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  1. A request from a Swiss friend. A Guppy kiosk conversion ( Porthmouth Sail version ) for a Gato Class submarine to represent the USS Torsk 423 with a 1:72 Gato Class Revell hull. I have to release the big sonar under the hull also. I found a lot of drawings on this excellent Gato Class website: http://www.gatosubs.com/mkptsail72draw.htm Unfortunately they are not very accurate, see picture, but they did help me a bit to start my 3D drawing. Luckily, you can find a lot of pictures of the USS Torsk in a dry dock during an interview and docked at the museum, especially on Flickr with HD pictures of individuals. This submarine kiosk looks simple in terms of shape, but it's quite the opposite. First sketchs:
  2. Hello! I am taking a leap into a ship and submarine diorama and now that Imgur is working again I can upload some photos of where I am. My idea was to have an upper layer of a flower class corvette sat within a thin but hard seascape that show above water and below water propeller wake including explosions from depth charges. Beneath that is another part of the dio, a submarine diving with air bubble trails and propeller wake with depth charge explosions around it in various shades / types of explosion profile with a North Sea base below……
  3. I started on a Mikromir submarine a long time ago. The build halted when it came to the etch parts. A bit of short run with fuzzy placements of parts. The instructions for the photo etc was a bit vague to put it nice. Some time there was a pic of the etch part and the plastic part it should be mounted to. Nothing to say where. I skipped lot of the small part as they were to small to be handled and I doubt that some of them would not stay as the attachment points was to small for glue to hold. Anyway, it is ready for paint.
  4. I have this very small model of the UB I. It is little confusing of the producer of the kit. U-boat Laboratorium or Kombrig? Even more confusing is it when it get to the instructions. This is what you get but it is not up to date with the kit. Parts 26, 27, 28, 29 and 30 are not included in the kit and as you can see that the etch fret included (At the right top of the pic) is different to the picture in the instructions and has no part numbers on the fret. But I'll do my best to get it together.
  5. This is the Fine Molds Kit in 1/72 that I picked up last year. There isn't a huge amount to this model, but it was a little more than a weekend project. Fit is good enough, but you will have to sand through the nicely molded welding seams. I replaced these with a fine brush and Mr Surfacer 500. There are a couple of options in the kit with regard to submarines used in different operations so pay attention to which version you wish to build. I chose to represent one of the boats used to attack Pearl Harbor on December 7th. The ships were overall matt black, with the torpedo being painted in oily steel. The instructions say black, however the torpedo that washed up on the attack on Sydney Harbour appeared to be unpainted. Weathering was kept pretty restrained. I had no problems with the decals and I finished things off with some EZ line and a small base whipped up with some pine and stain.
  6. This is the very nice AFV Club kit in 1/350. It looks to be a simply build, but the addition of photo etch means taking your time with this will give you a nice result. I managed to get most of the photo etch on and the fit of the parts is very nice. I used some EZ line for the rigging and various chalks and pastels for the weathering. Now I need to get an I-400 to sit next to her.
