Questions about primer and Alclad II

[Neilroy]

Questions about primer and Alclad II

Hello all, may I tap the collective knowledge about a few things that have puzzled me for a while?

Primers in general. As far as I know, a primer is applied in order to form a uniform base to which paint

can properly and solidly adhere. I've read about lots of people using Halfords rattle can primers, so I bought

one myself and have a nibble.

1. Even when doing my best to mist on and spray gently, the primer seemed to go on thick enough to at least partially

disguise some of the model's fine panel line detail. Surely adding (potentially) multiple coats of actual paint on

top of this then leaves the original surface detail completely invisible?

2. Would it perhaps be better to decant the Halfords primer and airbrush it on? Would it need thinning in this case?

If so, what on earth would one use?

2. Sanding/smoothing primed models. I understand this has to be done before using Alclad, which I assume needs a

smooth, uniform surface to go on properly. Again, won't you end up sanding away your fine prized surface detail?

To what extent do you need to smooth for Alclad? Finally, will it go successfuly over Halfords grey or does it

need Alcald's own? (This would be for standard Aluminium finish, not the polished ones which I read need to go

over gloss black).

Thanks for reading

Neil

[Mike]

1) I'd decant if I were you - most rattle can nozzles aren't up to the job of model painting. 2) Use a McDonalds' drinking straw - cover the nozzle on the can with one end & direct the other end into a beaker. Allow plenty of extra space in the beaker, as the paint can get a bit frothy as the propellant gases off. Allow it to gas off properly before you attempt to spray it.

3) Not all Alclads are THAT fussy about the surface you paint them onto. As long as your surface is clean and free of grit, hairs, scratches & gacky filler, you can spray all of them onto a grey primer - even the ultra high gloss ones, but you'll get a better finish with those onto a gloss black primer, as it's a lot smoother than a matt or semi-matt finish.

Going back to 1), I'd try a model specific primer such as Mr Surfacer (available in cans and bottles for thinning), or better yet Alclad Grey Primer/Microfiller. That stuff goes on neat, and shrinks down to a very thin layer, and doesn't obscure all the fine detail. Vallejo primer ain't so hot, suffering from a bad nozzle, and thick application with little in the way of self-leveling properties in my experience.

As to buffing up your surface, a lot of people swear by a wad of tshirt material. You could also try micromesh cloths, or a fine grade sponge bufffer - of the type used in nail booths by the girls. Sponges hug the contours better than sticks, and you don't lose your surface detail if you're careful with it.

HTH

[gcn]

Agreed i've never had much luck with Halfords primer although other swear by them. I always end up with a very rough surface.

If I was recommending a primer i'd plump for either the alclad grey primer or, my personal favourite du jour, Mr Surfacer 1200 thinned with either Celulose thinner or their own levelling thinner. As Mike says these are extremely fine primers that won't hide your loveley surface detail, equally they won't hide any seams that haven't been properly dealt with.

Once they've had a day to dry buffing with either an old tee shirt or micromesh pads will give you a smoooooth surface with which to lay your base coat on top of, although with the two primers listed above I find this step rarely necessary.

Alclad will go quite happily over a grey primer, be it their own or anyone elses. You only really need a gloss black surface if you want a highly polished finish such as chrome. I've never used their gloss black primer but it does have a reputation for never drying, I prefer to go down the grey primer, tamiya gloss black route instead.

Alclad real easy to use as well, there's no black art. Just drop the pressure as instructed on the bottle and spray away. clean up with celulose thinner.

Edited February 24, 2010 by gcn

[Daniel]

I started using Halfords after reading this forum, and to start off with I had the same issues. Since I do not have an airbrush I stuck with it. I now always warm the can in hot water (I use HOt water from the kettle, but this may be considered dangerous, others use hot tap water). Shake vigorously (2 minutes), then spray on lightly, do not do in one coat what you can do in 2 or 3 coats (it dries quickly).

With practice you can get a very good finish, and not loose any detail.

Dan

[Iain Ogilvie]

I swear by Alclads own Gloss Black primer for all Alclad colours...

Had very poor results initially using Alclad over Halfords primer - now it's a walk in the park (albeit a smelly one!)

Iain

Edited February 24, 2010 by 32SIG

[Neilroy]

Many thanks for the advice, that's a real help

Edited February 24, 2010 by Neilroy

[Neilroy]

Whoops, I forgot to ask one last thing: The info I've read on Alclad suggests you don't need an after-coat of Klear to act as a base for decaling, nor a post-decal Klear to seal them in. Is this true? Also, where do decal setting solutions such as Micro sol and Micro set stand regarding use with Alclad?

Many thanks

[gcn]

Some add the klear coat some don't.

I do and I've not had any problems. Sol and set work fine, if using Klear then allow 24 hours before you use setting solutions. These days my decal setting solution of choice is another coat of Klear

[Neilroy]

Some add the klear coat some don't.

I do and I've not had any problems. Sol and set work fine, if using Klear then allow 24 hours before you use setting solutions. These days my decal setting solution of choice is another coat of Klear

Ok, I might do some experimentation on scrap and see. This article on Swanny's models suggests that using Klear over Alclad with leave noticeable and unsightly marks:

The Secret Life of Alclad II

Does anybody have any experience of this happening?

Also, what is the 'standard' alclad to use for natural metal aircraft finishes? Would I be right in thinking its the 'Airframe Aluminium' flavour?

Thanks

Edited February 24, 2010 by Neilroy