Had a look through the stash and realised there's not a single WWI kit anywhere. So, without further ado I went onto Hannants site and spent some money.
New toy

Looks as if this one will have to be OOB as I can't find anything about them on the 'net and my reference pile is sadly lacking
Always liked the lines of these machines so dare say progress will begin shortly after the parcel arrives. Prepare to be bombarded by stupid questions about WWI machines from an ignorant pleb chaps.

Nothing wrong with OOB matey!

Lovely looking bird there, and welcome on board.

Good luck,

Nick

Col.
I have just the reference you need in digital form. You will need adobe acrobat reader 6 to look at it.
Pm me your email address and I will send it sharpish.
Good luck!
Bob Von Holy

Cheers Nick, this is only the second time I've been in a GB so with any luck I'll actually finish this one in the allotted time - although Bob's kind offer may put paid to the OOB idea.
On the subject of which, PM sent Bob and cheers.

The kit arrived at the end of last week but this is the first chance I've had to have a proper look at her, so without further ado;







The parts are nicely detailed but there's a couple of things that threaten the OOB idea. First off is the cockpit, which contains a floor and tubular frame-work into which is fitted a solid seat. From what I can see in the Windsock Datafile photos (cheers Bob! ) there was no floor and the frame was made from perforated angle strip. As for the seat, every other WWI machine I've seen has a woven wicker chair in there and I'm not sure why the M-S type N would be any different
The engine looks fairly nice but needs pushrods and could do with the valve gear refining a little, although there may not be much of it seen due to the size of the spinner. Also, the exhaust ports on the fuselage side look somewhat simplified and could do with replacing.
As I looked at the latter it dawned upon me that they must route along the cockpit side, which may explain what appears to be a canvas cover on the cockpit sides that would protect the pilot from burning himself on the pipe.

Having found a couple of good clear photos of the Le Rhone 9C engine on the 'net I'll start there. Well, once a mechanic, always a mechanic

Had a quick look at the pictures on Hannants site before you posted these - yes it is very nicely produced - thought you would weaken on the OoB idea p as to seats when I looked at the Gotha seats I thought that they had gone barmy with the Pilots seat - it is just like an unholstered armchair. Must be wrong - but no - the Windsock book shows a red leather upholstered seat with arms!!!.

David.

PS Old Bob is a good fellow isn't he - but don't say anything - head may swell even more!

Thanks for the note about the seat David, may go with the kit part after all. As for the OOB idea, you're right it didn't last long
Been working on the engine this last couple of days, pushrods and sparkplugs are the only additions.


That was the easy bit, now comes the cockpit where I disagree with Eduard's interpretation of structure and components.
It's your fault Bob, if it wasn't for that Datafile I'd have taken their word for it and carried on in blissful ignorance

Chuckle - yes blame old Bob - he is a masochist and likes everyone to suffe as well - but this is modelling is it not? Like your engine however.

You are making me feel guilty - I just keep avoiding the Gotha - loads of excuses - do me a favour - keep on posting your progress so that I feel really humble! I think also this may induce our Bunny Leader to leave the cabbage patch and commence his RE8 in earnest.

David

Need to finish Raiden first grasshopper...

Thanks for the kind words David, hope this update helps you toward tackling the Gotha
Having read various experts opinions about the construction of this machine and studied the Datafile I thought it best to deviate from Eduard's kit and leave out the floor and framework parts in favour of some scratchbuilt items. It seems there was a narrow shelf that supported the rudder bar and control column and everything else was fixed to a tubular spaceframe topped with a strip of perforated angle that forms the edge of the cockpit.
After fixing the front and rear kit bulkheads into one fuselage half I had the pleasure to discover the engine fouled the inside of the cowling, thus had to carefully thin it out before the two halves would meet. At the same time the upper edge of the cockpit opening was thinned to get a more scale appearance and a few longerons were added to the area that would have been under the floor.



The fabric and metal panels have been painted and dry-brushed so I can start by adding the wooden panel and exhausts tomorrow and then think about getting the framework built up.

Watch out for the seat Col may not be woven wicker, my SE5A appears to just have a flat wooden seat, presumably with a cushion on it!!

Cheers lads, must admit to considering the Special Hobby kit myself at one point Jay but couldn't find any on-line reviews.
In the end I used the kit seat pretty much as it was in the box Pete, looks alright in there with a bit of dry-brushing.







I'll get the top panel on now and start to think about the metal panels and how to weather them. Some photos show a lot of paint has been striped off due to the oil from the rotary engine constantly leaking but these all appear to be in the earlier black scheme. The example I want to do has red panels and I think that may have been more resilient. More research required methinks.

That's nice work Col - what happened to your FF?

