NG899

Thanks Selwyn! A link to the instruction sheet pdf: https://www.pdf-archive.com/2020/04/19/airfix-72-raf-nato-weapons-set-05041/airfix-72-raf-nato-weapons-set-05041.pdf Which is a useful crib sheet, I've now got a cunning plan... Cheers Nick

@Selwyn One for your memory banks... "The live rounds were overall matt EDSG with a 2"Golden Yellow And 1" wide Black band over the top half (only) of the warhead section (top of conduit to top of conduit)". Please can you clarify if the black band was in front of or behind the yellow one? Many thanks Nick P.S. From speaking with several ex-Bucc and ex-Phantom pilots who flew SHARs during the Falklands War, they operated in sea conditions on many days when Buccs and Phantoms on Ark would have been deck-bound. All aircraft have their capability envelopes and limits!

Thanks Troy and Kari.

GPS - thin white disc on a thin square mounting, with its corners rounded off slightly. Behind the cockpit serials were UHF aerials, a third carried under the port fuselage just ahead of the ventral fin. The GPS antenna replaced the starboard UHF aerial behind the cockpit which was relocated to the rear fuselage spine with the second GPS antenna behind it. Oil, upper and smaller, and fuel vents shown in the above photo near the starboard front nozzle. ZH809’s blue was roundel blue, confirmed by 899 maintainers back in the day. I never got a good answer for why they put the fuselage roundels where they did on it except that it was easier to pith them there than where they should have been to reflect the original markings of the FRS1. I think that answers the more recent posts. Cheers Nick

GPS aerial discs, which meant that the Doppler panels below the nose could be removed hence why they don’t appear in photos of later FA2s. Hope that helps, Nick

Thanks guys. Now if only there was a good photo to hand…? 🤔 Cheers Nick

I've a simple question for all the late-mark Spitfire gurus out there: When the downward pointing cameras were not installed were the ports sealed off with a glazing or cap of some kind? I'm building a 1/48 IAF FR.XVIII and know the aircraft I'm modelling HS654/NG didn't have the oblique cameras fitted, though I've kept the frame in situ. Having installed the under-fuselage ports, I'm now wondering whether/how to cap them before assembling the wings and fuselage. Many thanks for your help with this and, in return, should you ever need any Harrier help, please shout. All the very best Nick

Thanks Bob, the SHARs pylon adapter can be seen in the above photos of FA.2s, put simply, it’s the pointy thing directly above the missile. A similar adapter was used for WE.177A on the FRS.1. Cheers Nick

Thanks for that; I've amended the above post as your comments got me to look again at this photo of ZD615/723... I now think it also has one Sea Eagle and one 190-gal tank; probably overall EDSG or DSG. A second Sea Eagle's fins would be visible below the fuselage. (I did think for a while it may be a 100-gal tank to port, but amount of the LAU-7A rail the tank hides and the length of the Sea Eagle, the tip of which when fitted was closer to where the tip of a 190 is, means this is most likely a 190DT.) Cheers Nick (Who's finally joined Flickr this morning to enable me to upload photos here!)

Hello Selwyn, Bob, et al, Many thanks for your additions above. This is one of only three photos I know of showing a Sea Harrier loaded with a live Sea Eagle, FA.2 ZD608/717 of the FA.2 OEU in c.1994-5 when they were undertaking trials as part of the FA.2s operational release to service. ZD608 has what looks to be an early 190-gal tank in Extra Dk Sea Grey and white to port and a single AIM-9 ACQN pod on the port outboard. The light undersides of the tank could be reflection off the concrete and it's more likely the tank is overall EDSG. I believe it's a 190 rather than a 100-gal tank due to the amount of the LAU-7A rail on the port outboard pylon it hides, and based on discussions with an ex-CO of 899 NAS. At the time FA.2s still had the Doppler panels fitted and no GPS discs fitted; they were a few years away from respectively being removed and added. (The aircraft being part of the OEU would account for the lack of 899 NAS winged fists, the FA.2 OEU was a part of 899 hence the usual 899 side code range.) I presume the dayglo red was for photographic reasons after the trial drops. There look to be two black and white quartered discs on the rear of the missile, one on the side of the intake (overall EDSG or black?) and one below the conduit ahead of the rear fin. FA.2 ZD615/723 (seen behind) carried one Sea Eagle, also with a 190-gal tank and a single ACQN pod to port, but had the gun pods replaced with strakes and it had an empty centreline pylon. ZD608 looks to have an empty centreline pylon fitted too from close examination of the photo. All corrections gratefully received! Cheers Nick

