mollythedog Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 Someone asked me about one of my own models a while back,and it has been niggling me ever since. I had assumed (always dodgy I know) that the Seakings that were involved in the Falklands War were in EDSG,as were the Wessex (Humphrey being the obvious example). But on checking I can find nothing to say one way or the other. My first port of call was " Falklands, The Air War" by Burden/Draper/Rough/Smith and Wilton, a pretty comprehensive overveiw,but although some B/W drawings are included,nothing for the Seakings. I don't know if the HC's differed from the HAS,in black and white they all look the same tone to me. Anyone know? Sorry in advance for the dumb question,but I tried several searches on here and didn't find the answer. Cheers mtd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darson Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 Someone asked me about one of my own models a while back,and it has been niggling me ever since. I had assumed (always dodgy I know) that the Seakings that were involved in the Falklands War were in EDSG,as were the Wessex (Humphrey being the obvious example). But on checking I can find nothing to say one way or the other. My first port of call was " Falklands, The Air War" by Burden/Draper/Rough/Smith and Wilton, a pretty comprehensive overveiw,but although some B/W drawings are included,nothing for the Seakings. I don't know if the HC's differed from the HAS,in black and white they all look the same tone to me. Anyone know? Sorry in advance for the dumb question,but I tried several searches on here and didn't find the answer. Cheers mtd Depending on the airframe you are trying to model they were painted either RAF Blue Grey, Matt OD or Dark Sea Grey (Over painted from the standard SAR yellow scheme). Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Lime Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 Most of the HAS Sea Kings were RAF Blue Grey finished and the HC4's (the Commando assault version) were finshed in RN Helicopter Olive Drab. However, as is always the case, you can't beat researching the particular airframe you're building, just to dot the I's and cross the T's! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonymousFO98 Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 (edited) Thought Humphrey was RAF Blue Grey? Edited March 13, 2011 by walrus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat C Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 (edited) Blue/grey is an interesting colour - all joking aside sometimes it looks very blue, and sometimes it looks very errrr.... grey. I think Humph is weathered blue/grey but it doesn't look a million miles away from XDSG in this shot. Edited March 13, 2011 by Pat C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mollythedog Posted March 13, 2011 Author Share Posted March 13, 2011 For those about to snigger,we salute you. Thanks for the answers. It is immediately apparent to all that - a) I am not really an aircraft modeller my colour interpretation might not be as acute as others c) one of my points of "reference" was my "Humphrey" as modelled by Corgi as a diecast 1/72. Yes,looking again at it,the dark grey has a distinctly blue hue,especially when compared to a Seaking in Dark Grey as made by the same firm. I know,heresy for some to even consider these things as points of reference, but please bear in mind a and b above! d) if Humphrey et al were blue,why do they appear darker in photos of the period when compared to Seakings? Is it my eyes? Again, I thank you for answering, I think it strange that although very recent,colour photography is found less often than B/W. But then again,most involved had other things to keep them busy. Cheers mtd PS thanks for the photo.Wonderful looking things those Wessex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bootneck Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 Hi MTD, The Wessex V's, Commando versions and not A/S, were always the typical dark green and the Sea Kings, except the HC.4, were RAF Blue/Grey. We had a few of the Sea Kings arriving onboard Canberra whilst in transit to the TEU and there were a couple of occasions where I thought they were dark grey but it was just a trick of the light. I have posted a few images below; the first two are mine of aircraft visiting Canberra and the others are ones that I have found on the web (the last one being of an early Sea King onboard HMS Ark Royal [iV] in the 1970's) As you can see, the Sea Kings look either very grey or even green! such as those on the QE2. It just seems to be the light conditions. HTH Mike Two Seakings on Canberra whilst at Ascension Island en-route to the Falklands Wessex V on Canberra en-route to TEZ Sea Kings on QE2 web images 1970's image of Sea King on HMS Ark Royal - notice lack of filters on intakes web image . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat C Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 Yes,looking again at it,the dark grey has a distinctly blue hue Well for me RAF blue grey is blue with a grey hue to it!! No wonder colour debates are always so fraught!! I recall reading that some Sea Kings had a laquer finish applied that made the blue-gray have a more "blue" appearance (in some pics they appear closer to the Lynx Oxford Blue). That could account for why Wessex and Sea King might have different appearances despite being nominally painted in thh same colour. Pat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonymousFO98 Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 (edited) Yup agreed Pat Colour is a tricky business and no one is sniggering MTD! There is a blue hue to EDSG imho Greys can be very tricksy because of their constituent combination of hues. There are so many variables that can shift the appearance. You need a spectrum analysis and verification from Colonel White! or Nick if he watching! Great pics Mike! thanks for showing Edited March 13, 2011 by walrus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Fleming Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 The Sea KIng HAS2As had a coating applied that gave them a slightly greenish look in some photos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bootneck Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 The Sea KIng HAS2As had a coating applied that gave them a slightly greenish look in some photos Thanks Dave, that could account for the impressions I got of them. Obviously we were busy on other matters but I would have liked to have chosen one airframe and then photograph it throughout the campaign - on sailing (overcast); off Ascension (very bright & hot) and in the TEZ (wet & snowy) - just to see the changes in appearance to the colour. