Tom Zeller

Yes, I know. Spellcheck got me again! Thanks for the catch. I appreciate your additional info. i

I searched for this info here and several other places but haven’t been able to find a comprehensive list of aircraft flown by him during his career during WWII and post-war. This is what I have so far. Please add to it if you can by providing as much info as you have about the aircraft and when he flew it. Here’s what I have now: Wartime Aircraft “K2” Messerschmitt Bf 109G-4 W.Nr. ? 7/JG52 May 1943 Source: Hasegawa kit # 09303 Special Version “Yellow 1” Messerschmitt Bf 109G-6 W.Nr. 20499 9/JG52 October 1943 Source: AeroMaster Decal Set 48-706 “Ace of Aces — Erich Hartmann” “Yellow 1” Messerschmitt Bf 109G-6 W.Nr. 166221 9/JG52 August 1944 Source: AeroMaster Decal Set 48-706 “Ace of Aces — Erich Hartmann” “White 1” Messerschmitt Bf 109G-6 W.Nr. ? 7/JG52 October 1944 Source: AeroMaster Decal Set 48-706 “Ace of Aces — Erich Hartmann” “White 1” Messerschmitt Bf 109G-14 W.Nr. ? 4/JG52 October 1944 Source: Hasegawa kit # 07447 Limited Edition “Gruppenkommandeur” MesserschmittBf 109G-6 W.Nr. ? JG53 February 1945 Source: AeroMaster Decal Set 48-706 “Ace of Aces — Erich Hartmann” “Gruppenkommandeur” Messerschmitt Bf 109G-10 W.Nr. 610937 JG52 April 1945 Source: AeroMaster Decal Set 48-706 “Ace of Aces — Erich Hartmann” From here we see some contention. For example, Hasegawa kit # 09148 presents the 109 AeroMaster says is a Gruppenkommandeur’s G-6 as a G-14. Also there is disagreement over whether he flew an Me Bf 109K-4 or not. Peddinghaus sells the decals for “Black 4” with a red tulip on the nose instead of the usual black tulip pattern. Post-War Aircraft We know Hartmann flew the F-84 in training but I don’t have any more info about the aircraft than that. ”JA-111” Canadair Sabre MK. 6 “Black Tulip” JG71 “Richthofen” 1961 - 1962? Source: Hasegawa kit # 09532 Special Version and finally the F-104 he despised so much it ended his career.

AeroMaster decals says it is W.Nr. 20499 This is from their “Ace of Aces — Erich Hartmann” decal set 48-706. Hope this helps.

I’m just flipping through posts looking for useful info and ideas after having managed to get ahold of Magna Models 1/48 Sea Devon. I have to say this build took my breath away! Just a beautiful build! Definitely set the bar quite high.

You’re not going to keep an official page going if the company is on hiatus. Monitoring and answering that page is part of being active not being on hiatus. Besides the public group is very strong with over 4,600 members and most questions that might come up can likely be answered there. I’m not saying they’re not gone for good but neither is there any certainty yet that they are. So far as I’m aware of the only comment from Kitty Hawk themselves is that they are closing production down due to Covid and shipping costs. They didn’t say the company itself was closed. They said they aren’t producing for now.

I’ve read that due to the limitations imposed by the pandemic that Kitty Hawk was suspending operations until they got enough more orders from venders. That doesn’t sound like a “goodbye” to me but rather a hiatus. Is there any confirmation that they’re gone for good? If not I think it best not to say they are, but rather acknowledge that the possibility exists with no certainty that it has happened. As for Kitty Hawk’s kits, their quality, and answers for them I’ve found them to be like most kit makers whose products I’ve bought to be a mixed bag. Neither universally good nor universally bad. I have some of their kits and have been largely happy with them - especially the recent Fury 2 and just out Fury 3 kits. They’re well worth getting IMHO.

The Hasegawa will suit my purposes for creating a PR MK. XI. Sure I could probably horseshoe the kit to fit but unless I have some compelling reason I'd just as soon do what the kit recommends. I did say that I'm buying Eduard's three MK. IX kits which will be sufficiant to show that progression of Spitfire development. The PR MK. XI is a part of a side project showing the development of photo recon Spits. I don't need an Eduard kit for that. The whole endeavour is far from cheap so I will find savings where I can. I got the Hasewaga quite inexpensively. It would be inadvisable to throw it away and buy an Eduard at this point. Thanks again for your suggestions.

