BlackMax12 Posted January 20, 2018 Share Posted January 20, 2018 Here is Meng's new Panther A late version. Beautiful kit but some strange engineering. There's 5 parts to the lower hull plus the back plate. Then the glacis is an add-on armor plate and the side armor plates on the hull are add-on, the sponsons are separate pieces with the front fenders molded on and the turret is a frame with separate armor sides and top. It comes with a metal barrel, photo etch side skirts, wire tow rope instead of Meng's normal string, everything except the zimmerit which a Panther A needs. Guess I'll order the Meng zimmerit decals and try them as I can't seem to make my own zimmerit. One bad thing is the individual link non-working tracks which have 6 sprue gates per link to clean up. Probably will invest in a set of Fruil ATL08 tracks to get out of doing all that. I'm impressed though, this is a nice kit, barely needs any glue as it just snaps together. Oh, no interior so that's a plus too. Meng's weird red plastic same as their Tiger II but makes it easier to add chips that look like they go to the red primer coat. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spitfire1677 Posted January 20, 2018 Share Posted January 20, 2018 (edited) I have just got one of these, so will follow with great interest. Nice to hear the fit is good, I was toying with getting a set of Fruils for mine too. Edited January 20, 2018 by spitfire1677 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackMax12 Posted January 20, 2018 Author Share Posted January 20, 2018 Thanks Spitfire Yes the Meng track links are a bit much to clean up and then there's 2 teeth to glue on each link also. Good luck, should be an interesting kit. Lloyd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redcoat2966 Posted January 20, 2018 Share Posted January 20, 2018 It got a good review on Hobby HQ on YouTube as Spitfire posted. I thought it looked a possible one to look at in the future. I like Andy’s YT reviews. He gives a big thumbs up for fit and quality, although Zimmerite was issue ridden. ill be interested in your progress and see if you come across any other things to watch out for if I decide on getting one. And I think Friuls are the way to go. Good luck Simon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kris B Posted January 20, 2018 Share Posted January 20, 2018 Another great model gone be done here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackMax12 Posted January 20, 2018 Author Share Posted January 20, 2018 Thanks Chris. Slow going as I started more on the Merkava 3D today. I still have to order the Meng zimmerit decals and Fruil tracks so this one will not be a big rush. I really want to see that Rye Field Models Panther G when it comes out as it won't need zimmerit but it does have an interior, oh joy........ Take care, Lloyd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackMax12 Posted January 20, 2018 Author Share Posted January 20, 2018 Thanks Redcoat Yes I saw Andy's build and I'm a little nervous about the zimmerit decals too. If they don't work then ATAK has a set of resin zimmerit for the Dragon late Panther A and I'll try to make them fit. I've never had any luck trying to make my own zimmerit and a Panther isn't the unit to start trying again. Too complicated patterns and too hard to work around all of the storage on the sides of the hull. Wonder if there ever was a Panther A sans zimmerit? Take care, Lloyd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kris B Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 That little bit strange for me. As up to know there was (in my opinion) enough Panthers and King Tigers on the market in good quality for some reason companies like Meng, Takom or RFM decided to add more. Not that it not make me happy, but there is still some other tanks which for some reason nobody wants to touch. I am waiting for Crusader (other then old Italeri) and will be delighted if someone will make a proper 7tp (Mirage model is far from current standards). Sorry for messing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Israel Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 On 1/20/2018 at 22:54, BlackMax12 said: Wonder if there ever was a Panther A sans zimmerit? AFAIK, there weren't many without. In other words, yes, there were, but IMHO would be a mistake to represent it without as all photos of late Panther Ausf. As seem to have zimmerit applied on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soeren Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 This is a fantastic model for sure. Although crazy looking in this red styrene. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlaStix Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 Hi Lloyd. I'm not too sure about this kit. I don't understand Meng's decision to use the colour plastic they have (as with most of these current ones - I assume it's to represent the original primer), it looks a little over-engineered to me and I cannot understand why they didn't have the Zimmerit moulded in place - I know some modellers feel it limits their choices but I'm sure many more would go for the more straightforward option of having it already there - I would. I've got some of Dragons German armour with the Zimmerit moulded on and, to me, it looks great. Having said all that it looks like it builds into a nice version of the Panther and I'll be interested to see what you do with this kit. Kind regards, Stix Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Israel Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 (edited) 14 minutes ago, PlaStix said: it looks a little over-engineered to me and I cannot understand why they didn't have the Zimmerit moulded in place This kit most likely will be followed by a full-interior version with extensive clear parts included - that could be an explanation for the apparent over-engineering. As for the rather odd approach applying zimmerit, my guess would be that this kit will be the base for other, non-zimmerit Panther variants. Edited January 23, 2018 by Israel 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackMax12 Posted January 24, 2018 Author Share Posted January 24, 2018 (edited) Redcoat You asked for some comments. Well, as I've discovered the wheels are a proper bi``h to assemble to the swing arms. Andy said in his build to file the ends of the axles a bit, yeah right!! I filed and filed and even ran a drill bit through the poly caps inside the wheels and still they will barely fit, almost broke half of the swing arms off and rather bent some of them in the process. Lousy poor engineering Meng, not typical of a Meng kit at all and I've done several. I think the problem actually is the poly caps are too small and when they are confined inside the outer wheel hub it's almost impossible to get the axle into the wheel all of the way. If I'd have been smart I would have tried one or two before gluing the wheel halves all together. I'm sure the dumb poly caps could be left out and the inner wheels just glued to the shoulders on the axles. Of course hindsight is always 20/20 as they say, too true. Who cares if the wheels don't turn? One thing I do like is the turret just clips into the upper hull with 3 flexible clips. Hard to explain but it doesn't have the tabs on the turret ring and the two cutouts in the hull top which are sometimes hard to line up and sometimes the turret won't turn no matter how you file, sand and swear. This turret turns like a charm and there's no cutouts on the hull so it looks better. Of course who's going to model it with the turret off showing the hull with no cutouts? Sprue Brothers, where I get my stuff from the USA is out of stock on both Fruil ATL08 and Modelkasten SK-10 working tracks for the Panther so I'll have to wait and order the Meng zimmerit decals at the same time. Freight to Canada is a killer so have to combine orders. I did try assembling about 10 of the Meng track links and they aren't bad once you get the 6 sprue attachment burrs per link cleaned up. Not working tracks but they are indy links and I might just use them. The Fruil tracks are about Cdn$75 a set plus freight and that's more than I paid for this kit. That's enough whining for tonight, not a bad kit just has some warts and worries. Lucky kit too as it almost graduated to the big blue bin outside with all of those wheel problems. Oh yes.made a boo boo and got some Tamiya Extra Thin liquid cement in the green bottle as usual. Problem is I got the "quick setting" formula by mistake and it doesn't work worth a damn on the red Meng plastic. Went back to the LHS today and that's all they have for Tamiya Extra Thin. (Four letter words deleted) This quick set stuff has a green top on the bottle but a white label where the normal stuff is green top and label, got to pay attention......... Take care, Lloyd Edited January 24, 2018 by BlackMax12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackMax12 Posted January 24, 2018 Author Share Posted January 24, 2018 (edited) Israel I think there's two reasons this kit doesn't have moulded on zimmerit. 1) It costs money to make the engraving in the moulds for the zimmerit. 2) They can make money selling four different patterns of zimmerit decals, even if they are crap. Funny, Dragon seems to manage it and their kits aren't any more expensive than some of the Mengs here in Canada. Of course they don't have the add-on revenue stream that Meng creates either. Come to think of it, Tamiya does the same with some of their kits for zimmerit and even sell the photo etch engine screens separate for some kits as they aren't included with the kit and that's cheap. Things that make you say "Hmmmmmmmm" . Lloyd Edited January 24, 2018 by BlackMax12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Israel Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 2 hours ago, BlackMax12 said: I think there's two reasons this kit doesn't have moulded on zimmerit. 1) It costs money to make the engraving in the moulds for the zimmerit. 2) They can make money selling four different patterns of zimmerit decals, even if they are crap. Definitely valid points. I would be happier if Meng throwed in one of their zimmerit sets instead of the metal barrel. However, just look at those beautiful rolled armor plates: a lot of effort went into something that supposed to disappear under a coat of zimmerit (pretty much the trademark of any late Ausf. A). It only makes sense if there are other, non-zimmerit versions will follow. I'm pretty sure we'll see a few, non-zimmerit Ausf. Gs in no time. Two of the jerry cans supplied with the kit by the way, carry British War Department stamps: a hint about the captured British Ausf. G called 'Cuckoo'...