Hurricane wingtip lights

[Eagle_Squadron]

Guys, question for you all.  I’m building a Hurricane Mk. I kit right now, and I need to know what color the wingtip lights were.  From various pictures I’ve found online, I’m getting conflicting info.  I recently completed a Tamiya Spitfire Mk. I kit and its kit instructions said blue on the port side light, red on the starboard.  This kit’s instructions don’t give specific instructions (Airfix 1/48 scale kit); instead they have some color illustrations (for showing decal placement) which give conflicting depictions!  Some show green on starboard side, red on port, others vice versa!  (Don’t get me started on Airfix “quality control”).  So which is it?  Anyone seen the real deal up close and can tell me?  Thanks in advance.

[Smithy]

Red on port, green on starboard. The green does have a slightly bluish tinge to it.

 

It's the same as nautical navigation lighting.

[stever219]

ALL navigation lights are red to port and green to starboard (simple mnemonic red, left port, short [word]: right, green, starboard, longer [word].  Some aircraft have clear lenses over coloured bulbs (Hurricane) whilst others have coloured covers over clear bulbs English Electric Lightning).  When unlit the lights appear very dark and the green starboard light can appear to have quite a strong blue cast to it.  Tail lights are always white, so clear bulb and, where fitted, cover.

 

Many modellers depict the coloured bulbs by drilling into clear wingtip parts and then filling the hole with (hopefully) the right coloured paint which often give the appearance of coloured rods inside the cover: just drilling a shallow indentation which is then filled with appropriately coloured paint should better represent the bulbs.  Many aircraft actually have the bulbs semi-recessed into the sides of the lamp recess (Canberra) as the lights have to be visible through defined arcs, from dead ahead to 140^o aft of the heading line for the wingtip lights and 70^o either side of the tail (this from 40+ year-old memory from Air Cadet training, so could need updating).

[Rob G]

PORT is RED, and it's what's LEFT in the bottle that counts.

 

As for the blue/green thing, I think that that has to do with a language weirdness that I have recently read about - (very simply put and not in great detail) Japanese has no name for the colour green, but it does have a name for shades of blue, from green through to violet, and that name translates as 'blue'. Which then gets printed in Japanese model kit instructions, to the confusion of many.

 

I discovered this colour name thing as part of some colour theory research that I'm doing to help my photography; apparently not every culture recognises the same colours that the Anglo/Euro/white people cultures do. It was very interesting.

[dreadeddrew]

I thought they just used a yellow bulb shining through the blue lens to create a green light?.......don't know for sure,so don't take my word for it.

Andrew

[Graham Boak]

My favourite mnemonic for this is "any red port wine left".

 

My daughter, a merchant Navy cadet, gets quite scathing about the US having channel lights that are the opposite of the rest of the world.

[noelh]

Some modern nav lights have a blue lens cover so yes they will appear blue when unlit. Can't speak for WW2 vintage aircraft though. 

Reminds me of the blue/green Mustang controversy. 

[Greenshirt]

Red, right, returning. I learned that as a young Midshipman. 

 

If the ship or plane is coming at you, you will see a red light on the right. 

 

Tim

 

 

[Seawinder]

2 hours ago, Greenshirt said:

Red, right, returning. I learned that as a young Midshipman. 

 

If the ship or plane is coming at you, you will see a red light on the right. 

 

Tim

 

 

Well, yes, but as a sailor, to me that aphorism means returning to harbor, keep red buoys on the right.

[Graham Boak]

As a US sailor - or indeed Canada and a few East Asia countries - that's fine.  Anywhere else you are in trouble.

[Eagle_Squadron]

Thanks, guys!  I learned something new today!   Had no idea that it was always red on the port side, green(blue) on the other.  And when I grew up, I lived for 23 years right next to an airport and never noticed that.  Strange...

[Tail-Dragon]

I had a simple mnemonic for this  Red left port, and I visualized a Russian freighter leaving Murmansk (I know, it's stupid) but the visualization worked, and I never forgot which was which.

[stevehnz]

I was taught at a very young age, left & port have 4 letters & were on the same side, didn't need to know how many letters starboard had, it was simply the other side.

Steve.