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mollythedog Posted March 13, 2011 Author Share Posted March 13, 2011 Thanks again to all for the replies and advice. In my defence, I did refer to several books I have on the Seaking-the most useful being "Modern Combat Aircraft No.18" Westland Seaking by John Chartres. On page 49 there is a nice head on-ish view of one The caption reads "A Seaking HAS5 of No 810 NAS (in Falklands War colours) operating off RFA Engadine in 1983". It must be the angle,as it looks EDSG rather than RAF blue to me,but perhaps I am confusing the RAF uniform colour,much as my old Air Cadet uniform,rather than the aircraft paint! Age.... Several pages on ,still in colour,but not dated,they appear slightly more blue (but still "grey" to me!!) .Each to his own. As I work in quite small scales the colours have to be lightened somewhat,making the difference between a darkish grey and a darkish blue grey a moot point. I accept the point that,earlier,when operating off of Ark Royal (IV) there is no question the colour was blue,but as she went in 78 she was off my radar. Hopefully Warpaint will bring out a book on them for dunces like me. Cheers mtd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennings Heilig Posted March 14, 2011 Share Posted March 14, 2011 This is why the US military uses FS595. No names, no interpretation. Just a five digit number, so there's no chance of messing it up unless you're dyslexic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selwyn Posted March 14, 2011 Share Posted March 14, 2011 This is why the US military uses FS595. No names, no interpretation. Just a five digit number, so there's no chance of messing it up unless you're dyslexic. And that is why The British forces use BS 381c hue 633 (6 =Grey, 33 colour number) and a Official Name RAF Blue Grey, No interpretation needed. I think everyone accepts all colours to FS or BS or RAL or whatever look different depending on wear, light fading and light conditions when a picture is taken. So what exactly is your point? Selwyn? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mollythedog Posted March 14, 2011 Author Share Posted March 14, 2011 Down, boy, down....... I can see that those that take this far more seriously might be offended,but for those that see aircraft more as appendages I'll just repeat,thanks for the steer in the right direction. The toned down "RAF Blue Grey" (actually Humbrol 145) is on the rear left and middle. The others are my interpretation of the modern RN grey (Vallejo Air,but I forget which one) and RN Dark Blue. Like I said,in a different scale, I am in my own Universe. I will build my 1/72nd Merlin one day, I promise..... Cheers mtd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonymousFO98 Posted March 14, 2011 Share Posted March 14, 2011 Unless it has fully detailed resin cockpit and interior we aren't impressed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bootneck Posted March 14, 2011 Share Posted March 14, 2011 Hi MTD, is that the famous scar I see on your finger (under the Merlin in the last image)... or is it another one? Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Fleming Posted March 14, 2011 Share Posted March 14, 2011 MTD, I'm convinced you are a photoshop wizard!! :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Procopius Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 Apologies for the thread resurrection a year and nine months on, but is Humbrol 96 a good acrylic match for the RAF blue-grey colour? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thx6667 Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 Not really, its more the colour for uniforms rather than BS381C 633 RAF Blue/Grey used on machines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Procopius Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 Not really, its more the colour for uniforms rather than BS381C 633 RAF Blue/Grey used on machines. Ah, poop. Is there an acrylic near-match? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitewolf Posted October 11, 2017 Share Posted October 11, 2017 The Seaking HC4s were painted in what appeared to be a Dark Olive Green which differed from the later 'Olive Drab' worn for most of their lives Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dervish Posted October 11, 2017 Share Posted October 11, 2017 Sea King HC4s we painted in the same shade of green throughout their lives. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitewolf Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 On 11/10/2017 at 6:42 PM, Dervish said: Sea King HC4s we painted in the same shade of green throughout their lives. Sorry, disagree based on personal observations, i've seen HC4s in at least 3 differing greens, not counting those that faded. The early birds including those we had down South appeared in a Darkish Olive type green, and remained in it past 1988 ( although those deployed to Lebanon in 88 faded badly). The Dark scheme was high lighted by the white applied for IFOR and exercises in Norway. The current or should I say last scheme came later as aircraft were out shopped post upgrade/modification. Light will always play tricks, and paint from differing manufacturers plays a part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dervish Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 You’re correct, light will always play tricks. They were painted polyurethane matt NATO green to BS381C-285 from 1980 until 2016, the same as the Wessex HU5. DAP101C-0404-6A Chap 07-80-00 pg 703-3 refers. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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