Phantom FG.1 XV571 43 Sqn 1986 special markings

[Jazzie]

I hope there is a decal provider out there that is paying attention to threads like this. It just the excuse i need to build an Airfix Phantom and finish it in camo!

Arabest,

Geoff.

[iainpeden]

Keep your eye on xtradecal; Hannants still have some Modeldecal sheets available - picked a few up at Telford for £1 each. Anyway who needs an excuse to build a Phantom!

[Jabba]

On Xtradecals new FG1 sheet for the RAF there are many 43 Sqn schemes included

[Jazzie]

5 hours ago, iainpeden said:

Keep your eye on xtradecal; Hannants still have some Modeldecal sheets available - picked a few up at Telford for £1 each. Anyway who needs an excuse to build a Phantom!

Should have been specific meaning one with the 60th anniversary zap! Certainly dont need an excuse having sat on the fence at Leuchars during the best years.

Arabest,

Geoff.

[iainpeden]

I suggest you give Tony at Hannants a ring with that suggestion as I have never seen the checkered rudder on XV579/R in decal form.

 

Never made it to Leuchars - but Wattisham and Coningsby were great.

[huvut76g7gbbui7]

5 hours ago, Jazzie said:

Certainly dont need an excuse having sat on the fence at Leuchars during the best years.

 

So true. 

The view from the railway station end was superb wasn't it.

I don't have any of my own pics at hand but found this one on the net

[iainpeden]

Possibly taken when they arrived from Coningsby en masse in April 1987; a bad month for us down south because the Alconbury RF-4Cs also disappeared off to Zweibrucken. That's XV470 as CX in the foreground and the 2nd one in on the back line is interesting as it is still coded D and appears to have the unit markings still bisected by the ILS antennae on the fin.

Can you give the link to the picture?

Thanks

[huvut76g7gbbui7]

Here's the link

https://farm6.static.flickr.com/5614/15607583059_74e5b58cd1_b.jpg

[eng]

2 hours ago, Scimitar said:

So true. 

The view from the railway station end was superb wasn't it.

I don't have any of my own pics at hand but found this one on the net

If Carlsberg did airfield vantage points! Miss the days of peeking over the fence at Leuchars ☹️

 

Eng

[Robert]

My thanks to Troffa for telling us about the zap, and here it is on Google books

 

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=bLvgAwAAQBAJ&pg=PA214&lpg=PA214&dq=43+squadron+60th+anniversary&source=bl&ots=_YdnaLf1-g&sig=lUWUrUkxKfFFPDQBVvEtIrVoylw&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwig7rjPvPvXAhVEDsAKHffOAawQ6AEISDAI#v=onepage&q=43 squadron 60th anniversary&f=false

 

Robert

[XV571]

The upper fuselage markings on XV571 was gone by the Battle of Britain day in September 1986. Here's s photo I took at the airshow:

 

https://village.photos/images/user/93caa0de-2bab-44dd-a80e-14abd1ec8d7f/45c6568c-d225-453e-93e1-4673e754cb41.jpg

 

You can just make out the freshly painted area on the spine where the checkerboard was.

 

This is also an opportune time to point out an error on the new Xtradecal sheet X72282 (and the upcoming X48186) featuring the evolution of XV571. The Gamecock for the  1974 markings is of the later type introduced in the 1980s with the Air Defence Grey scheme. The original version was coloured red, light blue, yellow and black. Modeldecal sheet 23 is still the only one that has the correct shape and colours. The old Xtradecal sheet X003-72( and X00148) is close but the yellow is missing and the legs don't have the spurs. The date on the instructions isn't a typo as XV571 had been repainted grey in 1981.

