Blenheim IF Night fighters - 2018 model BQ-W

[AWFK10]

12 hours ago, GrzeM said:

 Warpaint publication gives serial K7159 for this plane - is that possible to check its history?

 

 

The relevant part of K7159's history is:

18 Nov 1939 - 222 Sqn

9 Jan 1940 - 145 Sqn

11 Apr 1940 - 5 OTU

10 Dec 1940 - 54 OTU.

24 Aug 1941 - 51 OTU. Swung on landing  and tipped up, Cranfield, 12 Mar 1942.

21 Sep 1942 - Air Trg

23 Dec 1942 - 10 MU

 

[Selwyn]

9 hours ago, mhaselden said:

 

Hi Selwyn,

 

'Fraid the photo provided by Ed Russell showing BQ-V seems like pretty convincing evidence that the airframe was lacking a turret...or am I missing something obvious?

 

Cheers,
Mark

My typo, meant BQ-G!

 

Selwyn

[GrzeM]

3 hours ago, AWFK10 said:

 

The relevant part of K7159's history is:

18 Nov 1939 - 222 Sqn

9 Jan 1940 - 145 Sqn

11 Apr 1940 - 5 OTU

10 Dec 1940 - 54 OTU.

24 Aug 1941 - 51 OTU. Swung on landing  and tipped up, Cranfield, 12 Mar 1942.

21 Sep 1942 - Air Trg

23 Dec 1942 - 10 MU

 

Thank you!

So my assumption that it's got the Special Night camouflage in the operational unit was wrong.

...or were the OTU AI fitted planes used in emergency as operational fighters during the Blitz?

 

What was the reason of painting training airplanes in Special Night Finish?

Edited May 7, 2017 by GrzeM

[AWFK10]

28 minutes ago, GrzeM said:

Thank you!

So my assumption that it's got the Special Night camouflage in the operational unit was wrong.

...or were the OTU AI fitted planes used in emergency as operational fighters during the Blitz?

It's a pleasure: the more questions that are asked, the more we're all learning. Graham Warner's Blenheim book says that the Fighter Interception Unit's Blenheim 1fs, though primarily being used to develop radar interception techniques, were also used operationally - which makes sense, as their crews would have been fully competent and what better way to develop tactics than by trying them out in actual combat missions? The book doesn't indicate that OTU aircraft were used in the same way, though. Air Ministry Order A.926 (12 Dec 1940)  said that "Service types of aircraft in operational training units.....are to conform to the normal colour scheme for the aircraft role", so when operational Blenheim night fighters were painted Special Night, OTU Blenheim night fighters should have received the same paint scheme.

[Selwyn]

4 hours ago, AWFK10 said:

It's a pleasure: the more questions that are asked, the more we're all learning. Graham Warner's Blenheim book says that the Fighter Interception Unit's Blenheim 1fs, though primarily being used to develop radar interception techniques, were also used operationally - which makes sense, as their crews would have been fully competent and what better way to develop tactics than by trying them out in actual combat missions? The book doesn't indicate that OTU aircraft were used in the same way, though. Air Ministry Order A.926 (12 Dec 1940)  said that "Service types of aircraft in operational training units.....are to conform to the normal colour scheme for the aircraft role", so when operational Blenheim night fighters were painted Special Night, OTU Blenheim night fighters should have received the same paint scheme.

To quote from Sqn Ldr Greaves  statement when arriving at 54 OTU that restarted this thread:

 "They have been modified for night fighting by removing the hydraulic gun turret and fitting a seat and small radar set in the back. The aircraft is painted black"

 

Selwyn

[GrzeM]

Thank you Selwyn for this quote! In fact I missed your post from April and came back to this thread only after the photos posted on Friday.

[mhaselden]

11 hours ago, Selwyn said:

My typo, meant BQ-G!

 

Selwyn

 

Roger that, Selwyn...I did wonder.  I heartily agree that BQ-G may have retained the turret because the viewing angle of that photo makes it impossible to tell for sure.

 

Cheers,
Mark

[Ed Russell]

My plan was to do a model and it's finally happened.

http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/235034300-blenheim-1f-nightfighter-600-sqn/

Even though BQ-G in the previous picture cannot be positively identified as having turret removed, my further reading of the quoted references, particularly about 600 Sqn convinces me that all the mods of RDM2 finish, turret removal and flame damper exhausts were contemporaneous. I have actually done BQ-W because I liked the story but I would have been happy to do BQ-G.

I'll have to do the newer Airfix kit as a DFS nightfighter. Any idea on a serial for ZK-X in Post #97? The net gives one answer which doesn't look like the photo.

[gingerbob]

Just came across this tidbit of evidence in Baughen "The RAF in the Battle of France and the Battle of Britain" p.221 (bottom)

 

Quote

Douglas also wanted Dowding to get rid of the turret on the Blenheim to improve speed.  Again, Dowding refused.  On this issue, Dowding perhaps had a stronger case; on the two occasions in August that Blenheims claimed victories, the fighter had flown alongside the bomber and completed the destruction with aimed fire from [the] single machine gun in the turret.

 

[TeeELL]

I have found this thread by chance.  I am trying to nail down the use of Blenheim fighters by 29(F) Sqn.  The Blenheim 1f replaced their ‘turret’ Demons and were flown until the latter part of August 1939 when the Sqn re-Equipped with Hurricanes.  However, at the end of September they were re-designated a night fighter Sqn and received Blenheims, again the 1f.  It is reported that the Sqn was non-operational through October whilst the Browning gun packs were fitted.  In an earlier post, there is a photo of a pilot entering the cockpit of a Blenheim, this is one of several photos showing, the crew climbing into a 29(F) Sqn aircraft.  If I can find them I will post the link here, the aircraft clearly displays the Post Sep ‘39 identification letters.

 

I cannot get the URL to work.  Look on ALAMY stock photos, search ‘Blenheim aircraft’, the photo showing pilot and observer climbing into ......  note the same pilot as in earlier post and the aircraft XoR?, the pilot is  Fg Off L G H Kells of 29(F)Sqn.  See the following:

http://www.bbm.org.uk/airmen/Kells.htm