go slightly off topic, but does that decal sheet suggest a kit for the P51A option in dark earth / dark green? That scheme has really caught my imagination and I want to track down the decal sheet and the right kit to build it. I know Accurate Minitures and ICM both do P51A's but I'm not sure if the ICM kit which appears to have 4 x 20mm cannon would be suitable for an RAF bird? If the decal sheet offers any suggestions i would appreciate it.

Cheers

Tom

Not off topic at all. Unfortunately, there is nothing on the instructions to help. I guess if you can track down someone with the On-Target book, there might be something in there. I don't have a copy unfortunately. It is profile No.2 apparently.

Tim

[ColFord]

Tom,

The aircraft in the decal sheet with the temperate land scheme (US equivalent NAA factory paints for Dark Earth, Dark Green and Sky) is a Mustang Mk.I, which technically has no P-51 equivalent - it predates the first P-51, which was the 4 x 20mm cannon armed P-51, known as the Mustang Mk.IA in RAF service. The P-51A was the Mustang Mk.II in RAF service. The ICM P-51A kit has been reviewed and discussed elsewhere including in a thread up in the WW2 aircraft modelling section, but it is a mish-mash of components and features from the Mustang Mk.I/Mk.IA in the narrow air intake on top of the cowling, the wings are more in keeping with a P-51B/C having the fairings in the aileron hinge points. It is best used as a source of parts of for doing conversions.

To build a RAF Mustang Mk.I in 1/48th scale your best starting point is the AM P-51 or Mustang Mk.IA kit, which gives you the basics, particularly the correct narrow air intake above the engine, combined with the Ultracast Mustang Mk.I resin conversion set. Requires some work, rescribing of the panel lines/hatches and gun ports on the wing top and bottom surfaces, but can produce a good end result. Examples here:

This thread from here on Britmodeller from just on a year ago now has a lot of information on the RAF early Allison engined Mustangs.

http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.p...&hl=Mustang

With respect to the earlier mentioned old Camouflage and Markings book out of the Ducimus series on the P-51 Mustang RAF Northern Europe, more recent research with access to material that was not available at the time that work was written has revealed a lot of flaws in its information, especially some of the detail information and colour callouts used.

Regards,

[Fandango]

Many thanks for the info chaps, looks like the Accurate minitures kit is going to be the best starting point.

Cheers

Tom