MeneMene Posted January 12, 2018 Share Posted January 12, 2018 What's the best way to recreate interwar rigging, like the type you see on the Swordfish, where the rigging isn't cables so much as it is metal bars under tension? Tamiya provides a photoetch set for this for it's swordfish, but that's not available for every kit. I'm working on an Avia B.534, and it too has this thick "bar" rigging as opposed to just cables. See this image for reference [/img] Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krow113 Posted January 12, 2018 Share Posted January 12, 2018 WNW suggests Prym for their kits with RAF flat rigging . What you are looking for is the same thing. The p/e flat rigging available is troublesome , unworkable and I have not seen anyone have it work out. I tried for 3 weeks to rig 2 bays and this is what I saw every morning after letting it set over night: Myself and others in my IPMS crew spent hundreds of dollars on this unproven stuff, I failed to make it work despite weeks of effort and frustration , most of it in front of the boys at meetings. Blobs of crusted cyano from repeated regluings and the realization that IT DOES NOT WORK , resulted in the model being stripped of the junk and rigged in 2 days with Prym. I have used the p/e for short runs on the tail and such , and I have seen it used on monoplanes like the Peashooter , but it has to have a very strong bay to work out. I think the differences in the contraction and expansion of the different materials means it will never work. Use the Prym , be happy. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MeneMene Posted January 12, 2018 Author Share Posted January 12, 2018 (edited) 11 minutes ago, krow113 said: WNW suggests Prym for their kits with RAF flat rigging . What you are looking for is the same thing. The p/e flat rigging available is troublesome , unworkable and I have not seen anyone have it work out. Would the prym wire be appropriate for 1/48 scale? Most of the references for it that I've seen are 1/32 builds I got the tamiya photoetch stuff to work on the Swordfish, but I agree that approach is generally ineffective. Edited January 12, 2018 by MeneMene Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krow113 Posted January 12, 2018 Share Posted January 12, 2018 (edited) 9 minutes ago, MeneMene said: Would the prym wire be appropriate for 1/48 scale? Most of the references for it that I've seen are 1/32 builds I got the tamiya photoetch stuff to work on the Swordfish, but I agree that approach is generally ineffective. Not sure if its good for 1/48 , I think it would be too large and look ungainly. It looks ok in 1/32: Pretty sure most of the 1/48ers just use elastic line of some sort , not worrying too much if it has the flat rigging profile. This is also not the first thread of this type. Searching the forum will result in a lot more input. Good luck! Edited January 12, 2018 by krow113 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MeneMene Posted January 12, 2018 Author Share Posted January 12, 2018 Just now, krow113 said: Pretty sure most of the 1/48ers just use elastic line of some sort , not worrying too much if it has the flat rigging profile. Ok thanks. On that note, I think the Avia rigging isn't quite the same as RAF flat rigging, it looks more like a rod. I still think regular elastic line would be too fine for it, but I can try Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krow113 Posted January 12, 2018 Share Posted January 12, 2018 The neat thing about the prym is that it goes flat when stretched. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
72modeler Posted January 13, 2018 Share Posted January 13, 2018 5 hours ago, MeneMene said: What's the best way to recreate interwar rigging, like the type you see on the Swordfish, where the rigging isn't cables so much as it is metal bars under tension? Tamiya provides a photoetch set for this for it's swordfish, but that's not available for every kit. I'm working on an Avia B.534, and it too has this thick "bar" rigging as opposed to just cables. See this image for reference [/img] Thanks You might try a dental supply store, dental lab, or a local dentist to obtain stainless wire- it is used by orthodontists, and comes in varying diameters, from very fine flexible wire used to secure devices to bands on teeth, to larger rigid diameters used to make various appliances. I used it on my 1/72 Siskin for the wing rigging wires and it worked very well and was in scale. There used to be a firm called Small Parts that carried wire, tubing, and other materials suitable for model builders, but I don't know if they are still in business. I'm sure others will be able to help you more than I. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Learstang Posted January 13, 2018 Share Posted January 13, 2018 But that is a preserved aircraft; how accurate is it? A very nicely preserved one, I might add, but it might even be a replica? The stainless steel wire sounds like a good idea - is it rigid enough to just pop into pre-drilled holes? That's the idea I have for rigging, as every other method I've tried or heard about just doesn't work well or easily for me. Regards, Jason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artie Posted January 13, 2018 Share Posted January 13, 2018 My favourite method for rigging 1/48 interwar biplanes, comes from the rock'n roll scene.... I use Fender steel electric guitar string, 0.08.... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWM Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 What about using EZ cable (which is flat in transection) and paint it to meke it a bit more solid? J-W Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leyreynolds Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 I've just done two Boeing P-12/F4B's in 1/72 using Albion Alloys 0.2mm and 0.1mm rod and it worked a treat. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melvyn hiscock Posted February 28, 2018 Share Posted February 28, 2018 On 1/13/2018 at 1:00 PM, Artie said: My favourite method for rigging 1/48 interwar biplanes, comes from the rock'n roll scene.... I use Fender steel electric guitar string, 0.08.... The Pre-CBS 008 top E strings were better (Sorry, thread drift guitarry joke) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G.E.SAUNDERS Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 hi ALL, I recently bought (2) sets of STARFIGHTER E Z RIGGING #PE-01 for a pair of P12E/F4B-4 Models that I am buildin' but I discovered when working on the MONOGRAM F4B-4 and attemptin' to Super Glue on the Upper Wing it was right where there were large Injection Pin marks of where I had filled with a big blob of Mr. Surfacer..... hhhhhhrrrrr! The MATCHBOX P12E ? NO PROBS Also that the Brace leans forward to the Location Point on the Fuselage not directly to the Fuselage as the Photo Etch Part is cut to be hhhhhhrrrr2 ! ....seems a bit wide and is not an Aerofoil Section Oh well ....... I have lots of "Seat Belt " Etch in stock now ! ....... goin' back Armature Wire as I had previosly planned. cheery "modellin' " mumbas ! Geoff F.T.G. 3156 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWM Posted July 22, 2018 Share Posted July 22, 2018 Let say that EZ fine cable has 0,4 mm X 0.1 mm section. In 1/72/ In reality it makes ~3 cm per 0.7 cm . Is it size of this cable or a wire? Regards J-W Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
72modeler Posted July 22, 2018 Share Posted July 22, 2018 If you take a length of plastruct flat plastic strip, heat it, and stretch it, like you would sprue, it will have a flat cross section; the trick being practicing to get a uniform width. For 1/72 scale it is pretty easy to get sections long enough to span the upper and lower wings- in 1/48 it might be harder to do. I also had a colleague who taped brass wire on a mat under tension and filed a flat on it with a file, which IIRC he used for a Williams Brothers Travel Aire Mystery Ship monoplane- it looked great! Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clunkmeister Posted July 24, 2018 Share Posted July 24, 2018 I build 1/32,and I use 2 lb monofilament line. Yes it’s round, but even in 1/48 it’d look presentable and it certainly adds greatly to the model’s strength. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duncan B Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 I'm going to be attempting the Accurate Miniatures 1/48 F3F-2 kit which comes with P/E rigging. I have read a couple of build reviews of the kit and they make it sound easy and effective to use but I'm a bit apprehensive. I think I might use guitar strings instead as I have plenty here anyway, 0.09's though, not those extra super light ones. Duncan B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toryu Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 On 22/07/2018 at 15:03, JWM said: Let say that EZ fine cable has 0,4 mm X 0.1 mm section. In 1/72/ In reality it makes ~3 cm per 0.7 cm . Is it size of this cable or a wire? Regards J-W On the P-26 for instance the wire size was as follows: Flying wires (those carrying the weight of the fuselage when aloft) between wheel spads and front underwing = .5 in, rear underwing = .375 in. Landing wires (carrying the weight of the wings on the ground) over wing = .375 in. A fair size in 1/48 would be 0.25 mm and 0.2 mm, and in 1/72 around 0.15 mm. This may serve as an idea of the wires to be used. I think guitar strings are a great idea offering any thickness in this range. I use Prym and also Griffin jewellery wire. The latter are of steel with a thin coat of plastic that makes secure attachment with super glue easy, even when stretched. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Aero Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 The only time that one would notice the thin edge of a flat RAF wire type of rigging is to bend down at model level. When using photos for reference of a tail sitting biplane, the camera is at human eye level so you are seeing a broader aspect of the wires. For the most time the model is at a lower level, so a round wire looks just as good. In 1;48, find that the finest Florists soft Iron wire is easy to work with and glues well. and I've rigged a number of my Moths this way. I recently tried the Albion Stainless wire and I was very pleased with that also. I was given rolls of fine stainless steel piano wire by Ray Rimmell some years ago and because it was rolled it is impossible to work with. I've tried heating under tension to no avail. Slight over temp with a flame torch and it pops like a light bulb. The correct term for streamlined rigging wire according to my 1917 rigging handbook is RAF-Wire. It was developed by the Royal Aircraft Factory (Farnborough) hence the RAF, not the Royal Air Force which wasn't in existence at the time. It was then adopted world wide. Cable as used by such as the SPAD is multi strand wire. RAF-Wire is a Die drawn solid wire. John 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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