For the curious, the text of my reply to Paul... A very interesting question and one that’s hard to answer 100%. Finding photos of either type carrying anything but test or drill rounds is almost impossible. Where you see them at an air show’s static park, I’d always take it with a pinch of salt as to whether that was an operational load. This is my best shot... FRS.1 - It was envisaged that Sea Eagle would be carried in pairs (on the inboard pylons) giving the FRS.1 a range of c.280nm radius from the carrier; the Sea Eagle has a range of c.70nm. Whether 9Ls were carried as well would depend on the threat expected from an enemy air arm and fuel capacity! Examples used in trials... XZ438/38 in testing, during 1982-3, Sae Eagle was carried on both inboards with either outer pylons removed or AIM-9L test rounds carried. XZ440/40 in trials, 1983-4, carried a camera pod on the centre line - modified from the GR.1/3 recce pod and a 190-gal tank on the starboard side. This would make sense if it was being used for anti-shipping strikes - the FRS1 had limited range and, if you’re going to use Sea Eagle, you want to be attacking ships well beyond the range of any shipboard ASMs being carried by the fleet. XZ450/50 was used in the 1982 trails and was sadly lost at Goose Green - with the Argentines finding the Sea Eagle controls there, their inclusion had meant that the rear RWR connections were removed which probably led directly to it being shot down with the loss of Lt Nick Taylor. XZ497/4 was flown by Mike Snelling (BAe test pilot) with twin LAU-7A rails outboard and test rounds in July 1982; this was also testing the twin LAU-7A rails developed based on the lessons of the Falklands War to carry more AAMs. Whether this would have been a war-time load out remains conjectural, considering the SHARs limited range already mentioned. Had it been fitted with an AAR probe too and there been a Fleet tanker operational…? FA.2 - While focusing on air-defence and ground attack, the FA.2 was cleared for Sea Eagle and the controls remained in its cockpit after the missile was withdrawn as a cost-saving measure. The only operational photos I have are of two 899 jets - ZD615/723 and ZD608/717 in 1994 during flying (dropping?) trials, both carrying two Sea Eagles on the inboard pylons. ZD615 had strakes fitted, empty centre-line and starboard outboard pylons and an AIM-9 Acquisition round on the port outboard pylon. ZD608 had gun pods fitted and the same starboard side configuration with, presumably, the same port side load out as ZD615. Both jets carried air-to-air refuelling probes and I’d work on this being the standard FA.2 configuration. Both FA.2s are in the overall Medium Sea Grey scheme with Doppler panels under the nose and no GPS aerials; white side codes and Royal Navy titles on the fins which are without 899's winged fist insignia. The Sea Eagleslook to have MSG bodies to the front fins then Dark Sea Grey bodies rearwards to the tailcone which, with the fins and conduits down the missiles' sides were daylgo red. The intake underneath and its jettison-able cover look to be DSG. These are probably test rounds, i.e. for carrying and dropping but not for use against a target. AFAIK, live rounds were overall grey; I’m seeking confirmation of this. Hope that helps Nick

Paul, drop me a PM with your email address in it and I’ll send you some things to help you. Cheers Nick

Binbrook87, Drop me a PM with your email and home address in it and I’ll send you a spare. Cheers Nick