[Greenshirt]

On 2/19/2018 at 11:08 AM, Seawinder said:

Well, yes, but as a sailor, to me that aphorism means returning to harbor, keep red buoys on the right.

I’m a sailor as well, and yes, that was for returning to harbor. But it worked well for me in my exams when trying to choose the relative bearing of the other ship or plane...and in practical terms at night on the water. 

 

Bonus use with models. 

 

Tim

[gingerbob]

On 2/19/2018 at 6:29 AM, Rob G said:

...apparently not every culture recognises the same colours that the Anglo/Euro/white people cultures do.

 

Well, it isn't a black and white issue, is it?

 

21 hours ago, Tail-Dragon said:

I had a simple mnemonic for this  Red left port, and I visualized a Russian freighter leaving Murmansk (I know, it's stupid) but the visualization worked, and I never forgot which was which.

 

I think that having it be "stupid" actually helps stick it thoroughly in your mind.  Gives your mind some extra tidbit to associate with it, or spend that extra nano-second actually firing neurons, or what have you.

[Troy Smith]

On 19/02/2018 at 08:47, Eagle_Squadron said:

 Anyone seen the real deal up close and can tell me?

clear cover, coloured bulb

Hurricane in Finland,  time capsule,  basically untouched since 1943

from

http://www.pienoismallit.net/galleria/referenssi_1295/kuva_11073/

more pics here

http://www.pienoismallit.net/galleria/referenssi_1536/

lots of useful  detail shots.

 

there is a restored IIB here  (it says IIA, it's not)

http://www.primeportal.net/hangar/mark_hayward/hurricane_iia/index.php?Page=2

with a big close up  of the tip light.

 

As you can see the bulb is pretty small,   a bottle green (ie dark greeny blue) would be my pick.

 

[BS_w]

On 19/02/2018 at 10:29 AM, stever219 said:

 Tail lights are always white, so clear bulb and, where fitted, cover.

 

Except during WW II, the tail light lens on some US & british airplanes, normally frosted white could be remplaced by red, green or clear lens(RESIN lens which had a narrow beam) for rear recognition(the light was emitted in limited angle)

[OneEighthBit]

3 hours ago, BS_w said:

Except during WW II, the tail light lens on some US & british airplanes, normally frosted white could be remplaced by red, green or clear lens(RESIN lens which had a narrow beam) for rear recognition(the light was emitted in limited angle)

That actually has confused me a bit because I was always led to believe the tail light was red but the G.A.L Hotspur manual actually states that the tail light on the glider should be red.

[Brandy]

As a professional pilot I always remember the colours as : red, right, wrong! Red is on the left, green on the right, white on the tail.

Troy, that's the left wingtip, the bulb is red.

 

 

Ian

Edited February 27, 2018 by limeypilot

[bentwaters81tfw]

On 2/19/2018 at 11:53, dreadeddrew said:

I thought they just used a yellow bulb shining through the blue lens to create a green light?.......don't know for sure,so don't take my word for it.

Andrew

Most 'green' lights are a blue cover as you say. All USAAF aircraft had blue covers, even the EAP has. As always, check your references, or our Walkaround section.

[Troy Smith]

55 minutes ago, limeypilot said:

Troy, that's the left wingtip, the bulb is red.

Thanks Ian

It was more to show the detail of the bulb fitting, and that if you replicate this you will be barely be able to see what colour the bulb is unless you illuminate it, in the pic above it look black...

actually...digging through the Finnish pics again here

http://www.pienoismallit.net/galleria/referenssi_1536/

we have 

 

 

[Brandy]

Very true. Without being lit the bulbs have virtually no visible colour to them.

 

Ian

[Roger Holden]

When the covers are clear, the bulbs are usually red and green. But when the covers are coloured, they are usually red and blue and a yellow bulb is usually used with the blue cover, which produces a strong green light following

nautical practice.  The only planes I recall seeing with green covers are on Japanese aircraft like the Zero. 

[HAAFPhot]

There's no port left in the bottle...port's red....although if there is any left in the bottle its a poor effort 🤣🤪

 

A year or two back flying with an AAC legend in a Beaver AL1, the legend stated that all of the port/starboard thing was not being used in aviation anymore.  Seemed to makes sense....