Cheers Gary. As for the Firefly - it's still on the go mate, waiting to order seatbelts from Hannants as I'm not happy with my attempts to produce a set with some wine-bottle foil. At the moment this one has my full attention though.

Looks great Col, keep up the excellent work and keep the pics comin'

Perry

Those instruments look great to me Col. keep it coming

Cheers guys, the Eduard decal sheet is a work of art and the instrument dials are no exception.
A spot of clear varnish over each and it should look the part.
Ain't gonna get much done this weekend but at least that'll give me a chance to learn about my new airbrush!

OK all you WWI model aircraft experts, I have a stupid question for you.

In keeping with my new-found enthusiasm for these cloth-covered wickerwork aircraft I've been looking at photos of restored and replica machines, the main thing I've noticed is how transparent they are in strong light!
That in turn got me thinking how best to depict such an effect on a lump of plastic and I'm giving serious consideration to spraying very thin lines of pre-shading along the fuselage and wing ribs, possibly using a dark brown.

So, whatcha all think. Inspired idea - and thus most likely subconsciously nicked from someone else's build - or total waste of effort? Would dark brown be too dark or light for under a doped linen top coat? Or can someone guide me gently but firmly away from my ridiculous notion and toward the true path of enlightened early aircraft model-building?

It is a good point you raise here, but I think it only applies to just doped a/c. If it is painted in any way then won't the effect be lost?

I can see for really early, pre-WW1, a/c with clear doped fabric that some form of highlight for the ribs and longerons could be good, but by the time it is camouflaged probably not.



Grant

I've got a great article in a magazine somewhere, TMMI I think, of a DH.2 where some exceptional work was done replicating the see through effect, I'll dig it out and let you know when I find it.

Russ

Hmm, good point Grant. As far as I can see the machine I want to model was in the natural doped fabric but had some colour panels on the fuselage which may have cut the amount of light transferring through.

If you can find the article I'd be most interested Russ, always better to steal others ideas than bugger it up experimenting

Col,

It was an article in Model Airplane International Issue 10 May 2006. Mike Grant builds an Airco Dh.2, using decals he created to represent the ribs and the top surface roundels, which he then misted over with the doped linen cover. It's a stunning build.

If you PM me I can send the article over to you.

Russ

Finally found the courage to break out the airbrush and point it at the kit. No photos yet but most of it has come out alright so far. Got dust on one wing and there's a coulpe of bits on the rear fuselage where the paint has reacted with some surface contaminant but it'll have to wait until tomorrow when the paint has dried before I can do anything.
At least the pre-shading looks ok in most bits.

Inspired by the latest issue of Model Airplane International and the site being down for a while the Type N got a little much deserved attention last night. Now while I may not have achieved anything worth photographing it has thrown up a couple of questions and observations.

To paint the prop I used Revell enamels for the first time and by heck this stuff dries quick! Hardly had time to get it from the pot to the prop before it was drying on the brush.

The model used in the MAI article is the Special Hobby 32nd scale kit and while there are some detailed differences in the way certain aspects of the aircraft has been interpreted I can ignore the majority. One thing I can't pass, however, is the cowling colours. Eduard depict the spinner and cowls of MS394 in red, as does the profile on page 18 of MAI. Stephane Boirau, on the other hand, depicts his kit with black panels. This latter finish is supported by the Windsock Datafile, which points out how fragile the black paint was during constant exposure to Castor oil leaking from the engine and shows a photo of a machine with the fuselage bands worn by Escadrille 159 that has a considerable amount of the paint missing. Furthermore, it is stated that only the British painted their forward fuselage red to differentiate from the Fokker monoplanes and although, "The French were informed of the new colour marking...there is no evidence to suggest French Moranes were similarly painted." Ho hum. I like the look of the little fighter with red panels but don't think I could live with a model I know to be inaccurate. Besides, the worn black finish has character and helps to add visual interest.

Enough of my ramblings. One thing I have decided is to spray the rudder colours, thus avoiding a potential fight to get the decals to wrap around the edges. Does anyone know the best match from any of the paint manufacturers for Eduard's decals? I'd like to avoid painting all the markings as the decals look quite good.

Shot on a coat of Alclad dark aluminium and it's gone grey!
Didn't think there was too much moisture in the air, or have I buggered up somewhere?
Noticed I'd forgot to add the fuel filler cap before spraying so I've glued it on and away to head out on the bike for a couple hours. That should give everything a chance to cure off before I shoot a second coat on to see if that looks any better.
Here's a photo of how it looks.

Oh bugger! Guess who just sprayed Tamiya rattle-can acrylic white over a rudder painted in Humbrol enamels, with the enevitable results?

Glad I am not the only one who gets caught out, every now and then, not thinking.