One word, three syllables - A-maz-ing! Congratulations Peter 🍾

Thanks for the link, fingers crossed 🤞

A superb build 'Never a Pro', I think you're now 'Pro with Wings'! I've always loved DH.88 'Black Magic', the same colours as the F1 Lotus JPS livery from when I was a lad, were inspiring! I found this build when searching for 1/48 kits of the DH.88, having just completed AMP's 1/48 Supermarine S.6B. "Never a Pro's" build inspired me to get Mikro Mir's kit only to find that in the latest boxing the only decals provided are for G-ACSS 'Grosvenor House' - gutted. The 'Black Magic' option on the box side is taped over and the instructions changed, though the kit is still ref 48-017. Caveat emptor! The kind folks at Hannants have contacted MM for me only to be told that "renewal of the gold decals is impossible until the end of the war". (Decograph are also Ukraine-based.) If anyone has any unwanted decals for 'Black Magic' from the MM original boxing, please let me know; I'd be very happy to have them. Please drop me a PM with your email in it and I'll get back to you asap. Many thanks! Slava Ukraini! Nick

Gorgeous! That looks a tad lighter than the Vallejo Ultramarine I used on my AMP 1/48 S.6B recently, almost wishing I'd been bold and added some white to it... if only for scale effect! No, I'll not be repainting it! Peter, I cannot wait to see the completed model. Cheers Nick

Stratto, Drop me a PM with your email address in it and I’ll lob you some things over to help you. Big tip… work out the colour schemes you’d like to make each mark in, from that you can work back to squadron and potential loadouts. The info I have can help you there. I’m NOT a 1/72 builder but from what I’ve heard, the kits I’d use are: GR1 - Airfix. (Better than the Hasegawa one.) GR3 -Airfix, adjusting the fin tip height, an easy fix. (Ditto.) FRS1- Esci. (Now boxed by Italeri iirc. Fujimi also did a reasonable FRS1.) FA2 - Esci, using the Airfix FA2 radome suitably modified, adjusting the wings and adding the plug behind the wings from scratch. GR7/9 - Airfix. Dave Fleming please feel free to chip in! Finally, remember despite being modest little grey/green or grey jets, “Harriers are complex beasts!” Lots of traps for the unwary. All the best Nick

INCREDIBLE! Superb work Peter. 👏 I'm very fortunate to have had your build going on as I made AMP's new 1/48 scale S.6B, which needs quite a few mods to get it to the race spec and have had fun scratch-building the trolley, trestles and chocks to display S1595 on, in her weathered state after winning the 1931 race. Btw, if it helps you, for the trolley's colours I opted for are salt-stained creosoted wood with a medium grey paint for the under frame (it was probably painted with a readily available marine paint?) and wheel spokes, only the rims have a small trace of NM on them. I used Metallic Details' PO-2 wheels. Looking forward to seeing her in "Supermarine Blue". Cheers Nick

@corsaircorp We (the Harrier SIG) never had the chance to review the Kinetic instructions until the GR1/3 // AV-8A kits. 🥲 ALL readers of this post - if anyone needs some build notes produced for the Harrier SIG on improving Kinetic's FRS.1 kit (90%+ of which is applicable to the GR1/3 kit) or more info on all first generation Harrier airframes to help you with your builds, please drop me a PM including your email address in it and brief details of the help you need for your project - mark, squadron, period - then wait for a heavy VL on your Inbox or a lighter one with a WeTransfer link in it. To avoid repetition I recommend the Black Dog resin sets to go with the Kinetic kits. A48169 - Corrected post-1970 100-gallon tanks; Aden gun pods; all pylons (GR1/3 and FRS1/FA2); fuel vent; Martin-Baker Mk10H seat (FRS1/FA2); LAU-7A rail ADU-299 pylon adapter (FRS1 1979 to mid/late 80s; some GR3 on the Falklands), etc. https://blackdog-model.com/a48169-1-48-bae-harrier-sea-harrier-accessories-set-en/ A48195 - Corrected 190-gallon tanks for FRS.1s and FA.2s (ONLY!); Ferry Wing Tips and the extended T2/4/8 air-to-air refuelling probe. https://blackdog-model.com/a48195-1-48-british-harrier-190gallon-tanks-ferry-wing-tips-en/ SIG members had input to these and their other GR1/3 and GR7/9 resins, so we can vouch for their accuracy, within the limits of what's possible. Why were these issues not fixed by Kinetic for/ after the FA2 was released, I hear you ask? For valid commercial reasons. If we were starting again, things would be done differently but, once several runners had been designed to run across all the kits which contained errors for the first kit, the numbers mitigated against decisions being made to change those items. I don't run a company in the business that Kinetic is in but I trust the person who does to make the right commercial decisions. Personally, I'd rather have the Kinetic kits we now have, with their issues, than not. We're modellers after all! [I DO NOT WANT THIS TO BECOMING A SLAGGING-OFF KINETIC OR OTHER MANUFACTURERS THREAD, SO THIS IS THE END OF THIS DISCUSSION HERE PLEASE; THANK YOU.] I'm ALWAYS happy to help folks out, especially before any of the common errors are made, e.g. white intake interiors when they shouldn't be; dropped ailerons (Harrier IIs only!), load outs, etc. (I've seen too many otherwise lovely models of Harriers or SHARs spoiled by some of those, on this and other websites.) Before folks ask - the Harrier SIG no longer has a website - too expensive and no one willing to be our webmaster; nor do we have a Facebook presence, out of personal preferences. Hope that helps, all the best Nick

