Malta's Blue Spitfires - or Gray

[JohnT]

Is this where I find out how big a warning you get for starting fights in the playground? I think I saw a "lets not get started on that one" type comment a while back.

I am doing some preliminary research into a 603 City of Edinburgh RAuxAF line up and have most of the models in the stash already so I was looking at finding a bit more about the squadron from the very good 2 Vol history and on Saturday I bought the Osprey "Malta Spitfire Aces" book.

The consensus seems to be that when 603 embarked on the carrier Wasp for Malta they were painted in a disruptive camo pattern. The photos in black and white show it quite well but you can't say if it was sea temperate scheme or desert browns. The Osprey book says it was the desert scheme of Middle Stone/ Dark Earth/ Sky blue. The squadron history acknowledges that it might have been the temperate scheme but against that the authors reckon that the photos available do not show the aircraft being hoisted aboard with the leading edge yellow strip on mainplanes and sky band round fuselage that would come as standard with the sea temperate scheme so balance favours them being painted in desert camo disruptive pattern. They also speculate that there would not have been the urgency to re-paint aircraft already in a disruptive grey pattern but there woud be if they were in two shades of brown and comment was that an if order came through to re-paint while on board before flying off in a blue/grey scheme (as possibly it was thought that the Spitfires would be spending most of their time over water) the blue/grey scheme would have been better to conceal the aircraft.

No one seems to know for sure if the re-paint order came before the Wasp left the Clyde and if paint was taken on board for the purpose of a repaint or if supplies on US navy non specular sea blue presumably already on board had to be used if the order came through after sailing. (? Would Wasp carry enough paint in stock store for such an extensive re-paint as a matter of course?)

I think the most likely consensus view from the 2 books is

a the aircraft were embarked in a disruptive scheme - which one probably does not matter that much if painting a Spitfire in its arrived condition though patches of original paint scheme showed through on some aircraft round serial etc which were not over-painted.

b many if not all were re-painted in some haste while on board with a paint colour thats anyones guess - depending on whether the paint was embarked in haste too or was already from an on board stock .

c the paint didn't wear well when in service on Malta and looks like all sorts of fading and wear seems to have taken effect

So - can I use any blue/gey paint I fancy then ? !!!

And do I get a warning for starting something?

Have ready just in case

One final passing thought - a strange precursor of the hurried paint job done on the SHARs for the Falklands War. It might be interesting to compare the 2 scenarios re rough re-paint, paint from store, etc

JohnT

[AnonymousAA72]

One final passing thought - a strange precursor of the hurried paint job done on the SHARs for the Falklands War. It might be interesting to compare the 2 scenarios re rough re-paint, paint from store, etc

JohnT

Others on here will be better placed to comment on the colours used on the Spitfires! (I've read a few arguments on this subject on a few websites over the years!). But as you mention the Falkland Shar's I thought I'd add a few comments. The SHARS sailed south on HMS Invincible and HMS Hermes. the former sprayed EDSG over the white surfaces as they had the facilities to do so, and they brush painted the SHARs on the Hermes. BOTH ships it would seem had stocks of Extra Dark Sea Grey, so the colours actually matched the upper surfaces, though some say the lower surfaces were slightly lighter due to the white below. This was unlike grey/blue paint being applied over Dark Earth/Midstone on the Spits. I'd say its probably NOT a good comparison.....and both events were 40years apart!!!

[Troy Smith]

Is this where I find out how big a warning you get for starting fights in the playground? I think I saw a "lets not get started on that one" type comment a while back.

I am doing some preliminary research into a 603 City of Edinburgh RAuxAF line up and have most of the models in the stash already so I was looking at finding a bit more about the squadron from the very good 2 Vol history and on Saturday I bought the Osprey "Malta Spitfire Aces" book.

Hi John

Not quite the same, but you may find this of use, a while back i found a clip on youtube

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q0Rw5VB5b8U

with malta spits. In Colour. the first bit shows some V's taxying, red spinners, azure blue undersides, dark blue on top. The resy is in flight. If you have a youtube downlaoder you can make video grabs.

Note the 2nd spit has what looks like 6 stub exhaust, and white or sky patches over the wing gunports.

I don't think the flying spits are the same planes.