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soeren Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 In Europe the Dragon kits with molded on Zimmerit cost 50% more than most of the other offerings. But, you have to include additional costs for the mandatory parts as well. Which would be the Zimmerit sheet for example on most Tigers or Panthers. But then, there will be a basic kit for those people that dont care about accuracy. An they will get a nice kit, with a lot of detail at a reasonable prize. The quick setting extra thin was a something I bought when the regular extra thin was out. I would say it works with Dragon , Revell, Takom, Academy and AFV-Club. But it evaporates very quickly, acetone smell. It is sufficient to bind parts with some connection area and flows even better than the regular extra thin. But I dont use it that often. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soeren Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 I have one more question, wasnt it the way that meng offers 4 different zimmerit patterns for this kit? This might be a way of explaining not to do it molded on. The PE in this kit is sideskirts, grills and and metal barrel? The tracks might be difficult thing as you describe them. But I did Meng Leobard tracks, 5 pieces per link and 4x2 and 1x3 connection points... So it is an improvement afterall Considered a price of 38€ + zimm vs 75€ for dragon kits. Hmmmmm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Israel Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 I've got mine for 25 Euros. That's pretty good for such a large, newly tooled kit. I went for this one because I don't need the full interior Takom and RFM offers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackMax12 Posted January 24, 2018 Author Share Posted January 24, 2018 (edited) Here's the beast as of this afternoon with one track run in place. They don't look too bad but 6 plus hours for one side of the tracks is a bit much. Oh well, only have one other side to do now, LOL. The other thing is I may not complete the top of the second track run or at least not join them at the top as how do I get the first run off for painting? The wheels certainly won't come off ever again so that leaves the sprocket and idler and maybe, just maybe, enough wiggle room to get the track off and back on. Here it is. Edited January 24, 2018 by BlackMax12 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackMax12 Posted January 25, 2018 Author Share Posted January 25, 2018 I waited until this first track run was completely dry and the sprocket comes off, the track moves back a bit and I can get it off. Now getting it back on again after painting might be another neat trick but it comes off. I'll probably finish all 87 links on the other side now as I think there will be a couple of the side skirt plates missing so the track has to be complete on the top of the run too. Whew, nice to know I didn't goof, just lucky again. Lloyd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soeren Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 Have you tried to leave the completed track open at rhe center of the sprocket? This looks like a convincing approach to me ans I tried it a few times now. The teeth of the sprocket help to pull the links together for final mounting. But the tracks are flexible enough to be removable even with only this one opening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Israel Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 Great progress, LLoyd. How's the fit so far (apart from the road wheels)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackMax12 Posted January 25, 2018 Author Share Posted January 25, 2018 Israel Aside from the wheel/axle fitting problems everything else just snaps together, barely any glue required. Good thing as that Tamiya Extra Thin quick setting is all I have at the moment and it's not too great. Take care, Lloyd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soeren Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 The details look almost great, they also gave a PE aiming thingy for the Commander in that scale, cool stuff. The cast texture looks good as well. The wheels seem a bit simple though, or is it just the perspective? Which Zim pattern are you going for btw? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackMax12 Posted January 25, 2018 Author Share Posted January 25, 2018 (edited) Hi Soeren Yes the wheels are nothing special but they have bolt detail on both sides, even the inner wheels which are hidden have the detail. I think Meng's zimmerit pattern #1 is about the most realistic, nothing exotic like the angled lines across it. I have to wait a bit for that yet though. Too bad that nice rolled plate texture gets hidden under zimmerit decals though. I also didn't drill out all of the holes for the spare track links on the turret as this one will have plain turret sides for a change, there's enough spare links on the hull sides. Assembled all of the 174 teeth on the second track run but didn't start gluing the links together yet. After that marathon track building yesterday and last night I'm giving it a rest. Two teeth to glue on each link and 87 links per side gets a bit tedious. Of course nothing like the 6 piece per link on the Rye Field Abrams tracks which adds up to something like 960 pieces for the 2 sides but still not a lot of fun. I'm starting to like link and length tracks more and more. What the heck, the suspension isn't workable so who needs individual track links? I'll try your idea of leaving the track open at the sprocket but I did manage to get the completed run off so it might be ok to join the ends but then if I can't get it off what then? Take care, Lloyd Edited January 25, 2018 by BlackMax12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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