  7. The missile bay's detail is poor, so I choose to close it for a perfect outlook profile.
  8. Hi, I’m Scott and new here Hello fellow modeller’s could anybody give me some tips on how to create the effect of the build up of weed and algae on ship/boat models thanks Scott
  9. HMS Oberon Class Submarine Modernised (700052) 1:700 OKB Grigorov The 295.2 feet (90.0 m) long Oberon class (Or more commonly in the RN O Boats) were based heavily on the preceding Porpoise class of submarines, which were in service from 1956 to 1988. Changes from the Porpoise design were primarily to improve the strength and stealth of the submarine. Instead of UXW steel, the hull was built from QT28 steel, which was easier to fabricate and stronger, allowing the submarine to dive deeper. Glass-reinforced plastic was used in construction of the casing. The sonar, and radar systems were also upgraded to the latest standard. The submarines were equipped with a Type 1002 surface search and navigation radar, Type 187 Active-Passive attack sonar, and Type 2007 long range passive sonar. The Oberons were constructed at a variety of shipyards in the United Kingdom: the six Australian and two Chilean submarines by Scotts Shipbuilding and Engineering Company; the three Brazilian submarines by Vickers-Armstrongs; and the three Canadian submarines at Chatham Dockyard. Construction of the British submarines was shared amongst four dockyards: the three mentioned above and Cammell Laird. They were originally armed with eight 21-inch (533.4 mm) torpedo tubes: six tubes in the bow, and two short tubes for anti-submarine defence in the stern. The submarine normally carried a payload of 20 torpedoes for the forward tubes; a mix of Mark 24 Tigerfish and Mark 8 torpedoes, while only the two pre-loaded torpedoes were carried for the stern tubes. Naval mines could be carried instead of torpedoes: the forward torpedo payload would be replaced with up to 50 Mark 5 Stonefish or Mark 6 Sea Urchin mines. Like may vessels these were all modernised during their lifetimes and the class had good longevity due to it remaining a very quiet vessel. The kit The model arrives in the standard small sturdy cardboard box with a picture of one of the class underway. The model, as stated on the box is 129mm long. Inside, beneath the small instruction sheet, the parts are well protected in the companies usual manner with the main, one piece full hull is in a poly sponge wrapper within a bubblewrap cocoon with the other parts, both resin and etch. The six resin parts include the propeller shafts, fore and aft diveplanes, plus the propeller bosses. Etched parts are provided for the propellers, the propeller shaft support brackets and display stand. Detail is very nice and fine with the possible exception of the deck hatches which, as in their other kits are a little deep, but should look ok with a coat or two of paint. Construction is pretty simple, just attach the diveplanes to their relative positions, fold the prop shaft “A” frames and glue into position with the shafts. The propeller blades need to be twisted to shape and glued onto the end of the shafts, and then attach the bosses to the centre of each propeller. There are no painting guides, so research will need to be carried out to assess the correct colours. Conclusion This is another great little model of a British submarine, always a good thing to see, as there are too few of them about. I can easily recommend this to all submarine modellers. Even if you don’t normally build in 1:700, buy one, you never know, it may lead to one in 1:350 being released. Many thanks to OKB Grigorov for supplying the review sample.
  10. USS Gato SS-212 1941 1/350 HOBBYBOSS via Creative Models Beginning to enter service near the end of 1941, the diesel-fuelled Gato class submarines adopted the traditional US Navy submarine arrangement used since the end of WWI. They were equipped with four engine rooms, diesel-electric reduction gear, one auxiliary generator, four electric motors generating 5480 hp when submerged driven by two 126-cell batteries. Submerged endurance was 48 hours at 2 knots. Cruising range was 11,000 miles on the surface at 10 knots with 94,400 gallons of diesel fuel. Patrol duration was 75 days. Their performance was better on the surface than submerged, much like the rest of the worlds submarines at the time. At the outbreak of WWII the Gato class was produced in large numbers and became the workhorse of the US submarine fleet. In an attempt to cut off the supply chain of US forces from Australia the Japanese forces landed on the Solomon Islands on 20th January 1942, which also allowed Japan to target Australia directly. In retaliation, the US submarines were ordered to attack the Japanese supply chain which they did, from New Guinea waters all the way to Japans coastal waters. Throughout the war modifications and conversions to the Gato fleet were carried out the 3 inch deck guns were replaced with 4 inch and the bridge structures modified to accommodate 20mm Oerlikon cannon. The Gatos had many notable successes throughout the war, including the sinking of the carriers Tahio, (by USS Albacore), Shokaku, (by USS Cavalla) and virtually throttling the Japanese Islands of precious fuel and oil. The Kit This is a new tooling from HobbyBoss. The kit represents USS Gato the lead ship of her class as she was in 1941. She was laid down 5 October 1940, by the Electric Boat Company. She was launched 21 August 1941 sponsored by Mrs. Louise Ingersoll, wife of Admiral Royal E. Ingersoll, and commissioned 31 December 1941. As you can imagine in 1/350 the parts count is not large. There are 25 plastic parts and a PE name plate. The two main hull arts go together trapping the rudder at the stern. Also at the stern the two propeller shafts go on as well as the propellers. These are followed by the stern dive planes. At the bow the forward mast or jackstaff is added along with the bow planes and two anchors. Amidships the deck gun is added. Next up the deck house is completed with its fittings and at the top the masts and periscopes. If needed the base can then be made up along with the PE name plate and the finished boat placed on it. Decals Decals are provided for pendant numbers only. Conclusion This is a great looking kit from HobbyBoss. Overall recommended. Review sample courtesy of
  11. If anyone has missed it, BBC are starting a new 6 part series starring Suranne Jones as a detective who investigates a murder abooard HMS Vigil, a British missile submarine. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-58334990 Initial previews I've read seem encouraging, and although I'm sure I'm wrong, there's a bit in the trailer that makes me think Suranne Jones gets put into a torpedo tub at one point! I'm also more sure that the BBC weren't allowed to film inside a real missile submarine, but hey, who knows? Starts tomorrow night at 9 pm, part two on Bank Holiday Monday at 9pm, nd then Sundays at 9 pm.