There is a a photo of a Hurricane IIA, tranferred to the navy. quite famous pic, which has been repainted, BG766 probably EDSG on top, (you can see the spray on the red fin flash)

HTH

T

[stevehnz]

Hi John

Not quite the same, but you may find this of use, a while back i found a clip on youtube

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q0Rw5VB5b8U

with malta spits. In Colour. the first bit shows some V's taxying, red spinners, azure blue undersides, dark blue on top. The resy is in flight. If you have a youtube downlaoder you can make video grabs.

Note the 2nd spit has what looks like 6 stub exhaust, and white or sky patches over the wing gunports.

I don't think the flying spits are the same planes.

There is a a photo of a Hurricane IIA, tranferred to the navy. quite famous pic, which has been repainted, BG766 probably EDSG on top, (you can see the spray on the red fin flash)

HTH

T

The flying Spits appear to be Mk IXs. I have seen mention elsewhere of Mk VCs fitted with 6 stub exhausts to enhance their performance.

Steve.

[Giorgio N]

The flying Spits appear to be Mk IXs.

Not only that, the Vcs taking off at the beginning of the video are italian cobelligerant air force spitfires in day fighter scheme ! You can notice the underwing roundel has red on the outside. And you can see the dividing line between the green and the grey on the engine cowling aft. This is part of an IWM movie showing italian spits in 1945. Mind, a very interesting movie itself, as shows that these planes were in day fighter scheme and not all in desert scheme as some 30 year old magazines would like us to believe.. but this is another can of worms.

Nice video, but a mix of bits and pieces taken from different sources.

[Edgar]

An American researcher (the Americans will have to forgive me, but I've forgotten his name) has checked Wasp's records, and found no reference to British paints being loaded at any time. This leaves us with the stocks available, and, according to records, Wasp was painted, on the upper surfaces, with Deck Blue 20-B (White Ensign WEMCC US10.) Much has been made that this was just a stain, but, apparently, there was a genuine paint, which was used for the metalworks, with the stain being reserved for the wooden deck. Deck Blue 20-B is a very dark blue.

On April 7th., 1942, H.Q. Malta sent a signal to the Air Ministry, requesting that all further Spitfires be sea camouflaged, either before leaving the U.K., or at Gibraltar. On 24-4-42, the D.W.O. issued an order for 50 Spitfires to be flown to Abbotsinch, 47 of which were "to be embarked as before." Paragraph 4, of the order says "Aircraft are to be sea camouflaged before embarkation." Would anyone have had the nerve to go against such an order? Tenuous, I know, but, apparently, one pilot remarked on how attractive the aircraft looked, in their fresh green paint; I can't say for sure, but suspect that slate grey might appear green, under the Malta sun.

Nothing to do with the paint, but, on 11-4-42, D.O.Ops noted that various lightening procedures were being undertaken, to improve Spitfire performance. This included:- removal of the I.F.F.; removal of the signal discharger; removal of the rear oxygen bottle with its fittings; removal of turning (starting) handles, controls locking bars, message pads, height & air speed computers; removal of TR9D aerial masts on the rudder; removal, and fairing over, of the air extractor scoops under the wings; cannon empty chute cut off level with main plane; utmost care to be taken for a smooth finish (see paragraph above) with dope spray to be used instead of brush.

Finally, a modification, on Spitfire V Trop., to fit multi-ejector exhausts, was not instituted until 14-1-44.

Others can (and will, I'm sure) choose their own path, in this little maze, but I know in which direction I'd head.

Edgar

[Test Graham]

There are different colour possibilities - is this a thread about the Spits delivered on Calendar specifically as opposed to on Malta generally? If so, then there are several pilot's comments on them being blue or blue-grey, including the artist and Calendar pilot Dennis Barnham who became an ace on Malta (one of his paintings is in the IWM showing blue Spitfires), Laddie Lucas and Tony Holland, plus a colour photo from some time later showing Weaver's (Calendar) aircraft down on a Sicilian beach.

The aircraft were loaded in Glasgow docks. There are a large number of photos available. Some show aircraft on the distant dockside in the poor light of early morning, and they are clearly in disruptive camouflage, with apparently low demarcation. These views do suggest Temperate Land or Temperate Sea. However views in better light of the aircraft being lowered onto Wasp's deck show the high contrast of desert camouflage - which previous aircraft had been delivered in. Calendar pilot NZ ace Jack Rae remembers a light blue - presumably the underside.

