Little Andi

Hows this for a bit of a laugh then .............................. Apart from being faintly ridiculous? It's a groovy little device for bending styrene rod and tube. A small little Vee block that I had kicking around the bench ... it heats up real quick (VFH) and whilst twisting/revolving the work-piece it's possible to control the softening without fear of it bursting into flames or simply collapsing into a molten blob, the degree at which you need to transfer it to a former and put your bend into the job - lock in with a household mister and move on to the next bend etc etc. Clumsy and comedic that it looks, it's actually quite an elegant solution to a problem I am anticipating in this build ... (to be revealed if I make a success of it - otherwise I'll not mention it again - ) .

Great pic's Steve ..... some lovely details there, answer a few questions do they - pose a few too unfortunately. As per our telephone conversation of this morning I'm really going to give in to my wanton side with this build - I've found so many anomalies that it is akin to the 806 in pretty much name only. Of course this gives me carte blanche to have a real play around and defy anyone to find evidence as they wheeled it back into the arches; bricks and mortar at the ready!!

Good to see you post Sam, must admit I was a bit concerned at your sudden disappearance ... you were conspicuous by your absence. Almost tried to make contact through "FB", glad I didn't now though as it would of made me look like some twittering neurotic ... . Some of us are looking forward to your latest update on the Mefistofele so come on lad - crack on!

Well get you! .................... Great progress Ban my man. That engine is a tougher build than it looks so you've done a pretty bang up job with that. Couple of nice individual touches that I'm liking. The further I've got into this build the more I'm seeing just how fictional the model is in itself, so I'm really taking the pressure off of myself when it comes to prototypicality - and I advise you to do the same - Relax and enjoy it, I'm sure it will look all the batter for it and the fact that on balance you're happy - well I think that's a really good thing. Regards the Steering wheel, I haven't even thought about that yet beyond the fact that i was trying to find a plausible reason to leave that "oil spray"(?) cover off - I may just do that anyway and let it be someone else's problem!! Well done bloke.

Just a respectful addendum to Jeremy's post, .... I would strongly suggest that you not use your bestest-freshest cyno' - that prompts an instant set and isn't great to work with - at all!! But, in a rare twist of irony - the perfect stuff for the job is the old slightly thickening and stale glue that you've given up on because it refuses to stick anything except fingers and anything other than what you've precariously balanced in the right place for a nano second in time, before it adjusts itself to somewhere different where it will happily stick like it's been welded!! .............. So using using an older staler glue with "in my case Wilco's own talc" you will get a slightly slower set but you'll go through an identifiable "green stage" where you can carve and model it for removal of surplus and general firkling. And as Jeremy rightly points out - don't leave it too long before you finish because it will cure harder than the surrounding plastic and you'll end up with a sort of lava rock mound. ................ Other than that - it provides an easy and quick solution ... my go-to technique when I need to crack on with a build and not keep stopping for piddle-anty little niggley fixes PS .............. you can get a material called "micro-ballons" to use as filler but as ever with "modelling material" it's really expensive and in this instance not noticeably better(?). For the problem you're struggling with I used the old spokes/stretched sprue as a filler and then "Deluxe" acrylic filler when I realised the solvent based methods where taking for ever to dry - I just needed to get on. Jeremy - sorry chap wasn't intending to stamp all over your post - was/am just trying to be helpful ...

Good to see a post in this thread John .................. I have no idea why but I get a bit twitchy if a few days go by and it remains empty, perhaps I feel a certain degree of responsibility? But, that front leaf looks so much better - even happier? I have done pretty much the exact same thing, just couldn't live with that trident fitting, it just screamed at me to do something with it - anything! I certainly couldn't imagine anything looking worse? Looking at your revised piece I was going to try and slice back under the second leaf and then bond either ally or brass shim to the tongue - hoping that might beef it up enough ... I might display with supports anyway (as in the Citroen Avant method). Regards the Arty doodad .................. I went with "breather" so managed with a bit of bent wire ......