  12. When I visited the Maritime museum in Stockholm and was looking at a model of the first Swedish submarine "Hajen" (the Shark) I realised that the shape of the hull looked very much like a drop tank from an aircraft. Back at home I had a look at the spare part box and found some tanks from a 1/72 scale F-84 from Academy that looked to be of the right shape. They turned out not only to be in the right shape. They also were perfect in size for a 1/350 submarine so I had no choice. I had to start a build. I sanded off the surface details and started adding plastic card instead. It is strange. Once again a model is changing scale while I'm building. I will build one as the 1904 initial version and a 1916 version that was modified. The basic shape is set It was later was renamed Ub No.1 so I will call my build of the modified submarine that. I had a feeling that the ring that protects the propeller would be the element that will guide the build. It will set the size for the fins and rudders and also make things more rigid. I was lucky to find some rings for 1/72 scale bombs that I could use. The "large" (well not on the model) cork hump had to be removed as it had been placed slightly wrong. Filling and sanding became easier and I will reshape the hump as I wasn't happy with it I added a match for a size compare.
  13. Just as a little variety from my recent microscopic projects I went for something completely different Big, simple, no PE and minimal scratch involved, om the other hand a lot of surface to play with painting. For now filling and sanding and filling and sanding.....phase is nearing to the end. Real fun will start soon Cheers Mick
  14. Hello, This is my build of Hobby Boss 1/350 USS Greeneville. It's also my first submarine and maritime build since I returned to the hobby in 2014 (I'm mainly an aircraft guy). It is a simple kit to build and comes with a few PE parts to improve the propellers. Most effort was spent trying to get a (hopefully) realistic weathering. This was obtained by a combination of different tones of gray on the black areas of the model, pre-shading, grey wash and staining along the waterline. The WIP thread can be found here. Here are the pictures of the finished model. All comments are very much welcome. IMAG7429 IMAG7430 IMAG7431 IMAG7432 IMAG7433 IMAG7434 IMAG7435 IMAG7436 IMAG7437 IMAG7438 IMAG7439 IMAG7440 IMAG7441 IMAG7442 IMAG7443 IMAG7444 IMAG7445 IMAG7446 Cheers Jaime
  15. Dear All, While building my He 178 V1, which fought me every step of the build, I decided to build something really simple to have some breaks from the fight. I opted for a submarine. So, here is the build thread of my first modern submarine: the Hobby Boss 1/350 USS Greeneville. For starters, here are the mandatory pictures of the box art and box contents: IMAG7236 Apart from the hull halves and stand, there are only two sprues: IMAG7237 There's also a small PE fret: IMAG7238 Finally, a small decal sheet. However, according to the painting and decal instructions, decals 1, 6 and 7 are not used. IMAG7399 The build started with the sail and the horizontal tailplanes: IMAG7267 It was necessary to carve out indents for the foreplane. I overdid it, as only the curved indents were needed: IMAG7268 The foreplane was glued in place: IMAG7269 Indents were also carved out for the horizontal tailplanes: IMAG7270 The small submarine that piggybacked on the bigger sub was glued together: IMAG7271 A few holes had to be drilled out on the top hull half. These holes are for installing the pads on which the small submarine is installed: IMAG7272 The hull halves were glued together: IMAG7273 There are a few spots demanding attention. For instance, this rectangular depression near the horizontal fin of the small sub needs a piece of plasticard: IMAG7274 The areas around the foreplane also need attention, due to the excessive carving out: IMAG7291 IMAG7292 The sail was glued in place: IMAG7302 The pads for the small sub were then installed, as well as the mooring bollards : IMAG7303 IMAG7305 Finally, the tailplanes were glued in place: IMAG7310 That's all for now. Thanks for looking. Jaime