Yep, I quite agree re: Eduard for MK. IX Spits. I do have all three of theirs in my plans. However, as I said in my post, the Quickboost PR MK. XI coversion kit requires the Hasewaga. Thanks very much for your reply and the link. I appreciate all your help. - Tom Thanks, 303! I think that's the very picture I saw in my research. Good to know I'm not completely bonkers. - Tom

Thanks for answering so quickly, Troy. I would try fitting them if they were both here but the Hasagawa is enroute still. Doing some ordering and I thought I'd get a jump on it. I have seen the XI wearing a slipper and it was in my history reading that I even came across this. It's an important mark to my project because, at least according to my reading, the PR XI was the most produced PR. The reading stated that the PR. XI was an adapted MK. IX and that is indeed what Quickboost calls for in their kit. I appreciate the link. I'll look through it. I guess I'll just order the slipper tank later if I need it. No biggie. Just thought someone might've already done the Quickboost conversion and would know. - Tom

One of the builds I have planned is a conversion of the 1/48 Hasegawa Spitfire MK IX to a PR. MK. XI using the Quickboost parts. In my reading I noted that the PR. MK. XI often used a 90 gal. slipper tank which Quickboost does sell for the Hasegawa MK IX. In getting other builds ready I noticed my Airfix Spitfire MK. I kit with all the wonderful extra parts in the newer red box has a 90 gal. slipper tank. Will this fit the Hasegawa or do I really need the Quickboost slipper tank because of fuselage width? TIA

I've been doing a lot of reading for my Spitfire project and along the way I read that the MK XII was the first Spit to be equipped with a Griffin but they used MK IX fuselages that were adapted to accomodate the Griffon. The Spitfire MK XIV and later Spitfires and Seafires has fuselages that were designed for the Griffon rather than being adapted Merlin fuselages. I would surmise that this was the reason for the magnetos' bump.

I don't know Mosquitoes that well but ScaleMates says this canopy mask from Montex will work on more than one Mosquito including the 1/48 Airfix PR. XVI. https://www.scalemates.com/kits/198940-montex-mm48230-dh-98-mosquito-b-mk-xvi-pr-xvi

Thanks, Graeme! I appreciate the info very much. I hadn't seen those. Yours and Troy's additional info are quite helpful. Tom

I'm sorry you've taken an adversarial stance. That wasn't my intention. You express concern with having threads "spread all over the place" while I'm concerned with having to sift through a bunch of posts to find what I'm looking for. I think it better to have threads about the topic title. Silly me.

Thank you so very much, Tbolt! This is exactly the kind of answer I was hoping for. You answered all my questions perfectly. I now know which way to go in my build. I'll get the Brengun flaps and sell the Eduard ones that came in my Big Ed packet. Historical accuacy is met best by the Brengun flaps as you made quite clear. I do see your point about the extra work involved in getting them to sit right on the wings but I'm up for the task. I may be new to this forum but I'm an experianced model builder having gotten my start way back in 1967. Kind Regards, Tom

I see, so being a new member I have no right to expect an answer is that it? Speaking of behavior yours is hardly welcoming. If it were me being a long time member I'd be incouraging to a new member as I have many times in the other web based and social media groups I belong to and those I administer.. Fortunately I finally got a good answer of which I am quite appreciative.

Wouldn't it have been better if people put as much effort as your post and the others into creating their own threads about it? It takes all of two seconds and it's just simple politeness. All anyone need do in any such case is start their own thread with, "I saw such and such on someone else's thread and not to take anything away from their thread I started my discussion here." Not that hard is it? It's what happens in virtually every other web group I belong to. It's just that there have been six posts here by others none of which are in any way related to my question and now you're taking it off on yet another tangent. Additionally, I think I should say that I did thank the first two replies for at least being about Wellingtons if not my question. That and I have no issue about tangents provided they aren't the only thing in the thread at all and nothing at all about what was asked. Hijacking a thread is something very different from the occasional tangent in discussion. I don't think that's unreasonable. - Tom

So far my looking for answers in the forums is not off to a very good start. Six replies and not a one in answer to my question and most of them not even in any way related to my question. Color me disappointed.

Gee, I hope somebody actually reads my question and answers it rather than hijacking my request for information about PE flaps into a thread about bomb color. Five replies and not a one in answer to what I was asking. .