Awe! ..... Pish-pash. Sam that is very generous and kind of you to say so. I do not pursue any kind acknowledgement for what it is we all do here - it is nice to know that your/our efforts to share techniques and ideas is appreciated and taken on board. I think that is one of the reasons why I post regular updates, good and bad, successful or otherwise. It is the sharing, the meeting of minds and hearts because basically this hobby of ours is really quite lonesome and insular. Most all of us remember the days when it was just us quietly firkling away in our spare bedrooms, usually in a semi-darkened room with just a spotlight to work by - I know I do: and on reflection it cuts quite a sad image. The ability now to reach out across the world in effect still amazes me, I can swop ideas and resources in a matter of seconds with someone I hardly knew just a matter of a few weeks/days/months/hours ago - and now destined to become firm friends. And as for the whole ART discussion - well that's a can of worms that is! ........................ I actually don't hold with the notion that modelling, or model building is an Art form, it might involve an artistic aspiration, or an artistic endeavour but I honestly think what you end up with is a craft based item. As you rightly point out I do approach my modelling with an Art background, it must tell a story - hence the elaborate backstory to all of my builds, it invariably will exhibit "the passage of time, and the hand of man" as themes, both strong elements of my, serious or more serious attempts at artwork. I will it must be said happily sacrifice prototypicality in order to make a visual point or emphasise any given element of the build, I can and do glaze over if people try to force historical or prototypical facts upon me: but then perversely accommodate said facts into the build in some inverse or erudite manner .................... and sometimes I'm just bloody cuss awkward!! Basically I just crash and stagger along - hopefully forwards, thrilled when I've shown someone something new, worry senselessly when I feel I may of offended someone - anyone. ............. but I do like to feel I have achieved, - spiritually, conceptually, philosophically and creatively................... I've said it before, and I'll say it again ........................ When it comes to this life ............ I'm an Ewok!

Thanks everyone for your combined support and encouragement through this (quite stressful it must be said) time sorting out the louvres. There have been several incarnations of technique - all applicable, just some more direct, others more circuitous but rather handsome. It must be mentioned that to be honest the more prototypical and elegant you want this? The more involved and sophisticated the modelling will need to be. ME? ...... I kind of plumped for somewhere in the middle - kind of looks groovy and to the uninformed, or certainly not the cognoscenti ...would look perfectly plausible. And on that note ................... A bit of fun to show how I intend to go about replacing the rivets on this here build. Now I know I can be a bit of an inverted snob about craft versus technology but I have this kind of Art dilemma going on and just can't bear to witness the removal of the human element such that the build (Project/Workpiece/Artwork) becomes ought but a clinical facsimile rather than a studious representation. ....................... I am reminded of the oft quoted "Charles Rennie Mackintosh" .... There is hope in honest error; None in the icy perfections of the mere stylist. - taken from the Words of JD Sedding's aphorism. Anyhoo, that got all a bit Arty - (I do miss Arty) but basically to excuse myself for that little bit of kit standing in the Fuel filler void - it's a "cup burr" if you haven't crossed paths before, a jewellers tool for trimming the ends of clipped wire. But when applied to the end of a bit of 1mm rod will give you a fantastic "domed" rivet. And because I chuck it into a pin-vice and use by hand I'm going to give myself that one - sans guilt!!!! Here you are then ...................... Just tuppence worth of fun for the weekend? ................. oo-er.