  16. U Boat Type VII C/41 Platinum Edition 1:72 Revell The Type VII submarine was based on earlier German designs. This type would go onto become the most used German submarines of WWII with over 700 being built. As with anything there would be many modifications along the way. The type started as the V11A with an initial 10 being built. The type VIIC would become the main boat of the German Navy with 568 being built between 1940 and 1945. With a range of 8500 nautical miles. The boats had 4 forward, and one stern tube in general (there were a few exceptions) with 14 torpedoes being carried. For surface running and battery charging a pair of supercharged 6 cylinder 4 stroke diesel engines were used which gave a top speed of 17.7 knots. A maximum submerged speed of 7.6 knots was possible with a new fully charged battery. The submarines generally carried a crew of 44 to 52 men in what can best be described as "cramped" conditions. For anyone familiar with the original "Das Boot" mini series U-96 was a Type VIIC. The Kit This boxing is a re-release of Revell's new tooling from 2003 which was released again in 2006. This new boxing is a Platinum edition, It contains all of the original plastic, two large sheets of photo etch, self adhesive wooden decks; and metal parts for the Periscopes (extended & retracted), snorkel mast, radar mast, nav lights, ensign staff, boom support, & gun barrels. such is the large number of these additional parts that a complete separate instruction book is provided for them. Construction begins with the torpedo tube, the modeller must decide whether to have them open or shut and then fit the respective parts into the hull sections. Once this is don't two internal bulkheads for strength are added in and the left/right hull sections can be joined. The stand can then be made up and the hull placed on it. Construction now moves to the stern and the details for the propeller shafts, propellers and supporting structure are added. Once these are on the stern planes and twin rudders can be added. Switching back to the bow, the bow planes are added along with the anchor and protective guides for the bow planes. Next the snorkel is made up, This part is moveable so care must be taken to follow the instructions if you want it to work. The snorkel is fitted into the appropriate deck section, and all the main deck sections can be added to the hull. Work now switches to the conning tower of the sub. The search and attack periscopes are made up installed into the decking along with the tower hatch, The upper tower deck and the lower one are then added into the tower superstructure. Radio masts and other item are then added in also. The deck extension for the anti aircraft gun is then added as well. The single 3.7cm flack gun can then be built up and added. Two additional twin barrelled 20mm Zwilling Anti aircraft guns are then made up and fitted to the tower decking as well. Once these are on various deck fittings, ladders and the railings are added. Finally the ensign staff can be added. The coning tower can then be added to the main hull. Thread is provided for the one forward and to aft wires from the conning tower along with the blocks for securing it. The hull is then finished of with a variety of smaller fittings. Platinum Edition As mentioned this is Revell's Platinum Edition which features two large sheets of photo etch, self adhesive wooden decks; and metal parts for the Periscopes (extended & retracted), snorkel mast, radar mast, nav lights, ensign staff, boom support, & gun barrels. such is the large number of these additional parts that a complete separate instruction book is provided for them and this must be read in conjunction with the main booklet. As expected there are many parts here and I suspect not for the beginner. The many fittings which will replace moulded on detail will look good on the model. The guns also benefit from many detail parts and metal barrels. All the railing will look much better in etch rather than plastic. Markings There are decals for U 997, U 995, U 295, U 324, U 307, U 1023, U 1002, U 1105 included on the sheet with diagrams to show the different paint schemes on individual boats as well as small histories of them. Conclusion It's good to see this kit re-issued as it makes up into an impressive model. The addition of the platinum parts should make a big difference over the kit plastic. Very highly recommended. Revell model kits are available from all good toy and model retailers. For further information visit or
  17. One way or another I have not been able to get to the model bench since April. While browsing the local hobby shop on a Sunday a few weeks ago I found this, which looked ideal as a quick build to get me going again. Not much to it. First task after putting the simple stand together was to blu-tak some fishing weights into the bottom of the lower hull, to give a bit of heft. Then it was fairly swift work and at the end of the first Sunday here was where I had got to: It needed a bit of filler along the join between the upper and lower hulls, but not much. The following weekend (last week) I got on with the painting, my usual brush painted Tamiya acrylics. I decided to make do with what I had "in stock", so the top part was painted XF-69 NATO Black, the underside XF-24 Dark Gray and the front dome XF-1 Black, as was the walkway on the topside. Here was where I was by the end of last weekend. This Sunday, it was a case of some minor touch ups and a couple of brushed on coats of floor polish before putting on the minimal number of decals. I also delay with the rather nice brass name plate by running thinned Italeri acrylic black into the engraved details, wiping away any excess. I needed to touch it up a few times, but eventually I was satisfied. A couple of coats of floor polish to protect the fragile Italeri paint and then I stuck it to to the black stand with some white glue. So here is where I am at today:
