1:72 VC-10

[richellis]

I did the same at SMW, e-mailed anyway! Cant hurt!

[Vulcanicity]

so have I, for what it's worth...

[xffw45343tg]

Me too.

I toyed with the idea of asking them not to consider a 1:72 RAF Tristar on the grounds that no one would buy it, but then decided that I was prepared to let them make their own minds up on this occasion.

[Kev1n]

So Kevin is largely right (who'd of thought I'd type that? )

(aggressive rebellious defensive mode on...)

Is it coz I is little?

being right is a habit I have.....

(aggressive rebellious defensive mode off....modest mode on)

and I sent airfix an email asking for a 1/72 VC10 as well....

[xffw45343tg]

Is it coz I is little?

Yes (and because of your cheeky comment about your elders earlier on.)

and I sent airfix an email asking for a 1/72 VC10 as well....

Good lad! Welcome to The Optimists Club. The good news is that membership is free, the bad news is... (er, hang on... there is no bad news in an optimists' club!! Result!)

[Kev1n]

Yes (and because of your cheeky comment about your elders earlier on.)

Result!)

cheeky comment?

which one?....there are so many

do you expect anything else???

[xffw45343tg]

Thought it was about time I bumped this again - purely to help Airfix come to their senses and schedule a 1:72 VC-10 into production.

We can but hope...

[bzn20]

C.MK1 10sqn.Before the refitting of the refueling probe.With correct wing and fittings and CORRECT detailing,fences,rib22,rib8 &10,tank lids.Removeable/opening panels described (not trenches either)Same for wing plank joints.Nose u/c tyres with chines.Correct beaver tails and stub wing.

I'm not loosing sleep waiting for one tho'.

[stever219]

A boxing for both BOAC Standard and RAF K. MK. 2 would probably make commercial sense for any kit producer: military and civil versions in one box with maximum parts commonality (the K.2s were all ex-BOAC Standards fitted for AAR). The same could be said for the BOAC Supers and K. Mk. 4.

The idea of a multi-version kit for both Standard and Super is a bit of a non-runner: on the latter the port rear passengr door is at the reaar of the cabin; on the Standard (and the RAF V.1106s) it's ahead of the wing root. A wing could be designed to caater for all sub-types with a separate section ahead of the front spar to cater for the extended chord of some versions with the fences as add-on components for specific boxings.

The engines are also entertaining: the early Supers had thrust reversers on all four IIRC, but those on the inners were deleted, then, of course, there is the question of the incidence on the BOAC Standards compared to all others (apart from GARTA). The Supers and the 1106s had "wet" ns, so that could be a separate assembly (and sprue) for the relevant boxings.

Just my two penn'ort and yes AIrfix, (or Revel, or Trumpeter) I really would like a 1//72nd scale VC-10, please!

[bzn20]

I'm just saying...

There are at least 4 different beavertails,3 or 4 diff.stub wings.4% increase in area for C.MK 1,Super,K3 and K4.

Then we have the Standard (fuse) with cabin freight doors.RAF,Ghana,BUA,Caledonian/BUA,BCAL,Sierra Leone (British United) MEA,Air Malawi,RAE Bedford.Sultan of Oman

Standard without frt doors BOAC,BA,Gulf air,Laker,BUA,Caledonian/BUA,BCALSheik ? UAE,Air Ceylon (boac)Sierra Leone (boac) Nigeria a/w,RAF

Then the Super with cabin freight door EAA,RAF.

The rear frt door is on the stb side Super,port on all others inc C.MK1

Super wing with Standard fuse.Not all Standard or Super wings are the same.EAA/BA and RAF all different, minor details tho'.

Depending how picky you want to be.

Inbd wing fences at least 4 different shapes and 2 different positions.

Fin Detailing,ie.with or without fin tanks.

The PAX/service/fwd and rear frt door situation could be sorted by decals.

So either its going to be an aftermarket bits fest or too much for some who dont scratch build or can afford to buy mod kits after buying a £50 (?) model.

whats the break even point?Given the tooling costs mentioned earlier in this thread is around £150k.(is that accurate?,i've no idea) More than 3000 kits anyway.

So which version!

Stever219 (anything to do with Halton?)

I think your post is a good start.But i want a C.MK 1 1984 mod state!

One more XV809/XLR/XV809 ...You're going to need a bigger engine.

