jpk
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Posts posted by jpk
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First, I never said the CA kit was perfect, obviously it was not, just the most accurate. And at the time, it was up until KH decided to do theirs. Your photos above for comparison are not from the same angle so it is not really a valid comparison. When I had the CA kit I overlaid a fuselage half over reasonably accurate drawings and the two lined up well. Also, I have it based on fairly good sources that KH bought and imported several CA kits, one of which was the Fury during their startup. Did they line for line copy it? Perhaps not but it is certainly likely they used it somewhat in the planning of their own kit using it along with other available resources. There are a few familiar modeling and research names that were feeding KH with reference material as well, hoping to help them make more accurate kits.
I certainly appreciate your contribution of the photos and reference materials on the Fury as I am sure many others here do as well. I know it has not only helped me enriched my knowledge base as well as wealthily adding to my previously obtained reference material on the Fury. That being said, there may be information that you may not have been exposed to regarding KH and their beginnings.
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18 hours ago, Gene K said:
I agree. Thank you Collect Aire.
Gene K
Thank you Dimitri Malkov. He mastered the CA -3 Fury.
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4 hours ago, PZRGREN said:
This one seems to be the Hasegawa version?! It isnt my auction but I do have one in the stash.
Unless you can get it cheap, Eduard originally really overcharged for this kit. it was $100.00 retail. Basically the Hasegawa kit and a couple bits of resin.
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On 2/12/2020 at 7:19 PM, BushBrit66 said:
While the Hobbycraft early models are a bit wide around the canopy, their later mark does have a different fws fusualage for the M/N variants.
Hobbycraft more or less copied the Monogram A-4E kit if I recall. It has been a long time since I had the kits. That is the reason for the wider than accurate front windscreen. The clamshell canopy also had a slight issue with the plexi line towards where it starts to curve up. The line is abrupt and not the curve the real canopy had. Other than that I don't recall much else wrong with it. I could be wrong. One good thing is they did a B, C and E as well as later versions too well before Hasegawa. They also came with a goodly assortment of stuff to hang on it as well.
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The Hobbycraft kit also has issues around the canopy as well. The only 1/48 Skyhawk with the correct LE slats that I am aware of is the Classic Airframes TA-4F/J. They eliminated the step cutout. Looks like they pretty much copied the Hasegawa A-4E kit when making their two seater. The Hasegawa kit had not been released at the time. I believe the CA wing will fit just fine in the Hase kit if it is an issue for you.
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Like as has been mentioned the Hasegawa line of Skyhawks are the best when available. There are reviews of the Hobby Boss kit online. I believe one of the issues is the leading edge slats are molded closed. They were always open when on the ground. Beyond that I have not heard of any other major issues. Others may know more.
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The only real problem I have with the seat is the head rest. I think it is too large and lacks detail. A shame since the rest of the kit is so well executed. The canopy will not close completely with the canopy resting on top of the head rest so you either build with an open canopy or cut down the seat. However, overall I'm pretty happy with the kit and think that it is one of the best, if not the best KH kit that I have bought or that they have done. Certainly it is their best in 1/48th.
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A few comments on the above. Jeffrey at Hypersonic is in addition to the control surfaces, is doing a seat and cockpit with the corrected turtleback area behind the seat. I sent Jeffrey some photos that were graciously provided by a gent and crew at the USS Hornet Museum of the area behind the seat on their FJ-2. He may be going to do a corrected nose gear strut but I believe he is still just contemplating that.
I cut my nose gear strut where the oleo should be and inserted about a 1/8" length of brass tube with a trimmed paper clip rod inserted within. I then drilled out the upper and lower arts of the strut and CA'ed the new oleo in. I then completed the rest of the strut. One thing that I will do differently will be the mount of the coiled spring, (shimmy damper, thanks Tommy), that mounts to the lower strut. I will shave the mounts to allow a better fit of the spring/strut point of attachment. The nose gear is a bit fiddly but I think with some careful building KH pretty much got everything in the nose gear structure correct except for the oleo. I'd like to post a photo but I can't upload from my computer.
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As for whether or not the KH is kit based from the CA Fury, you can take it to the bank. They did. That is not the only one. They also copied the CA F-84 Starfire. They may have also used the Cougar.
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That is what I am going to do. Like you I will probably give it a little boost with some sheet. If you examine closely the GP fuselage as well as the HB one are just a little slimmer than the KH kit's. Since you still have your CA Fury I'd like to hear your comparison of it to the KH -2. If I recall correctly the CA kit was a little chubby compared to the other -4 kits. As I'm sure you are aware the 3's and 4's both used the same engine and the fuselages were essentially the same except for the spine and taller fin.