  18. Hey guys. No build log because I just did the plumbing, wiring and painting on this one. When I got it the interior had been done and the front hull was closed up so I never saw much of the interior although I did find a bunch of bits that the builder had left out... The Nelson Institute for Marine Research. A privately owned corporation with their own atomic powered submarine equipped with nuclear missiles, what could go wrong? This is the Moebius 1/128th scale TV version kit. I don't remember who did the lighting kit off the top of my head, but it seemed just a bit over done with some seriously heavy gauge wiring and over sized LEDs. It did include some light sheet for the control room overhead which was nice. I always liked the Irwin Allen craft. From the Jupiter 2 to the Seaview and the Flying sub, they just looked cool to me. And all the ancillary craft to go with it. The Flying sub was always one of my favorite ship. Even in 1/128th scale it looks good! The top hatch was replaced with a neodymium magnet to mount it in its hangar bay. I did break down and pick up the Paragrafix set for the mini sub. I liked the fold up interior but the decals were absolutely awful. One thick solid sheet of carrier film that didn't respond to any of my decal solvents. I wound up only using the stripe for the diving bell and dumped everything else. Okay! Now to find my seamonster suit and take this sucker down to the local swimming pool!... Thanks for looking guys!
  19. 😁😁 Very funny view submarine HNLMS Zeeleeuw, nobody wants to make such a diorama? B.R. Serge P.S. I'm worried about the yellow cart in the photo, no matter how she eats it! 😁
  20. So, inspired by the friendlyness of the forum I decided to try and start a build diary. Now, dont get excited. Its a ship Im not really that interested in so the passion level wont be at full steam. However, its was a kit that I bought cheaply, it will enable me to pick up where I left off as a kid and will enable me to try out new skills, and polish old skills. The plan is to build it to the highest level possible and see how it goes. It will use old skills, namely Gluing parts together Painting It will use skills that I have but never used on this kind of model Airbrushing Basic shading ie panel line accents And there are a few things Ive never done before Used Photo etched part wethering. The kit was bought from Wish and it was very cheap although took an age to arrive. Not much to the kit. From what I can see its a new tool 2012 and ooking at it it looks a simple build possibly with the photo ech testing me the most Here are some pics. Now I apologise for the orientation, these were all taken n my phone, the only method Ill use to take pics for the web. So, instructions look easy enough to follow, decals minimul but you have to expect that from a ship and it looks easy enough to crack on with. So, critique welcome and that includes both the kit building and the way Ive presented the post to you
  21. Royal Navy R Class Submarine (700121) 1:700 OKB Grigorov The R Class submarines were a class of 12 small submarines built for the Royal Navy during WWI. They had a hull designed for underwater performance and combined with diesel-electric propulsion gave a submerged speed of 14 knots, Streamlining of the vessel had some disadvantages in that they were hard to control on the surface and submerged. Technology at the time meant the battery took a full day to charge from the engine, but only an hour to drain at full speed! charging more often than not being done while moored. The vessels were armed with 6 tubes with the smaller 18" diameter. These would later be changed to normal 21". The kit The models (as there are 4 in box) arrive in the standard small sturdy cardboard box with a picture of one of the class underway. The models are 70mm long each, there are two small sets of resin and 4 small PE frets. The first model can depict either R1 or R2. The second model either R3 or R4. The third model is for R10 only, and the forth for R12 only. Conclusion This is another great little model of a British submarine. Recommended if you want something a bit different for your 1/700 submarine collection. Many thanks to OKB Grigorov for supplying the review sample.