That's a superb looking model Chris, congratulations! Which period of her life are you depicting Invincible in? If Falklands, then for your FRS1s please do not use the Airfix 1/72 kits - they're poor! The Italeri / Esci / Fuji ones are much better. Please drop me a PM with your email address in it if you need more info on the 801 NAS FRS1s on Invincible during the Falklands War and some photos of Invincible on departure and return. As for the tanks, Sea Harriers used distilled water injected into the engine during hovering and vertical landings to help the engine run at high power for longer. They were both fitted when the carrier left Portsmouth on 5 April 1982. All the best Nick

Andy, When you do your next Falklands FRS1 drop me a PM with your email in it and I’ll send you some things to help you. As for the stencils being overpainted or not the best simple answer I can give you is “it depends”… on the airframe and which carrier it was on. Cheers Nick

It all depends on whether you’re making a GR7/7A or GR9/9A. The GR7/7As two-greys scheme was Dk Sea Grey upper surfaces with Dk Camouflage Grey sides and undersides. The GR9/9As were usually overall Medium Sea Grey as seen in ZG477 and on ZD433’s wings, the latter being one of the patchwork quilt aircraft sporting all three greys as panels and components were exchanged between airframes. To best help you, tell me the serial of the aircraft you’re making and squadron or year. I can then check photos and get back to you. Dropping me a PM with your email in it will help too. Cheers Nick

The prop needed a fair bit of flash removing but I went with it having looked at the photos here: http://www.primeportal.net/hangar/mark_hayward/supermarine_s.6b_s1595/ and in the S.6B Haynes Manual and those of S.6A N248 on the web. It looks fine on the model. For an S.6, despite the kit providing decals for N247 and N248, the floats are S.6B floats as fitted to them as S.6As in 1931. For a 1929 contest S.6, The floats need reducing in size quite a bit, maybe milliput inside their fronts and rears and then sand to shape. I've mentioned the Haynes manual a few times and see you're in Switzerland, here's a link for a start: https://www.amazon.com/Supermarine-Rolls-Royce-Owners-Workshop-Manual/dp/1785212265 Keep top the great work Cheers Nick

You’re brave taking on that kit, we’ll done. In terms of accuracy, on the way south the lower surface white was oversprayed EDSG on 801 NAS aircraft on HMS Invincible*, as were the underwing serials, with the white code numbers being overpainted roundel blue as we’re the white areas of the roundels. The vinyl fin markings and pilot’s names were also removed and those areas oversprayed EDSG. Now, the order the toning down was done in has never been clarified but it is likely that each plane was removed from the flying roster and completely toned down before returning to flying duties. A lot of training sorties were flown en route south. *On HMS Hermes the toning down was done using 3ins or 4ins brushes, some of it on deck as the carrier approached Ascension. Hope that helps clarify things. Nick