This site uses cookies! Learn More

This site uses cookies!

You can find a list of those cookies here: mysite.com/cookies

By continuing to use this site, you agree to allow us to store cookies on your computer. :)

  • Announcements

    • Mike

      Ongoing DDoS Attack causing Forum Slowness   26/04/17

      In case you have missed the announcement, the reason that the forum has been slow at times since the minor version update the other day is due to a Denial of Service attack, brute force attack on our email, and judging by the lag with our FTP response, that too.  If you're feeling like you're experiencing a glitch in the Matrix, you're not wrong.  This is the same MO as the attack in September 2016 that occurred when we transitioned to the new version 4 of the software.  We're currently working with US and UK cyber-crime departments, who specialise in this sort of thing, and we're hopeful that we'll be able to track them down this time by using the accumulated evidence already held.    We are pretty certain that it's a continuation of the same attack last year, only at a reduced intensity to deter people from using the site "because it's terribly slow", rather than taking it down completely, and we're also sure of the motivations of those responsible.  Spite.   Please bear with us in the interim, and wish us luck in dealing with these.... "people".
wally7506

British Camo Rubber masks

262 posts in this topic

I've just received this, via PM, from a member, who wishes to remain anonymous, and, seeing the angst that this has, at times, generated, I can't blame him:-

"My late Mum worked on the Mosquito at two locations in East London. The first in Leyton E10 were she was trained as a sprayer. Later she worked in Walthamstow E17 at the Wrighton Factory I have a photograph of her and work mates sitting in front of the 1000th Fuselage built there. Now for the reason for sending this by PM.She told me that she could not get on with spraying as the smells that came off the HIDES that were used as Mats used for masking the Fuselage! My mother worked in Leather trade both before and after the War so she did know a lot about Leather from hides to Brief Cases used by the City toff. The smell given off these hides was as she explained because they were not top quality and were in fact not fully tanned so mixed with paint and thinners gave off a the terrible smell.

I have avoided posting on the Rubber Mats thread as it throws out another idea for some to pull apart and as I do not know if this was used in other factories or just where she worked I now have no way of knowing. So yes I agree with you Mask were used what ever they were made of."

I'm glad he/she shared that. It's very interesting, and makes a lot of sense.A hide, especially one not fully tanned, would be easier to store and handle than a rubber mat.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A hide, especially one not fully tanned, would be easier to store and handle than a rubber mat.

You're kidding right? Ever dealt with hides that haven't been properly tanned.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi All,

Thanks chaddy, Edgar and the anonymous member for your posts, I have no doubt masks were used and were also not used. The following cropped images that show camouflage demarcation on some British manufactured aircraft may be of interest.

16224470431_1ef98a27b7_o.jpg

16224468971_362c74594e_o.jpg

15606484103_d49fdffc6a_o.jpg

16038819658_a4225b36a6_o.jpg

16038818618_a79451338e_o.jpg

16038817258_73ce54c5a5_o.jpg

16225527912_dcb4cae345_o.jpg

15603927834_0da3021984_o.jpg

15603925004_d0a3591da7_o.jpg

16225521322_c2c21ece91_o.jpg

15603920634_f3f71c7222_o.jpg

15603919474_4e2a124e1b_o.jpg

16040210949_f71dbe8344_o.jpg

16200423156_78b46a6900_o.jpg

16038803178_e44e3aee61_o.jpg

15606462693_3dcc71eab2_o.jpg

16038797788_db362aa8ae_o.jpg

15606460493_7e051b0d86_o.jpg

16038945800_754ffbd854_o.jpg

15603907654_f0ea48ca6c_o.jpg

Cheers,

Daniel.

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Lovely images. Please note the appearance of the Sky fuselage band in photo 8 and the Sky codes in photo 15 in the context of descriptions of "light grey" for Sky and Dupont 71-021 elsewhere here!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Further information just received:-

"Edgar I spoke yesterday to a friend of my late Mums who worked in the Spraying shop in Skeltons Lane E10, this was also part of Wrightons Aircraft. Although she tells me her memory is rather weak once we started talking a lot of memories came flooding back.