The Alclad seems strange. Maybe it was just too thin a coat. I have noticed, more than with enamels, that the undercoat can make such a difference to the final look, even after a few coats.

cheers

Grant

Cheers Grant, had a go at polishing the Alclad yesterday and it came up fine.
Spent last night masking the cowl in spots with a latex mask to simulate the weathering then sprayed her this morning with Humbrol satin black 85. Think it came out OK.

Shame I didn't get the mask for the fin burnished down properly so got that to clean up some time.
Next task is getting the undercarriage sorted.

Got most of the undercarriage components on, including some new central bracing struts to replace the slightly short kit item, then built a new gun-mount to put in place of the rather weedy kit parts.



These are all painted now so once it's dry I'll add the suspension bungies just inboard of the mainwheels and sort out the tail skid. Dare say it'll be the weekend before I get back to that, have to spend tomorrow at Glentress testing the new Trek bikes

Prop now on, wings decalled and glued on and the fuselage bands added.
Eduard decals seem to perform well so far.

Spent the whole evening tinkering with little bits, mainly in the undercarriage and control cable struts.
The main wheels had the hubs dry-brushed with dark grey to lift my attempt to represent the spokes showing against the taught fabric covers. The axle was also trimmed to move the wheels closer to the struts and the main rigging eye that mounts on the meeting point of the centre struts was also formed from twisted fuse wire.


The skid had some 10amp fuse wire added to represent the suspension bungy and a couple of squares of 10 thou. card to represent the pivot point.


The upper support struts had a 10 thou. plate fitted between them with some pre-drilled holes for the control wires to thread through.


After a little detail work and painting tomorrow it'll be time to get rigging!

That's starting to look really nice Col Like the little details you're adding.

Cheers mate, starting to think I was talking to myself for a while there.
I'm very grateful to Bob for the Windsock Datafile on this machine, it's the only reference I have but it's a good one for much of the small details that need adding. Have a sneaking suspicion I'll finish this one just in time for someone to find a pristine example locked away in a barn somewhere in rural France and all my interpretations will be proved wrong

Looking great, can't wait to see her finished!

Cheers Perry, so am I!
It's suddenly dawned on me just how close this one is getting to the finish, seemed to be going together very quickly over the last few days.
Spent most of the evening researching the control wires and their related components, think I know what parts I need to make and where everything goes at last. With my mind settled on that front I decided to make the control horns for the rudder and elevators, then I had a thought - does it all fit?

Nope
The rudder is too big to fit within the support structure for the tail skid. That'll be the rudder I spent an age getting the decals to wrap around and look good. The same rudder that now needs 1 & 1/2 millimeters hacked off the bottom before it'll work
Had a go with the spare supplied in the kit, this should give you an idea of what I'm gibbering on about.


Still can't work out why some muppet decided to make a 1/32nd rudder for a 1/48th kit.

No photos for this update but thought I'd keep you all posted on how it's going.
The rudder is now sorted and touched up with some reasonably close matches from Humbrol enamel paints.
The rigging is under-way using some very fine copper wire from a long-dead radio. It's far from perfect but all part of the learning curve. Right?
Once that's done I'll make and fit a windscreen then add the rudder and elevator to finish her off.

At this rate she may be done before New Year.

Hang in there Col. It's looking really nice

Cheers fella, here's how it's looking after a wee bit more work today.



This was the most difficult part of it all, as you can see the wire isn't as tight as I'd have liked and it took ages studying photos to figure out what happened in there so I could make the parts required.



I initially hoped to have her finished today but now I don't want to rush things and spoil her. Besides, there's always tomorrow

Looking good Col what are you using for the rigging

THanks Steve.
I've got this reel of very fine copper wire that csme out of some old electrical component, possibly a radio.
Thought it might do this very job when I first came across it and it sat in the odds and sods drawer for years until now

Finished!



Added the scratch-built windscreen, rudder control wires, glued on the tailfin and painted the rigging and control wires Humbrol 53 gunmetal today while swapping between this build and decaling the Revell 144th Mk.1 Hunter.



In the five months it's taken I've made a number of personal modelling firsts.
First WWI build.
First completed GB build.
First use of an airbrush.
First use of Future.
First use of Alclad.
First attempt at rigging.
Special thanks has to go to Nick for hosting this GB and Bob for the Windsock Datafile that made this possible. Cheers guys!
I'll try to take better photos for the finished builds thread when daylight returns.

They look good to me lad. Well done.

Don't forget to post them up in the finished article section.

Cheers,

Nick von Stillnotfinishedthefekkingfokker

Looks great Col. Your perseverance and hard work has finally paid off

Nice build Col

Thank you very much lads, finally got some photos in daylight today so I'll away and add them to the finished builds thread so you can get a better look at all the mistakes

Col von Gladtobe-Done.

Nice work.Good job on the rigging.