  22. Itailian Enrico Toti Class Submarine (700116) 1:700 OKB Grigorov The Enrico Toti Class submarine was a class of 4 coastal submarines built for the Italian Navy in the 1960s. They are named after the 1920s Enrico Toti which was a Balilla Class Submarine, paying homage to Enrico Toti a WWI hero from Italy. These submarines were the first designed and built in Italy since WWII. They are comparable to the German type 205 boats. They were 46m long with a displacement of 535 tonnes. The kit The model arrives in the standard small sturdy cardboard box with a picture of one of the class moored alongside. The model is 65mm long. There are a couple of rein parts, PE Propeller and PE stand which has been used as the resin casting block came away on this example. Conclusion This is another great little model of a less well know submarine. Recommended if you want something a bit different for your 1/700 submarine collection. Many thanks to OKB Grigorov for supplying the review sample.
  23. Israeli Gal Class Submarine (700119) 1:700 OKB Grigorov The Gal Class submarine (or Type 540) is a modified version of the German HDW Type 206 Submarine. These boats which feature a districting bow dome were built to Israeli specifications by the then Vickers Shipyard in Barrow-In-Furness, in the UK. These were the first submarines built for the Israeli Navy to their own specifications, Politics dictating their being built in the UK rather than Germany. They were only 45m in length displacing 420 tonnes. At one point these Submarines were equipped with a retractable Blowpipe SAM system controlled from with the boat. 3 Vessels were built and all have now been decommissioned and replaced by the Dolphin Class. The kit The model arrives in the standard small sturdy cardboard box with a picture of one of the class underway. The model is 60mm long and there is a small PE Fret with the stand, and aneven smaller one with the propeller on it. Conclusion This is another great little model of a less well know submarine. Recommended if you want something a bit different for your 1/700 submarine collection. Many thanks to OKB Grigorov for supplying the review sample.
  24. Iranian Ghadir Class Submarine (700123) 1:700 OKB Grigorov The Ghadir class submarines are more of a midget submarine suited to coastal waters, they are only 29m long with a displacement of 117 tonnes with a crew of 18. These submarines are based on North Korean Yono Class. It is thought they have a pair of normal 21"/530mm torpedo tubes, and could also fire the VA-111 rocket torpedo. There are currently 23 in the Iranian Navy though details can be hard to pick out from the Propaganda surrounding any Iranian weapons system. The kit The models as there are two in the box arrive in the standard small sturdy cardboard box with a picture of one of the class moored underway. There is also a small PE fret for each boat, these provide a cradle and others parts including the prop for the sub. The model is 40mm long. Conclusion This is another great little model of a less well know submarine. Recommended if you want something a bit different for your 1/700 submarine collection. Many thanks to OKB Grigorov for supplying the review sample.
  25. This one has been in my stash since its original release back in 2013, and I admit to spending nearly 2 weeks trying to find it. This is the 2013 Pegasus Hobbies 'Artists Collection by Greg deSantis' conceptional release of Jules Verne's 'The Nautilus' moulded in a beautiful grey polystyrene plastic (main submarine kit) and grey vinyl (Squid, name disk and base). Prior to assembly, I primed the sprues down in Halfords Red/brown primer as a rusty base coat to work up from. I have not bothered with Para Graphix's additional photo-etch set as it does not really have enough on it to warrant the additional cost vs what you will actually see of it from outside looking in. I have enough spare bulbs and wire to produce my own internal lighting set and have put together a rather complicated lighting rig, only to later find out that what I have produced is actually available as a 3rd party lighting kit - again not worth the additional cost when you already have the necessary parts. I'll feed the power from the battery up to the sub along one of the Squids tentacles. It's a kit so of course it has its issues and niggles, but don't be put off by any online review negativities. Modellers overcome issues and this kit has few; so far I give the kit a well earned 99% for fit and well thought out assembly process. I have made a point of not using other online build references to aid in my own, I want this to be my own unique attempt. I've ordered a glass reptile type eye to replace the kit's squid eye and hope to present this on a miniature ocean floor diorama using the kits squid base and a backdrop of seabed ledges. The library windows - the kit provides a comprehensive mask set The side observation window lights fitted The side observation ribs - masked with Maskol Painted black inside to keep them light tight The lounge lighting You wont be able to see enough even when lit, so conventional dressed 1/144 figures were used as opposed to worrying about dressing them down to Victorian standards I used a defusing matt plastic to defuse the side and overhead LED lighting The organ pipes were added using 0.5mm plastic pipe Upper deck now fitted and side observation ribs fitted - here she is upside down
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