There is no doubt that the aircraft were repainted on the voyage. All sources agree on this. I've even seen a story that they were repainted four times on voyage because of contradictory orders - given the time and space constraints this is clearly a fairy story, but is representative of some of the unreal tales floating around about these aircraft. There is a good view of one on a lower deck showing a fairly rough paint finish, single dark colour uppersurfaces. There are several photos of the launch, in the poor light of dawn, showing a single very dark uppersurface colour. It is very clearly darker than the Blue Grey on the adjacent F4Fs. Photos of the Calendar aircraft on Malta show a single medium-dark uppersurface - but so do other photos of non-Calendar aircraft, which is a different story.

Aircraft are not painted in ship paint. Aircraft are painted in dedicated aircraft paints, with their own chemical constitution giving good adhesion over a wide range of pressures and temperatures, and they are designed to be light, covering well in thin applications. Ship paints are heavier, applied thicker, and are designed to resist salt water over a much more limited environmental range. Weaver's aircraft has been touched up, but the basic paint finish is in very good condition despite some months on Malta. This rules out any "bodged" paintwork, the job may have been rushed but good materials were used.

Ron Smith has pointed out the lack records of any British paint being taken onboard Wasp: he has not answered the question about whether the records include other British stores required by the Spitfires such as hydraulic fluids. I retain the possibility that such paint was provided but not noted: the question then would be what would be regarded as a sea camouflage. The answer has to be Extra Dark Sea Grey and Dark Slate Grey. Only one colour has been noted: it is very dark when fresh, is spoken of as blue, and looks blue when faded. Sounds exactly like Extra Dark Sea Grey. Another possibility is that only a shade card was taken on Wasp, and the resulting colour is the USN Blue Grey with added Ultramarine pigment from ship stores. The paint cannot have been Non-Specular (or any other) Sea Blue, as this colour was a year away from appearance.

The Calendar delivery was followed immediately by a second, Bowery, prepared at short notice because the Calendar deliveries suffered heavy losses. Aircraft on this delivery were not repainted. To me, this suggests that the Calendar overpainting was not done with paint normally available on Wasp.

Edgar: the only comments I have about green on Malta Spitfires are from some time later than the spring and early summer deliveries, although of course Dark Green was a well-known and available colour on the island because of all the Hurricanes delivered in the Temperate Land colour scheme. Can you please tell me where this quote is to be found, and who said it? Chronology is very important in distinguishing these schemes. Dark Slate Grey would indeed have looked green, but was considerably lighter than EDSG. There is no evidence of such a lighter colour on the Calendar aircraft: I suspect that either it was not delivered (as Ron Smith would argue) or the decision was made somewhere that it was not possible to paint two colours in a disruptive finish in the time and conditions available in Wasp's hangar deck - where many aircraft were stored on hoists from the "ceiling" (sorry, I forget the correct nautical term!).

Before Calendar, aircraft are known to have been repainted in a single very dark grey (or blue-grey) said to be a mix. The Takali wing, specifically 249 Sq, retained a single very dark colour on the uppersurfaces on their fighters well into 1943. Hal Far units appear to have been less interested. Although Barnham's aircraft retained its Calendar Blue (and four cannon!) he describes seeing a desert-camouflaged Spitfire. An RAF painter on Malta, on Beaufighters, described thinning down scarce stocks of EDSG for use in overpainting the Mid Stone on Spitfires - this partial overpainting can be seen in photos. After the summer siege ended, desert camouflage and perhaps even Temperate Land camouflage becomes more common (249 excepted!)

Edited April 13, 2010 by Graham Boak

[Steven Eisenman]

The exact answer may never be known, but there are possibilities. As for the need for "real" aircraft paint, that is an assumptions. Aircraft have been painted with not-real aircraft paint. For example, house paint was used in VietNam on aircraft, and US Army truck paint was used on aircraft in the SWP and Mediterranean and the Aleutians.

Here is the full article from Ron Smith:

From Ron Smith

June 3 2009 at 5:44 PM John Snyder (Login johnwem)

HyperScale Forums

from IP address 83.138.172.72

Response to Malta Spitfires (you there Modeldad)

Ron asked me to post the following, as HS doesn't seem to like him today:

"According to manufacturing specs at NARA there is no difference between

the pigment for ship paint or aircraft paint at the manufacturing level.

We're talking about QA lab level specs where they not only specify

materials but tests to verify the quality of the batch, at that level

the color is given in wavelengths reflected (angstrom is the unit) as

well as grain size for the pigment. Where the difference between ship

and aircraft paint happens is the paint base the pigments get mixed

into. Please don't guess, get off your butt and research the original

material instead leading people down a fallacious path with your claims

of pigment grain size.

