SUNDON Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 I have a boxing of the Italeri /Accurate Miniatures TBF/BM 1 Avenger which I am considering building as a FAA Tarpon Mk.I. My problem is that I have been unable to find any infomation or mainly pictures regaurding its conversion for British use. I have only been able to find one drawing showing a side plan which shows the position of the Observers seat but no info or photos. Any help or info would help with my decision to build the FAA version or weather to just build another us version. Thanks Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Smith Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 (edited) I have a boxing of the Italeri /Accurate Miniatures TBF/BM 1 Avenger which I am considering building as a FAA Tarpon Mk.I. My problem is that I have been unable to find any infomation or mainly pictures regaurding its conversion for British use. I have only been able to find one drawing showing a side plan which shows the position of the Observers seat but no info or photos. Any help or info would help with my decision to build the FAA version or weather to just build another us version. Thanks Martin Martin interesting question, this thread here, http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=29725 has some relevant information, specifically about FFA designations, as that Avenger I and II is based on manufacturer(Grumman or Eastern) , not US model! and colours depending on which plant built them, inside and out... here is a build of the Trumpeter 1/32, http://modelingmadness.com/reviews/allies/.../cleavertbf.htm made as an FAA avenger, with some idea on what needs doing, as well as providing some useful background info. HTH T Edited February 21, 2011 by Troy Smith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Maas Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 Martininteresting question, this thread here, http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=29725 has some relevant information, specifically about FFA designations, as that Avenger I and II is based on manufacturer(Grumman or Eastern) , not US model! and colours depending on which plant built them, inside and out... here is a build of the Trumpeter 1/32, http://modelingmadness.com/reviews/allies/.../cleavertbf.htm made as an FAA avenger, with some idea on what needs doing, as well as providing some useful background info. HTH T Actually, they are based on the US model as with all USN planes of the period the designation varied based on manufacturer, not the designer. Grumman-built Avengers were TBF's and Eastern were TBM's. Avenger Mk 1's were TBF-1's, Avenger Mk II's were a mix of TBM-1 and TBM-1C, MK III's were TBM-3's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Smith Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 Actually, they are based on the US model as with all USN planes of the period the designation varied based on manufacturer, not the designer. Grumman-built Avengers were TBF's and Eastern were TBM's. Avenger Mk 1's were TBF-1's, Avenger Mk II's were a mix of TBM-1 and TBM-1C, MK III's were TBM-3's. Hi Adam Bruce Archer posted this in one of the links above TBF-1B is the export version of the -1, single gun in cowlTBF-1C last Grumman production version, single gun in each wing TBM-1 is the first production version by Eastern ( there was no TBM-1B), single gun in cowl TBM-1C is the second production version by Eastern, single gun in each wing TBM-3 was ONLY produced by Eastern, single gun in each wing the point here being that the Avenger II could be a TBM-1, single gun in cowl, or TBM-1C , single gun in each wing. Without the serials or a good pic it's hard to know which one. The Italeri kit (rebox of Accurate Minatures) is a TBF/TBM-1 is a -1C but with the full load of armament options. (I think one of my Italeri kits has two types of cowl though so can do a TBM3, though that's not here to check) cheers T Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunshine coast Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 Although it may not be much help ,I have the Italerie and the AM TBF-1C kits together in the shop and can compare any parts tomorrow if anyone wants info ...? Regards Trevor ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Gordon Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 I'd like to know.I have the Italeri offering to hand and intend to make it as JZ 217 as per the kit decals.My boxful has one cowling only.Doesn't stop it from being a gloriously appetite whetting thing of beauty though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunshine coast Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 (edited) Right Gents.... I have checked the Italeri Avenger sprues against the Accurate Miniatures TBF-1C (I have not got an AM TBM-3 kit.. ) All the main sprues....wings, body etc are the same ... the Italeri version does not have a "Depth Charge" sprue......AM does... the AM version does not have a "Torpedo" sprue or a the "Radar wing pod for TBM-1 D " sprue.....Italeri does.. Both have a pair of "bulged round windows" to make a FAA version ....but that is all there is or mentioned to do with FAA (apart from decals in the Italeri version).. Hope this helps ... PS ...only 1 type of cowl .....re..both kits .. Regards Trevor..... Edited February 22, 2011 by sunshine coast Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Smith Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 Right Gents....I have checked the Italeri Avenger sprues against the Accurate Miniatures TBF-1C (I have not got an AM TBM-3 kit.. ) All the main sprues....wings, body etc are the same ... the Italeri version does not have a "Depth Charge" sprue......AM does... the AM version does not have a "Torpedo" sprue or a the "Radar wing pod for TBM-1 D " sprue.....Italeri does.. Both have a pair of "bulged round windows" to make a FAA version ....but that is all there is or mentioned to do with FAA (apart from decals in the Italeri version).. Hope this helps ... PS ...only 1 type of cowl .....re..both kits .. Regards Trevor..... Hi I have two Italeri kits, I got to check the other one today briefly, this one has two types of cowl (one in separate bag, this is the TBM3 cowl i think) but does no appear to have the depth charges ( sprue 'C', ? ) while the other kit has sprue 'C' but only one cowl. Given that the AM kit came in several variants, and the Italeri kit just got the bagged the sprues i think there may be the odd variation possible. But these kits were secondhand though. HTH T Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 (edited) Hi I have two Italeri kits, I got to check the other one today briefly, this one has two types of cowl (one in separate bag, this is the TBM3 cowl i think) but does no appear to have the depth charges ( sprue 'C', ? ) while the other kit has sprue 'C' but only one cowl. Given that the AM kit came in several variants, and the Italeri kit just got the bagged the sprues i think there may be the odd variation possible. But these kits were secondhand though. HTH T Surprised there are variations. My Italeri kit (2644) has only one cowling front but includes torpedo, depth-charges and radar pod. My reading was that AM had issued their kits in a number of boxings with sprues tailored to match whereas Italeri did one boxing and dumped the whole lot in Edited February 23, 2011 by Seahawk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanguin Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 I saw this via Missing Lynx when I was looking for something else: http://www.flickr.com/photos/8270787@N07/4826066317/ I know nowt about Avenger/Tarpons but for all three aircraft there seems to be an absence of Observer unless he lurks deep in the bowels of the fuselage. Was they hidden away or are they all AWOL? Oh, and these have the nose gun. Apart from that, this sequence of photos (mentioned elsewhere on these boards with reference to a Proctor) is well worth a wander through for all manner of aircraft and vehicles. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don McIntyre Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 The AM kit was lacking the "center seat" for the RN observer station. IIRC this caused a quite a bit of discussion when the kit was first released. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUNDON Posted February 25, 2011 Author Share Posted February 25, 2011 Thanks everybody for your comments and help. I made a start on my Tarpon last night after finding some pictures showing some of the detail in the observer station so I'm just going to wing it a bit. I will add some pictures when I start my work in progress. Thanks again. Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 Thanks everybody for your comments and help. I made a start on my Tarpon last night after finding some pictures showing some of the detail in the observer station so I'm just going to wing it a bit. I will add some pictures when I start my work in progress.Thanks again. Martin Could you provide a pointer to where you found the pics of the observer station? I've looked everywhere for some and I know Tony O'Toole also had probs when he did his FAA Avengers for "Model Aircraft Monthly". Thanks in advance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heraldcoupe Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 Could you provide a pointer to where you found the pics of the observer station? Same here, I'd be very interested to see what's been found. Cheers, Bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunshine coast Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 (edited) And me too .... surprised there hasn't been a resin conversion ???? Regards Trevor.. Edited February 25, 2011 by sunshine coast Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUNDON Posted February 25, 2011 Author Share Posted February 25, 2011 (edited) Found all my Avenger Infomation from farposst.ru you may want to use Google Translate because the site is Russian. Look in the forum for files . Martin Edited February 25, 2011 by SUNDON Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUNDON Posted February 25, 2011 Author Share Posted February 25, 2011 This may be a bit easier. Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 This may be a bit easier. Martin Many thanks. It is much easier: I was having trouble getting past the improbably endowed Russian ladies. That's a page from an excellent Czech book I have somewhere. However there's a bit more to it than the sketch shows. At least a chart table and radar scope have to fit in there somewhere but I've never found any pics showing them. I think Tony O'Toole found a quick glimpse on a video of WW2 film footage he had but that's it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heraldcoupe Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 There are photographs of the TBF-1 interior in the D&S book on the Avenger. I've yet to see anything detailing the specifics of equipment in the FAA aircraft though. For the record, KMC produced a conversion set for the TBF-1 when it was first released. Cheers, Bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete M. Posted February 26, 2011 Share Posted February 26, 2011 There are photographs of the TBF-1 interior in the D&S book on the Avenger. I've yet to see anything detailing the specifics of equipment in the FAA aircraft though.For the record, KMC produced a conversion set for the TBF-1 when it was first released. Cheers, Bill. Hi to all. Unfortunately, the 'Holy Grail' of clear photos showing the FAA Tarpon/Avenger's observers cockpit area are still AWOL! The same goes for the same area of the Firefly Mk.1 and the early Barracuda. Not that many of those about either!!!!! Here are a few pics of the old KMC TBF-1 conversion kit which are now under the True Details label (Squadron) and one from the Detail And Scale book showing the TBF-1 second cockpit area. Somewhere in my files I have another photo of the TBF-1 with the seat missing. I'll post it if I come across it. Hope these help to show the basic fittings and structures, but unfortunately, not the FAA fittings and radio/radar fit. I'm planning to use copies of those from the SH Barracuda and the Grand Phoenix Firefly Mk.1 to detail my FAA beast - at this time, no-one can say 'That's completely wrong'!!!!! Cheers, Pete M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUNDON Posted February 26, 2011 Author Share Posted February 26, 2011 Hi to all. Unfortunately, the 'Holy Grail' of clear photos showing the FAA Tarpon/Avenger's observers cockpit area are still AWOL! The same goes for the same area of the Firefly Mk.1 and the early Barracuda. Not that many of those about either!!!!! Here are a few pics of the old KMC TBF-1 conversion kit which are now under the True Details label (Squadron) and one from the Detail And Scale book showing the TBF-1 second cockpit area. Somewhere in my files I have another photo of the TBF-1 with the seat missing. I'll post it if I come across it. Hope these help to show the basic fittings and structures, but unfortunately, not the FAA fittings and radio/radar fit. I'm planning to use copies of those from the SH Barracuda and the Grand Phoenix Firefly Mk.1 to detail my FAA beast - at this time, no-one can say 'That's completely wrong'!!!!! Cheers, Pete M. Wow thanks Pete . This is where I'm at sofar Link not to bad but the oxygen bottles are a little out of position but I might leave them were they are as you can't see much of them when the fuselage halves are closed up. Again thanks Pete. Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyrre Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 (edited) Just a quick note. Avenger/Tarpon 1's with serial JZ100-300 were TBF-1C's. In other words, they had wing guns. You still have to do the observer seat, though. This according to J. Baugher http://www.joebaugher.com/navy_serials/thirdseries5.html Kyrre Edited February 28, 2011 by Kyrre Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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