Thanks for the replies guys. I do appreciate the time you took to make them. However, my questions did not include if flaps were raised or not on the ground. I'll see if I can try Troy's suggestion and rename the thread to hopefully get the answers I'm looking for.

Hey folks. As I mentioned in my newbie introduction I have a project starting that involves building the majority of the aircraft that took part in the Battle of Britain. One of my kits I'm about to start is Trumpeter's 1/48 Wellington MK. Ic. I was fortunate enough to be able to buy Eduard's "Big Ed" set for this kit which, of course, included photo etch flaps. In my researching of parts I discovered Brengun's flaps add-on for the Wellington that besides the PE also includes what looks like rather nice resin parts as well. Money is not a problem, but I do consider whether or not it's worth getting a part that I already have in another probably lesser form. What's of prime interest to me is historical accuracy so I'm giving this some serious thought. Anybody out there work with the Brengun flaps who might care to comment? Will I gain much by using the Brengun over the Eduard flaps? Can I use the Eduard PE if it's nicer with the Brengun resin parts successfully? For those interested in what I'm talking about here's a link to Hyperscale's page on it. http://www.hyperscale.com/2013/reviews/accessories/brengunbrl48043reviewbf_1.htm

Thanks, Troy! I appreciate all the help I can get and especially info sources. I'm used to voluminous reading so the more the merrier.

As of right now about 30 Spitfires, Seafires, and Prototypes thereof, Gorby. Even money that that total will grow before much longer. I'm standardizing on 1/48 scale since that's the largest I can go and so see best the design paths and changes. Yes, I am super detailing. Accuracy is most important so I'm not adding things purely because more is cooler, but the idea is to show the particular mark as close to how it would've been seen IRL as possible. I am, however, adding things not always required like extended range fuel tanks, drop tanks, bombs, etc. where appropriate to show capabilities at the given time. Yes, they aren't cheap to begin with in most cases and the parts, decals, etc. certainly add to it. After 35 years in the Army though I didn't retire too shabbily. I'll be fine though I appreciate your concern. I was severely wounded on my last deployment which limits the kinds of things I can do so these projects are more than an academic endeavor, and pure fun, they're also real and well documented therapy. I've found it really helps and more than I expected it to now that I have the time to devote to it. And besides being retired I have years to work on my masters. No looming deadline here. Thanks for the warning about reading posts. I'm afraid you're a bit too late on that. Thanks, guys for the nice words about Baldur. Yes, he is named for the Norse god as is my custom with my German Shepherds. Baldur's my first service dog but he's my ninth German Shepherd. I have a 2 year old black German Shepherd named Váli (another Norse god) as well who's in training to be Baldur's successor now that Baldur's past 9 and I can't be without a service dog or professional care the rest of my life. They are more than PTSD dogs they're also and primarily medical services dogs and perform a job that quite literally keeps me alive. I often describe Baldur as the best thing the Army ever gave me. Both dogs are brilliant and utterly loyal and devoted in the extreme if I do say so. Baldur is exceptionally so even for a German Shepherd. His trainers cautioned me to not judge his successors by him. They both said he was the best service dog they ever trained or ever imagined they would. I don't bemoan my wounds but rather I count myself lucky. I have much to be thankful for.

Thanks for the warm welcome fellas! Bunch of new parts just came in from the UK and I'm chaffing at the bit to get started! But because I'm going for super detail and ultimate possible historical accuracy I can't just grab a kit and go. Just about all the Spits require nearly a dozen third party parts most of which are not to be found in the US or if they are found are at stupid prices. It's actually cheaper for me to buy my kits in Canada and the parts I need in Australia, New Zealand and the UK. Not just Spits coming in though. Getting these projects going also entails a lot of other birds for the BoB project. And I'm afraid I've gotten interested in aircraft that came after the BoB just because they're so cool like the Typhoon and the Lancaster. Lots of kits going. I'm not daunted though. I started building models way back in 1967. Up until quite recently I've been building almost entirely sci fi with an occasional kitsch kit here and there just to break things up. Retirement though has set my sails in new directions. I'm really glad I found you folks. I've been reading your posts quite a lot and it's time to join the party! Tom P.S. In case you're wondering that's my service dog, Baldur, in my profile pic. He's a white German Shepherd and incredibly smart even for a GSD so the pic is really a spoof. He keeps me going both mentally and physically.