As to the use of mats she said that she seems to remember that the hides were not fully tanned so that after time the hide would take the shape of the fuselage conforming to all the curving parts. These are my words based on what she told me.

She also remembers the change over to smooth paints which at the time was not as easy at it seems lots of painted fuselages were rejected resulting in all the sprayers being sent back on courses to learn how to use the new paints.

Another down side to working there was not only the bad smell which she remembers really well she also said that many workers also suffered from skin rashes.

No Health and Safety those days she did not get a spray mask issued till after 1945.(She still has this somewhere). Due her to age I did not push her too hard but she has promised to sort out some picture taken at the time for next time I will pop round She also told me She enjoyed recalling these times so she thanked me for asking."

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You're kidding right? Ever dealt with hides that haven't been properly tanned.

Only on a small scale, but I imagine they'd be lighter than rubber!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can I add to the knowledge about leather please. I use a fair bit of it making specialist medieval and modern pieces.

Improperly tanned leather will rot away within days, no longer than a week or so. Remember, leather is the animal skin, tanning is to slow down its rotting away by bacteria. If that tanning is not done properly the bacteria rots the skin away just as quickly.

There are two types of tanning, with chemicals, which is common today, and veg tanning which is still common and moreso before the 1950s.

A veg tanned hide when wetted can be made to conform around shapes. I use 1mm thick veg tan to make small containers, I can make a piece go around a zippo lighter and when dry it stays that size and shape. I use thicker leather to shape sheaths, scabbards, larger containers.

A flat piece of veg tanned leather, until coated to seal it, will absorb atmospheric moisture and the skin will take the shape of whatever its laying over. I have to keep my leather laid out perfectly flat for this reason.

Leather used as a painting guide is feasible, but not improperly tanned leather. After a bit of use the leather would have taken up the curves and bumps. 2mm thick leather would be the minimum thickness useable, and that is heavier than 2mm rubber.

On another note; in the 1960s when I did some part-time work with a back-street coach-builder in Belfast who did a lot of on-street spraying repairs, the ole lad showed me the trick of slapping vaseline on to the areas of the car or lorry which weren't to get sprayed. We never even washed the vaseline off. The customer was told to wash it off, in the evening, using hot soapy water, or even to just let the rain wash it off. This idea of using vaseline was apparently learnt by the ole boy when he was an aircraft finisher at the nearby Shorts Aircraft plant.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The circular is undated

A draft copy was sent to the Under-Secretary-of-State 10-4-40, and the D.T.D. replied 15-4-40, saying that the Air Staff had approved the circular, and it would be sent out in a few days, so it seems fairly safe to assume early May for its despatch and receipt. Serby also suggested that "dope firms" should get a copy, and the D.T.D. didn't demur.
1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I hope that I'm in the right topic here.

After searching for 1/48 templates for Mosquito camouflage masks I've found one commercial source for the actual masks but wish to cut my own from templates similar to those available from the below site :

http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/234978050-vol-2-all-the-spitfire-questions-here/#entry1920413

They work a treat. :winkgrin:

I'm now hoping that someone out there might be able to direct me to a similar source for the Mosquito templates.

TIA

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I hope that I'm in the right topic here.

Well no - this is a discussion about the real 1/1 masks used in WW2.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I hope that I'm in the right topic here.

Better to start your own topic, this is the wrong place

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Apologies if this is in the wrong thread but I saw this story on the BBC News of rare footage of 502 (Ulster) Squadron based at RAF Aldergrove in the early part of WWII that has been discovered. The film shows amongst other things colour footage of Avro Ansons and a crashed Whitley.

The reason for posting it here is that if you jump to 2.23 you will see a member of the groundcrew painting a vehicle and the vehicle in question is marked out with white lines and a letter B where it would appear that the camouflage pattern is to be applied.

Not sure if this method of painting would have been applied to aircraft as well as vehicles, but I thought it might be of interest to the members who are following this thread none the less.

Enjoy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now