Edited November 27, 2012 by bzn20

[stever219]

BZN20,

Sorry, nothing to do with Halton and, sadly, apart from being in the CCF at school, nothing to do with the RAF (refused entry on medical grounds),

Steve

[xffw45343tg]

Bzn20 - that's an impressive and useful list of variants; someone has been doing his research.

Whilst it is clear that doing a single boxing with every potential configuration would be unlikely, the one thing that Airfix seem to always have been pretty good at (Concorde excepted) is getting basic shapes right. It seems to me that if this was the case for a VC-10, the aftermarket would inevitably respond to whatever it collectively perceived as gaps. I really like your idea about engineering the wing leading edge to be interchangable - a lot of gain for not much pain.

I guess also that if a manufacturer were trying to cover as many bases as possible, it makes sense to scribe all the possible openings in all the possible positions. Like with windows, the noble rivet counters can fill more easily than scribe.

So who will be the 100th voter I wonder?

Kirk

PS/ I love statistics. It's possible to argue that a majority of respondants would (like me) prefer the ability to model XV109...

[garryrussell]

Bzn20

Thanks for that

Just a little note

Laker didn't operate the VC 10.

The aircraft (G-ARTA/OD-AFA) spent the whole time on lease to MEA and then was sold to British United before the lease ended. As modified to airline service she was a V.1109 and a hybrid keeping basically the V.1100 fuse but with V.1106 wings

Edited November 26, 2012 by garryrussell

[bzn20]

Gary

Laker had it for a short while then British United got it and flew it long enough for the BUA,Caledonian/BUA/BCAL colours.I went to the Laker Hangar 68 ? not sure now. G-ARTA was in the Hangar.got a look 'round.Then again later in the BOAC Hangars,Heathrow when MEA had it.BCAL hit the Gatwick runway with it and bounced it a few times in one landing creasing the fuse 'round the rear PAX door.Write off.I think all the opperators leased the proto. from Vickers.

You're right about G-ARTA tho' it was a type 1100.It started with the Standard wing then was modified to prove the (Super) wing improvements,Tips and 4% increase in wing area.I'd forgotten all about that.I'm sure i've got an old Flight int. photo of it with Freddie Laker somewhere in my files,i'll try and dig it out.

Edited November 27, 2012 by bzn20

[bzn20]

Done some digging,no luck yet with Laker's ten yet,its one PDF in amongst 200 others,should have renamed them!

Laker bought GARTA from Vickers/BAC 1968 and not long after at all,immediately! leased it to MEA (OD-AFA).After the lease had finished Laker then sold it back to BAC who then sold it to British United back as GARTA it flew in the dk blue cheat line,white fin with Union Jack markings.Further sprayed in BUA,Caladonian/BUA and Caledonian colours until written off in 1972.

Another thing i'd forgotton about was that BUA had their three original 'tens,SIW,SIX and TDJ with the increased wing area.

So, when i saw it in Laker's hangar it would have been in MEA's colours.The cheat line was masked ready for spraying and with the staging 'round the fin obscuring it.the other excuse it was a winter sunday afternoon and the main hangar lights werent on.Other than that i'll plead some ammendment for lack of memory! I was only 13 and had cycled there from near heathrow.The MEA kite I went on at BOAC's hangar was 9G-ABP(the very one that blown up by isreali comandos,Beirut '68)Not OD-AFA as i said before.

The picture i'm looking for will probably turn into Freddie Laker in front of a 1-11 and VC-10 allright but with BUA on the fin!

Edited November 27, 2012 by bzn20

[venomvixen]

Whats the one that flew with the RAE (?) XX something

David Maltby made a pearler of it for flight sim.

Apparentley some heathen chopped it up for scrap but bits of it got used as a ground trainer called the VC-5

I'd dearly love to make it in 1/72

[Hoppy]

Hi Danni

The RAE VC10 was I think XX914 and it's a great colour scheme, Gemani Wings do. 1/400 die cast in RAE markings.

How are making out in the big heat today in Sydney ? fun isn't it.

Regards Bob

Sitting in front of our air conditioner

[venomvixen]

Hi Danni

The RAE VC10 was I think XX914 and it's a great colour scheme, Gemani Wings do. 1/400 die cast in RAE markings.

How are making out in the big heat today in Sydney ? fun isn't it.