USN aircraft paint could either be a lacquer intended for spraying or a

varnish based paint intended for brushing. We'll refer to the varnish

based paint as enamel even if it isn't 100% technically correct it's

close enough. Ship paint was the latter type, yards tended to thin and

spray it while crews tended to brush or roll it it. Again this is from

the original documents.

Wasp, like all carriers from CV-2 onwards, had two paint lockers, one

the ship's locker the other the aviation locker. Standard paints in the

aviation locker were enamels in the colors of ID markings, including

small amounts of the brighter prewar colors, black and white for

stencils, zinc chromate, grey primer, red lead pigmented primer, red

lead pigmented shrinking dope, and small amounts of the camouflage

colors intended for touch up but not complete repaints of the airwing.

The ship's paint locker would have 250-N flight deck stain, 251-N flight

deck marking paint, various cans of striping paint for color coding

inside the ship, various floor and interior paints, red lead primer,

zinc chromate primer, 20-B deck blue, 5-U white paint base for external

use, 5-TM tinting material (think Payne's Grey and you won't be too far

off) to be mixed into the 5-U to make the external camouflage colors and

possibly the Captain would have had his bosun make sure there was enough

premixed 5-N, 5-O and 5-H for immediate touch up use already mixed. What

there won't be in the locker are the boot topping and anti-fouling

coatings but all other internal and external paints are there. Wasp wore

5-N, 5-O and 5-H. We're still running off original documents to this

point, not secondary or tertiary sources.

Now we apply a bit of logic.

Now what paint would they use? Let's go with what they won't use first.

They aren't going to use the 250-N flight deck stain, it is not paint

nor does it tint paint particularly well and such paint would not dry or

adhere worth a damn. Not likely they used the blue/grey from the

aviation locker either, there isn't that much there since what's carried

aboard is sufficient for touch up and not complete repaints of the

airwing. Despite claims it may have been used and was dark when first

applied it isn't as dark as the repainted Spits. This leaves four

paints, blue striping paint, insignia blue, 5-N and 20-B. Not blue

striping paint for sure, it's a lighter true blue used to color code

things inside the ship and they would only have a few gallons, likely in

quart cans and it's glossy. Probably not insignia blue as they would

only have enough to repaint the markings on the airwing. We have two

paints left, both ship paints, 5-N and 20-B. 20-B is supplied ready to

use, 5-N has to be mixed from 5-TM and 5-U. 20-B is only used on

external steel decks, not the wooden flight deck but there is still a

huge amount of that nice premixed paint carried. Now figure which of

those two paints the bosun was most likely to part with and you have

your best deduced answer. Ship paint can be thinned enough to use on

aircraft without significant degradation of performance. 5-TM can be

used to tint aviation paint but given the limited amount of same on

board that is unlikely.

The argument of British paint is also false, if it wasn't in the C&R

Allowance Logs (even though C&R officially goes away in 1941 those logs

stay in use under that name through most the war on ships commissioned

before July 1941), if it came aboard or left the ship it was recorded in

detail in the decklog. There is no mention of British paint being loaded

in the decklog. Having run through tens of thousands of pages of

decklogs from 1937 through 1943 I have seen one and only one exception

to this rule and it is CV-8 Hornet, the only mention of the Doolittle

Raid is the day of the raid as the last B-25 cleared her deck the entry

is: "US Army bombers completed launching." Wasp however does list the

Spitfires being loaded and British personnel as they report aboard.

Now if you want a solid answer and if it exists it will be in the

various other records of Wasp at NARA. I invite you to get off your butt

and spend anywhere from 10-80 hours ferreting it out from the original

documents. Those records are spread across several record groups and

there is no guarantee which group it will be in. If the answer exists

I've just told you where to find it, I personally don't care either way.

I'm just tired of seeing hot air blown out various orifices over the

subject based on secondary and tertiary sources and not one of you doing

your due diligence of checking the original documents, which do exist.

Real research is done with primary materials, all else is mere

regurgitation of references produced by other people."

Cheers,

John Snyder

The Token Yank

White Ensign Models

http://whiteensignmodels.com

[Test Graham]

Thanks for republishing it. As I said: he mentions there were no paint records, but says nothing about other items that would have to be loaded. I'm not in a position to investigate USN records held in the USA. Until those who are in such a position are willing to confirm or deny that the records go beyond the aircraft and men into the supply of lesser parts and consumables, the matter has to remain open.