Just a quick update to show you the "yet again" revised thinking on these louvres ... although I feel all the differing techniques have their place depending on circumstance. As can be seen from this pic' I've moved the location somewhat forward of the kits, if you're approaching this for the first time it's no extra effort as you're removing moulding and making a piercing just the same, only in differing places. Now then, this is a bit more involved than those on the tail as they have to arc across the bodywork, in itself no easy task and not without its risks within the solution too - namely the desire of the louvre to want to curl when you try and bend it rather than stay straight. I have managed to get it close but it's not perfect by a long chalk. But, as with the mouldings and the proportions of the whole kit, without getting involved in a complete scratch-build (which this isn't, and never was intended to be) pretty much everything "we" attempt is going to be a compromise of sorts. Pic' then.............................. A couple of things of particular note here are firstly I've straightened up the louvre set compared with the original - this looks closer to the "feel" of the original, and taking on Gordon's comments I've applied a slight fillet of filler around the periphery of the louvre in order to aid the visual transition across the panel work ............ but mainly, and I think this is very important, the bridge you'll note is "notched" into the bodywork, this is to keep an accurate location because I've made this a little long and although it's pre-curved to a degree, it's also "sprung" into place to stop it relaxing and flattening out at a later date and ruining the look of the louvres as a whole? And this more overall short to give you a better perspective of the context of these two louvre sets, although one can see the curve of the body it really is quite marked, and more than it looks here. The tail louvres are only covered in a bit of over-spray, but hopefully you can see how much better they look when coloured and they're tied into the general bodywork? I'm hoping/anticipating that they'll look better still once they've been fully painted and weathered?? ................ now to finish these cussed louvres and not to jigger them up - always a possibility?

Hey Gordon good to see you lurking around these parts ......................... And you're right and wrong? They are in fact facing the correct way - "In" at the front , and "Out" at the back, I suspect cooling for the fuel tank as much as anything. But you are right in as much as quarter round is entirely the wrong profile, and if one were to use it you would go bigger and slice the top off and use that ... as you rightly point out it would make for a much softer and more fluid transition into the bodywork. That said, this is supposed to be a fun build and one I'm trying to enjoy - I'm already beating myself up over details as it is. It looks way better than the kit parts and so I'm going to leave it at that - I know I should be riddled with angst and self flagellating with a thin twig ... but have you ever heard of Steve's FIF? .............. it's a marvellous thing And for want of anything other to say, Steve's right - They're in totally the wrong place. If you take the filler cap as a simple constant. The Left side louvres are in front of it, where-as the right are behind: in order to accommodate the seat cowling. I wasn't entirely happy with the original louvres, and preferred these newer (wrong) ones, so that was enough of a reason to rip 'em out and start again. PS ............. if you look at the reference pic's you'll see the actual louvres appear to have been made with a spoon and a stick of rhubarb so I'm going to go easy on myself over this.

Minor success, a little tribulation and a disastrous realisation! Firstly apologies if it feels like I'm photo-bombing the thread ... but this is kind of important if you stick with it? Firstly though, a minor success and a little fore warning................. Firstly the cut into the tail ready to attempt the louvres ........... Secondly - NOT for the faint hearted - you are fore warned there is some serious meat in here which throws up all manner of issues and problems. But with a little perseverance and some luck (not something I'm known for actually) one can make a job of it .............. This is a much neater method, and this fresh from under the files. No fettling yet so it bodes well - much happier with this! MUCH neater ... and much happier too. ........................ other way....................... NOW spot the horror ............................ And the reason why?........................................ ANYONE .......................................... ?

I'll bet you're pleased those plugs are done (looking good by the way) ... There seems to be a lot more than twelve when you're making them doesn't there? On the FIF scale mine felt like a 5 for a 7/8, but then again it may be one of those items that you don't give credit for but very noticeable when they're gone? Not at all surprised to hear you've been tarting about with an aircraft build;- it is a cracking kit though and must admit one has made it into my stash too. Bad news ................ I have to be honest, that tyre valve, it looks a bit clunky ...........

Now here's a wizard wheeze if you've not seen it before ............................. ? Picture first explain after ...................... One of the toughest jobs in getting louvres to look right is consistency, so I employed this simple little tool. Basically four pieces of quarter round (1.5mm) when held together give you a rod of 3mm diameter - poke this down afore mentioned diameter tube, chuck into your lathe, drill, cordless, and sand down the end to a nice half sphere, turn it round and do the other end ... ta-dahh! In this example I've packed the other end with a 3mm tube and packed that with an appropriate sized rod, this means I can firm it up inside the tube so it's tight enough to stay put - but not that tight I can't alter how much it slides into the outer tube, hence it becomes a "depth gauge" so you can concentrate on getting your profile right. I've never had one spin in the tube but a short length of tape will more than hold it for all the turning you need to do. I love these little widgets - I've accumulated a bench full of the things, I really do enjoy a good gadget.