Regards Bob

Sitting in front of our air conditioner

I'm not in Sydney but its still 36 degrees at 8.40pm and most yukky!

[bzn20]

XX914.We were sent to rob the rear Flap Trolleys off this kite mid/late 70's, along with the 'ten at Duxford,Cosford and XR809 at Kemble.We never called that one XLR it was looked on as ours and was "stolen by civvie's"!

We swopped them for u/s trolleys although '914 ended up with one flap,maybe two being lashed up because we didnt have enough flap trolleys to swap.The reason for all these "thefts"?There was a fire in the stores at Brooklands,Weybridge.This particular stores building held VC-10 and Concorde spares.We couldnt get the parts we needed,so after robbing these 'tens the bits had to be UV die penetranted for cracks,bay serviced,some weren't any use.They were at least as bad as the ones we'd fitted to the "museum pieces".Eventually BAC/vickers got some manufactured.With the insurance pay out they probably made more money than selling a couple more VC-10's and also got them a pile for the Concorde bits .This trolley problem reared its head again in the late 80's / early 90's.VC-10's due a major were parked outside base hangar and became "Christmas trees".Just sat there for weeks sometimes with bits hanging off.It was a daily visit to get at the bits we needed after getting the Rob Chit signed by an eng officer.It also meant we didnt have to go cap in hand to the Grippers (storemen).Always a bonus somewhere!

Edited November 30, 2012 by bzn20

[Mike Howles]

I of course would like a CMk1 from the time I was at BZN pre probe. We actually trial fitted the first one. And I did the acceptance checks on ZA141 when it arrived so something from that era. However it wuld be handy if there were options for Super and the other standards with civvie colours.

[Kev1n]

It's nice having a dreamy topic like this but does anybody seriously think airfix (or anybody else) is going to release a

1/72nd VC10. Of any mark?

It would be a humongously huge model - and probably fairly pricey. Which would put it beyond most people, so limiting it's

mass-sales appeal.

But I would like one.....

[xffw45343tg]

Why do people keep asking questions like yours Kev1n?

Surely it's quite simple isn't it? Kit manufacturers make kits to make money. If you're going to make 1 kit to sell in the UK, it is probably going to be a 1:72 Spitfire of some description because you don't need to pay a big fat licence fee to anyone and they sell by the bucket load - though the market is correspondingly pretty crowded. If lots of people said they even want a 1:24 747 and you believe they're going to buy them at a price that will make a return on your design/tooling investment then why would you sit around second guessing where they're going to put it?

That there are quite a few big 1:72 aircraft out there suggests that size alone is not a determining factor. Include a wall bracket rather than a desk stand and I think you go some way to overcoming the size issue.

It would not be unreasonable to predict that if an IM kit were priced at around that of the Anigrand or Magna it would sell at a substantially faster rate than either. If it is more that £20, it will sell more slowly than a 1:72 Spit., so I concede that its market is probably smaller.

That the VC-10 has had both a civil and military role very much counts in its favour. I'd warrant a guess that a greater proportion of servicemen (&women) build scale models than those from the remainder of the population and that many will have fond memories of the 'ten.

I have no idea how the Concorde, Valiant, Vulcan and Nimrod in 1:72 have performed against their respective business plans but I would also guess this is the one piece of information that will determine whether or not there will ever be a new injection moulded VC-10.

So, if you do want a big 'ten, please post about which one you're going to do and what interior detail you're going to add and not how other people won't buy it.

I'll stop ranting now. I should even apologise for taking it out on you Kev1n; Sorry - it's been a bad day and it's not your fault. Just make sure you do buy one when it does happen and don't stop telling Airfix that you will either!!

Kirk (the grumpy optimist)

PS/ If anyone from Airfix would like to reveal how many they would need to sell to make it a goer, I'll happily start another thread entitled "VC-10: you know you want one"

[chris57]

Like you guys i'd love an IM vc10, military option,but while your waiting i do have a few Magna ones in stock looking for a good home

[xffw45343tg]

Of course if I buy one of those it will GUARANTEE a simultaneous announcement from Airfix, Revell and Hasegawa...

[Kev1n]

LMAO ^

thats for sure

I commented Kirk because as much as I would love one or even two, I dont see it happening - but I will pester airfix some more.

...and save my dosh....