I believe the GP resin was designed by AIRES resin and maybe the set is still available. Good source for another seat.
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20 hours ago, Corey in Colorado said:
I think the Kitty Hawk seat is over-scale and the cockpit tub was designed around it. That’s why the other seats are too narrow. I plan on using the GP seats, and maybe jacking them up slightly with sheet styrene.
Interestingly, I found the cockpit on the Kitty Hawk Banshee to be under-scale and ended up rebuilding it to a more realistic size.
corey
I had the Collect Aire FJ-3 Fury, actually three, and I believe the KH Fury benefited from it. I have it on good authority they, KH, imported several of the more accurate CA kits to use as design mules and one of those kits was the CA, -3 Fury. The seat in the KH kit looks very similar dimensionally to what I remember the CA Fury's seat was like so it may very well be over sized. Now looking at mine in the fuselage it does appear to be a little bigger than it should be. It looks like it sits a little too proud above the cockpit sill. The two seats, HB and GP, seem too narrow for the cockpit in the KH kit though if you thought about using them. I wonder if the entire HB cockpit might fit in the KH fuselage. I'll take a look at that as I have a spare HB FJ-4 that I had probably damaged beyond retrieval.
Incidentally, if Sabrejet happens to read this thread, I'd like to ask him if in his archives, he has any photos of Glossy Sea Blue FJ-2's.
Comparing now the three seats. while the KH one does seem a bit too large the other two look too small even in the -4 fuselage and cockpit. Perhaps the truth is somewhere between.
Sometimes I can't leave well enough alone. I've decided to use the Grand Phoenix seat however I am also going to remove the launch rails from the cockpit and use them in the KH cockpit. I'm hoping that will fill the cockpit up a bit.
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Some additional stuff. I've been in conversation with Jeffrey K over at Hypersonic Models and he seems interested in creating rib-less control surfaces for the Kitty Hawk FJ-2 Fury. Specifically the rudder and horizonal stabs. He is also taking a look at possibly making a detail/correction set for the area behind the cockpit for the Fury as well. As pointed out by Sabrejet, that area is pretty much blank on the kit while in reality is has a lot going on in there. These factory diagrams are helpful for him to assess the feasibility of doing that. I would guess the set could be used with the forthcoming FJ-3 Fury from Kitty Hawk as well. If anyone has any additional photos or diagrams of that area it would be helpful to Jeffrey. You can post them here or contact him directly at Hypersonic. Thanks.
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Thanks SJ. That is very helpful. Do you have anything more specific on the radio compass and the configuration on the mount? Also the armor plate which is also missing? Thanks.
Addendum SJ; I have both the Grand Phoenix and the Hobby Boss -4 Fury. The GP kit, it has a resin cockpit. From what I can tell the -3 and -4 had the same, or almost the same ejection seat, as well as cockpit for the most part. The resin seat is far more detailed than the KH kit parts so I thought I might try it in the KH tub but it is too narrow. I also tried the Hobby Boss seat which is also nice but it was too small as well. The GP seat and cockpit has the seat guide rails which are apparent in the photos you posted. I'm going to get some Evergreen U channel to use for the rails. If you have a diagram that shows the armor plate shape and the radio compass mount that would be great.
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8 hours ago, Sabrejet said:
Emailed the seller for an update but no reply yet. Mine still showing as 22Nov delivery.
My very minor nits. The short oleo on the nose strut, The ribbed horizontal stabs (not really incorrect just late production addition for both the -2 and -3), the incorrectly shaped catapult bridle hook recess(correct for a -3), the engine looks to be for a -3. There may be more that you will find but I feel KH did an excellent job overall here with the Fury. One last thing. The instructions show to install the Sidewinders and pylons on the last page. To my understanding the FJ-2 was not Sidewinder capable. Nor was the slat wing FJ-3 so to be correct these should not be mounted.
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On 11/16/2019 at 8:12 AM, Sabrejet said:
Mine's due next week: I'll do a review as soon as I get it.
Got mine today. You will love it Sabrejet. I did a short in box review on Hyper Scale.
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Just got mine today. Looking at it now. I am impressed at first blush.
I wrote an in box review over on Hyper Scale.
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1 hour ago, Gene K said:
Could you provide a link, please?
Gene K
Just go to eBay and enter "Kitty Hawk 1/48 FJ-2 Fury" in the search window.
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It appears the Kitty Hawk FJ-2 Fury is finally released. It is available on eBay from China. I have ordered one and it is supposed to arrive by Dec 7th.