Facts. The aircraft were repainted on board ship, into some dark grey/blue colour, the appearance and subsequent behaviour of which matches an appropriate British paint. The USN had no appropriate shade in its range, at that time. The Air Ministry did, and had issued orders for the repainting of these aircraft into appropriate colour(s). The Air Ministry managed to organise the delivery of over 50 Spitfires to Glasgow docks, allowing in passing for two that were lost en-route.

So it is beyond their ability to organise the similar delivery of a few gallons of paint? This appear to be the logical inference, if the paint was not delivered. Believe it if you like, I prefer to keep an open mind.

re painting high-performance aircraft. What they may or may not have done to helicopters or light aircraft in Vietnam, after another 30 years of paint technology development, is not particularly relevant here. You can be absolutely certain that such paints were not applied to F-4s or F-105s. There were dedicated paints for fabrics, and for light alloys, and for steels. Aircraft were the former, ships the latter, and the environmental constraints on their designs have been stated. The Spitfires were high performance cutting edge technology in 1942, needed on Malta for their high performance: no competent engineer would have permitted the use of inappropriate and (for the role) second rate materials. The Weaver aircraft makes it quite clear that the Calendar Blue, whatever it actually was, was high quality, not crabfat or woodstain.

The alternative was not the failure of the delivery - one such ferry was indeed cancelled on the insistence of the engineer in charge, much to the RN's disgust. The reason there was rather stronger! (Lack of fuel flow from the ferry tank.) The worst that could have happened here was that the aircraft would have been delivered in the desert camouflage: as all Spitfires had been before and those immediately after were to be, and seen to operate in. No-one was backed into a hard place with no alternative but accept the use of crud (for that is what ship paint would be on aircraft - whatever its value in its design role).

If it was used, why wasn't it used again on Bowery? 50 Spitfires would not exhaust the supplies of ship paint. It might exhaust the supply of ship stored aviation paint, and supply of fresh British paint could have been overlooked in the comparative rush of Bowery, but there seems no supply reason why Bowery's Spitfires couldn't have been in Measure 12. They weren't. Logic, and engineering judgement, with a touch of common sense, tells you that the Calendar ones weren't either.

Edited April 13, 2010 by Graham Boak

[Nick Millman]

Just a small interjection to comment on Graham's description of Extra Dark Sea Grey as "blue".

The colour has been given as Munsell 10 B 3.5/1. Methuen 23F2 ("bluish grey") and similar to FS 36118 (which is lighter). That all suggests a dark bluish grey rather than a dark neutral grey as it is sometimes depicted.

[Test Graham]

Blue when faded, what what I meant. Very dark grey with a slight bluish tinge when fresh

The exact colour is only of second-order interest for modelling, as long as it is in the right range of colours. For my model of Barnham's somewhat used aircraft I used an old tin of Airfix RAF Ensign Blue, which turned out to be a close (enough) match to Mediterranean Light Blue, or Humbrol's version of Azure Blue, which in turn is what Weaver's aircraft appears to be - but we could start another thread on the reliability of interpretations from colour photos, and the available paints. MLB is available from WEM. For a model of a used aircraft, anything "somewhere in there" can't be argued against, for the right aircraft at the right time - and probably that means on the right base.

Historically, it seems unlikely that the AM would interpret an request for a maritime scheme, from a Mediterranean source, as a demand for MLB, but I guess stranger things have happened in wars. MLB also does not appear to be dark enough to fit the aircraft seen on Wasp pre-launch. EDSG seems to match more of the evidence than alternatives do - but if it wasn't, it was something like!

It may be that we have one or more blue-grey on Malta-painted aircraft and possibly another, bluer, one on Calendar deliveries.

[JohnT]

Thanks for all the input guys. Its responses like these that never cease to amaze me. The depth of knowledge is only matched by the BM'ers willingness to share it.

I have bought five lottery tickets and if I win the big one I'll pay for you guys to have a week at the US archives to have a rumage through them !!

JohnT

[Steven Eisenman]

Thanks for all the input guys. Its responses like these that never cease to amaze me. The depth of knowledge is only matched by the BM'ers willingness to share it.

I have bought five lottery tickets and if I win the big one I'll pay for you guys to have a week at the US archives to have a rumage through them !!

JohnT

I'd prefer that if you win, you'd bring me to the UK where I can rummage trough a few pubs.

[JohnT]

I'd prefer that if you win, you'd bring me to the UK where I can rummage trough a few pubs.

You are on Steve !