No - persae. There is a little bit of a dint under the left rear one but seeing as it's on the B side I'm putting it down to the metal fatiguing from torsion twist. It's more of a soft undulation than a sink-hole so I let it go. Re the fillers I've just got into using the acrylic fillers, and must say I was pretty suspicious of them to start off with, but they do do a good job. Not as fast as Cyno', but infinitely more manageable and way quicker than the old two pack epoxy types - I think they all have there place. But if you haven't tried the Acrylics give 'em a go. I use Both "Deluxe and Vallejo".

I think it might just be a case of "two sides of the same circle" - so burnt as scolded then. I did have to wrestle with this in truth, and a lot of my preplanning went straight out of the window once I'd made that first cut and there was no way back. Biggest mistake I think was not accommodating the curve of the bodywork enough, this meant those "bridges I'd put had to come out and much deeper ones used so I could file it back to the curve. The carving of the louvres themselves was pretty nerve racking as it's a lot of effort lost if you bugger it up, but as you work your confidence grows and it becomes easier. TOP TIP ......................... assemble this with Cyno' ............. any kind of solvent just leaves it all soggy and it's impossible to crack on, you're committed to waiting for heaven knows how long and it'll still be too soft to work with. I learnt this from making those spark plugs ... the Cyno' makes it all crunchy and workable

OK then just a quick pictorial as to how I replaced the moulded louvres with some open ones........................ This is the first attempt so as ever it's a bit rough around the edges, but I'm sure by the time I get to the last they'll be a lot quicker and neater .............. hence why this was done on the "B" side (left). ........................ here go then ....................... And finally cleaned up with a bit of fettling etc. ..................... Apologies for the picture heavy content .... but I've discovered in this process that a picture really is worth a thousand words, hopefully it's all pretty self explanatory? .... But I'll try and highlight my thinking for anyone that has questions? Actually what can't be appreciated from the pic's (which are as ever merciless) is the strong arc across the louvre from the body panel - this is awkward and will cause some consternation I'm sure! Cheers all.

Sam, based on this you're doing fine. ....................... But please remember your FIF! It's a sliding scale and everyone's is a little different. But no matter what, the law of diminishing returns applies, there does come a point where "no-one will see it, appreciate it, or understand it. And I know there's the old maxim of "I'll know its there" but trust me that wears pretty thin after a while too ........................ TRUST ME, as some-one whom is probably still in recovery from "burn-out" what I'm suggesting here is in the interests of your own sanity and your personal mental health ............... You must ENJOY this, and if it's not turning you on - leave it off. Which coincidently and rather fortuitously brings me to: .................................. This whole thing with the Lathe and advanced tooling - Stop it! Now. All that kind of kit and tackle is like some kind of modelling siren to us types, you'll end up playing more with the tools than the project. It's enviable to see and appreciate, but the truth is most everything you need to do at the level we work on can be accomplished with a household or cordless drill - anything else is "Model Engineering" not Model making - perhaps a subtle and ephemeral difference but I've drawn a line round about there and try my damnedest to NOT cross it. Again it will save your sanity and you'll be able to concentrate on what it is you're trying to achieve not how you're going to achieve it. ............... It really is a corrosive and toxic kind of envy - ask me how I know. It may be as much about the individual as anything but you'll have to decide where your own personal line is drawn, I'm just saying, you don't actually need any of that stuff, it might just make things a bit more convenient or speed up the occasional process. In the interests of honesty I've recently acquired a wartime jewellers lathe, and it is amongst my dearest possessions, and I love to play with it, and wipe it down, and run just my hand over it as I walk by .................. BUT, used in anger it's nothing more that a domestic drill on a stable base - I rarely at all use the cross slide but rather just use it with gravers like a wood workers lathe. And possibly the most telling thing is I waited for the best part of fifty years before I acquired it, and then it just sort of fell into my lap - and it would of been churlish to have turned it down. It was in a very neglected state and it took several months to renovate and set up - an enjoyable exercise in its own right I'll admit though. Sorry if I've ranted on a little - but it's been a topic of conversation that I've felt has diverted focus into an area which contains Dragons. ....................... ..