An addendum: I ordered the Fury around 7pm on the 13th and my shipping notice arrived yesterday evening. The kit is being shipped FedEx and is scheduled to be here Monday the 18th, not Dec 7th. Now that is fast. If it shows up.
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Just a little thing. Didn't the shape of the catapult attachment hook recess change between the -2 and -3? I don't recall which way it went, rectangle to trapezoid or the other way. A very minor thing overall. It certainly would not affect my buying the kit. Over on Cybermodeler they have the FJ-3 listed as a 4Q 19 release so maybe they will both be released in sequence fairly quickly before the end of the year.
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Interesting photos. HLJ did not show anything from KH/Panda other than military vehicles at the AJM&HS. Again a curious mix of -2/3 parts. Looks to have the -3 rear fuselage with the proper intakes and the -3 cambered wing. Hard to tell from the angles but it could be a -2 forward fuselage. I would guess no because of the ammo bay door. There are a bunch of photos elsewhere online showing their kitted slatted wing as well as a rear fuselage with the -2 intakes. Obviously we've seen the -2 nose quite a bit recently. I believe they've made mold inserts for the two versions utilizing a master mold for the major common elements. Inserts for the 2 nose intake and lower forward fuselage, inserts for the rear intakes and mold inserts for the different wing leading edges. Looks like the nose gear still has the short oleo but that is no biggie.
Doesn't look like they spent much effort to display the model in any sort of appealing fashion.
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On 9/26/2019 at 2:54 PM, Sabrejet said:
I think they just made it to the last VMF birds before they were retired. VMF-235 had some; and VMF-232, as the last FJ-2 USMC unit, may also have.
Would they not have made it to the latter navy -3/3M aircraft as well if the marine -2's got them?
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On 6/25/2019 at 1:56 AM, Sabrejet said:
This isn't the full story: the first two aircraft were based on the F-86F and the potential modeller should note the basic airframe differences between those and the third, armed machine which was based on the F-86E:
So 133754 and 755 - F-86F-based with the prominent fuselage-top vent/exhaust panel:
And then F-86E-based 133756 (armed), which had the flush fuselage-top and the fuselage side vents:
It's also worth pointing out that the first two usually carried FJ-style drop tanks while the armed version carried F-86-style 120-gal tanks. Other differences are detailed elsewhere.
Sabrejet, I have a question re the -2/3 Fury's that you may know something about. The question is regarding the introduction of the ribbed rudder and the ribbed stabs. I see the ribbed rudder as being introduced post GSB slat wing -3's. I don't have any photos of GSB slat wing -3's with the ribbed rudder. I don't have any photos contemporaneously of -2's with either the ribbed rudder or stabs. The only photo I have of a -2 with a ribbed rudder is when it was moved to the reserves. Additionally, I have no photos showing later GoW -3's with the ribbed stabs. Were they ever introduced to the active fleet aircraft? Can you offer any guidance on these questions?
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The much anticipated Kitty Hawk FJ Fury series has been removed from Cybermodeler's new kit releases. This can mean one of two things. It's release is imminent or it has been delayed once again. So far KH has been pretty much silent on it since the rescheduled release date last April. They have been busy with their H-60 helo series and Soviet steam punk stuff. Maybe that is why but not much from KH on the kit for several months.
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Your kit obviously is based off of the very old Lindberg F11F-1 kit from the mid 1950's. That kit while having an outline and shape that is ok for the prototype machines it is not very good to use it for representing an early short nose production airframe. A FM long nose Tiger would have been a much better starting point.
North American FJ-2 Fury
in Aircraft Cold War
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Not necessarily a good comparison? Why use it if it really does little to illustrate your opinion? Will I admit the KH kit is better? I'd be a fool to say otherwise, of course it is and far and away better but you seem to want to ignore that until late 2019 the CA kit was the best, most accurate on the market and that is a fact. And by accurate, I meant in outline. Obviously the plastic kit is far more detailed than the resin kit. The CA kit is for the most part been rendered functionally obsolete and of value only to collectors now.
But a simple reminder, If you go back in time before KH released their Cougars, they initially posted on their FB page a photo of the mule for their two seater. The fuselage was quite wrong and I suggested to them they ought to correct it and get it right because the market for a Cougar is not as large as it is for a Mustang or Spitfire, so if they don't, be ready for some flak and disappointing sales. They did correct it and wound up producing some pretty good kits of the Cougar. Conversely, look what happened to their Banshee. With the Fury, I believe they learned a lesson and produced a very nice kit. Perfect no but a very nice kit.
And yes, I hope the -3 is out soon.