[Edgar]

I'd prefer that if you win, you'd bring me to the UK where I can rummage trough a few pubs.

You don't rummage; you crawl.

Edgar

[Test Graham]

"trough a few pubs"? There are times when typos add delightfully to the meaning - if not the image!

[Nick Millman]

Whether you trough, crawl or rummage I recommend 'The Taverns of London' by H E Popham (Cecil Palmer, 1927) if you don't mind a few disappointments.

[gingerbob]

I recommend 'The Taverns of London' by H E Popham (Cecil Palmer, 1927)

Sounds more like an album by the Pogues!

bob

[Nick Millman]

Sounds more like an album by the Pogues!

bob

It does! But no, it's a splendid book that in its gentle, history-infested anecdotes of pub walks through pre-war London brings home only too poignantly what has been lost, in a city, in a nation and in a people. One entry of many will suffice:-

The Spaniards (North London)

"We have in "The Spaniards" one of the most celebrated hostelries in the world. Dating from the middle of the eighteenth century, its name is derived from its first landlords, who were two brothers settled in this country from Spain. Like most other inns that are situated on heaths and commons, it has its claims to be associated with the doings of the robbing (with or without violence, as you please) fraternity. There are on view here pistols, keys and other relics, which are said to have belonged to the redoubtable Turpin. Also the leg-irons which he wore when executed at Newgate; the knives and forks which he was using when interrupted by the Bow Street runners; the window in the staircase which was purposely made for him, so that food could be passed through; and the stable where Black Bess was stalled."

I wonder if those now owning it or going there even know or care? The comments speak volumes about us.

The Spaniards

[stevehnz]

Cripes, we seem to have gotten a long way from Maltese Blue. I must have missed that one Nick, though I lived not too far away from it for a bit a wee while ago. I tried to try all the pubs nearby too.

Back to the subject though, several items/pics purporting to portray Malta based Spits seem to show a blueish colour with the original camo showing through. Is this correct(ish) or no?

Steve

Edited April 15, 2010 by stevehnz

[Test Graham]

There is one colour picture, that shows blue but it is not a patchwork finish nor shows anything else showing through. Moving to b+w, there is at least one very clear photo showing a dark overspray of one colour, with signs of the original near the edges of the colour boundaries. There are many photos showing a dark uppersurface, some well applied and some less so, some with lighter patches around the serial and some not. There are several eye-witness accounts that this dark colour is a blue or blue-grey.

Is your statement correct - yes, there are many such items/pics. Many of them are correct-ish, in my belief. I suspect the representations may be more correct than some of the attempted explanations. (Given that these tend to be contradictory, I guess that's got to be right.) Steve Nichols' recent Osprey on Malta Spitfire Aces is probably the best current account, and collection of photos, although if anything he may have gone too far in the depiction of blue examples: not every Malta Spit was blue, even at the peak of 1942. I know of at least two other books planned on the subject, maybe more will be said there, but more clear photos will always be welcome.

[Edgar]

Edgar: the only comments I have about green on Malta Spitfires are from some time later than the spring and early summer deliveries, although of course Dark Green was a well-known and available colour on the island because of all the Hurricanes delivered in the Temperate Land colour scheme. Can you please tell me where this quote is to be found, and who said it?

I couldn't remember, largely because it was a quote, in an article, which I saw a couple of years ago, and dismissed it as another mistaken pilot. I spoke to a friend, last night, who also remembers it, and we think that it appears in Laddie Lucas's autobiography, but neither of us has a copy.

Edgar

[Test Graham]

I do have that, and will chase it up, but also have a copy of a letter from Lucas to Brian Cauchi, where he responds to a suggestion that the aircraft were in desert camouflage by saying they were all blue in his time, and he never saw a desert coloured Spitfire until after the Wasp delivery(ies). So I suspect it is in one of the other biographies. Not McNair nor Rae, nor barnham - I think Halliday quotes green but I don't have that book.

[sniperUK]

The Diecast Aviation Forum was involved with the release of the Corgi "Merlins Over Malta " set ,a lot of research was done for this the thread is here http://forums.diecast-aviation.eu/showthre...ings+over+malta .

[Steven Eisenman]

The Diecast Aviation Forum was involved with the release of the Corgi "Merlins Over Malta " set ,a lot of research was done for this the thread is here http://forums.diecast-aviation.eu/showthre...ings+over+malta .

51 Pages! care to summarize.

It is clear to me why I hate that forum design.