Sorry Sam .... you've got me there? I'll need a bit more information - are you referring to: the Citroen, the 806, or this Mestofele build, and which "roundels" are we talking about???.................

You see Sam ... right there! ..................... This alone makes you an affiliated member of the AMS (Advanced Modellers Syndrome) - and perversely these are my initials too, so I'm completely lost. And although it's a frustration, like some form of OCD in your need to get it closer and closer to the original; it's also quite empowering - (and daunting) when you realise that the kit you've just innocently brought into your home does in fact contain tens if not hundreds of mini-kits ... all demanding your undivided attention. This is how I ended up with a Citroen Engine as a stand alone model - "anybody want to buy the rest of the kit" . You'll also have realised now if not sooner that the hard part comes as you work "backwards and forwards" through the instructions, and the kit, and the build itself to make sure you haven't jiggered something up, or that you've accommodated some procedure or assembly or some other such fiddle-faddle!! ... this I think is what I procrastinate the most with - checking and checking and bliddy well checking again ............................... and of course, still getting it wrong and having to start over ... Grrrr! Regardless ............... well done, you've raised the bar again for both yourself and us as we watch with much anticipation. PS .............. You'll like the silk wire, I have some for the 806, it has an aluminium core which will flatten and take a .75mm hole easily - although I'm a little further away from that than yourself yet.

Yep, best I can tell that floor looks fine, like it a bit darker too. I of course shall chuck oil and muck and all sorts down there - hopefully it will cover a multitude of sins. Regards the lacing - in your own sweet time, that's the idea of this modelling malarkey, although Steve's right, the longer you leave it the harder it's going to become. Also remember that if you decide to go down the OOB route that's OK too - it makes for a fine model just with some judicious building. Just because I'm a glutton for punishment, and I've been badgering Steve for about fifteen years that it was about time he "manned up" .................. doesn't mean you have to, too! ... ... ........................

Mine will feature the screw down caps - if that makes any difference what so ever.

Impressive job John - my FIF kicks in way before I would of got to this stage - I really must be some kind of Luddite?

Well regards the front end spring hangers and the like, and in the interests of here's another way to skin a cat! Here's how I went about it ... Not as flash or engineered as John's but does give an idea of a low tech' way to go should you of course feel it necessary? I'd already had a go at mine and seeing as it wasn't anything special just chucked some primer at it and called it done. BUT, someone is bound to pick me up on it now that VT has shown his hand. Mine as stated is much more "in the hands - (as ever)" - and basically comprises just two replacement stub axles made from my ubiquitous "15 amp earth wire" - I have trimmed the top and bottom of the chassis rails to streamline them, and just tapered them ever so slightly to take the box girder look off of them. I was really just going on basic engineering principles and trying to make it look about right? ... As noted there is very little solid evidence of it's actual physicality and truth be known it's just a pole with a couple of springs hung on the end - I'm guessing if you want prototypicality you might want to go John's way more then mine - he invents less stuff ... As mentioned this isn't really supposed to be a definitive version of the car - but rather something that'll make some folk look twice .. and then perhaps even again? And another couple of shots ... some work I've been firkling at around the stern. It really is a mess back there and I got a bit bogged down trying to get some semblance of order, but there's a clear photo of this in the instructions so I felt I ought to make the effort and tidy it up, narrow shut lines and make it a bit more likely to pass muster? And with a bit of primer on it ...........................

Oh Crikey Sam, ................ what you have there is a totally different animal ......... and the danger signs are "OIL and WAX". If at all possible and you have no other use for it? It'll pay you to just return it for a refund. .................................. http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B001HJLB1A This is the product I was referring to/use .............. sorry if I caused any confusion. PS ..... I'm not very impressed with your shops ability to recommend a sympathetic substitute.

Ahhh ....... Steve's infamous FIF! ......................... Everybody's got one apparently - mine usually kicks in about the third time of trying ...