 

Modeldecal 23:

 

 

Xtradecal X003-73/X001-48:

 

 

This is the best shot I could find of the original Gamecock, cropped from a photo I found on Flickr  https://www.flickr.com/photos/emdjt42/3569846629/ (credit emdjt42) dated Sep 1977:

 

 

 

Incidentally the later version is also not accurate, it has been printed with a black body instead of dark blue. Here's XV571 at Greenham Common in 1983:

 

https://village.photos/images/user/93caa0de-2bab-44dd-a80e-14abd1ec8d7f/resized_af950c16-4303-4d4f-8e8b-daf169f7d6e3.jpg

 

 

Xtradecal X72268:

 

 

Modeldecal 97:

 

 

Apologies for the long post but I'm just disappointed that a modern sheet has missed the opportunity to provide up to date and improved Gamecock markings for my favourite jets and squadron.

 

Jonathan

 

Edited December 11, 2017 by Julien
pls dont post copyrighted picture

[delticfan]

21 hours ago, eng said:

If Carlsberg did airfield vantage points! Miss the days of peeking over the fence at Leuchars ☹️

 

Eng

My friend Andy drove us to the end of the runway at Conningsby to watch the OCU depart. From what I remember it was a dull day, yes April 87, they departed in batches of four I think, can’t recall if all at the same time or over a half hour or so. Well worth watching thanks Andy if you’re reading! On the way down we called in at Binbrook but nothing was happening, oh for a time machine.

[Julien]

Gents as interesting as this thread is please dont post copyrighted pictures into the thread, by all means a link but not the picture.

 

Thx

 

Julien

[Anthony in NZ]

Great thread this is!

I am building the WH FG.1/FGR.2  conversion in 1/32nd scale over on LSP.

 

I am seriously considering doing this scheme with the checks on the fin and the slightly darker overpainted spine where they were.  Trouble is, the Phantom looks great all dirtied up, but it seems I cant really do that for this particular bird?  Unless anyone has a pic of her looking a little weathered?  I need to start making decisions on a scheme as cockpit and panel lines etc are different

 

Any help much appreciated

 

I have gleaned a lot from BM (clearly you love your Tooms!) and thanks to all who have posted over the years.  If not this scheme then poss a 56sqn bird with some sort of Maple leaf(?) 'zap' on the red fin?

 

Here is my build if anyone is interested...and if I am allowed to post it, I will remove if necessary...sorry in advance if thats the case

https://forum.largescaleplanes.com/index.php?/topic/86105-fgr2-wild-hare-phantom-conversion/

 

Cheers Anthony

[iainpeden]

Anthony - check out Hannants website because I think both Xtradcal and RAM do the 56 sqd a/c with the maple leaf zap (5 sqd?)  - not 1/32 but it'll give you some reference material.

[Anthony in NZ]

Does anyone know the crew names on the canopy's when XV571 flew with the large  black/white fin checks and after she got the spine ones painted over?  

 

Thanks in advance

 

Anthony

Edited October 25, 2020 by Anthony in NZ

[Troffa]

I don't think Alpha (XV571) had any names applied to the canopies in that scheme- this photo on Airliners.net just has the 'cut here' dashed lines around the perspex. None of the decal sheets of the period, or more recent releases have any crew names either.  The Squadron Boss at the time was Wing Commander John Brady and he was a Pilot, so I would expect his name to be on the front seat but It doesn't seem to be present.  His Wing Commander Pennant is visible, just above the Cockerel on the nose.  Sqn Ldr Mike Pugh was the Bosses' Nav when XV582 (Foxtrot on 43 Sqn, and later 111's Black Mike) did the John O'Groats to Lands End speed record in 1987, but I don't know if he would have been Wing Commander Brady's Nav in Alpha. 

I'm intrigued now, as I think their may be names on the canopy in the picture below! Need a better shot. 

 

XV571 Alpha 70th Anniversary Scheme 1986

Edited October 26, 2020 by Troffa
Put my reading specs on :-)

[Anthony in NZ]

7 hours ago, Troffa said:

I don't think Alpha (XV571) had any names applied to the canopies in that scheme- this photo on Airliners.net just has the 'cut here' dashed lines around the perspex. None of the decal sheets of the period, or more recent releases have any crew names either.  The Squadron Boss at the time was Wing Commander John Brady and he was a Pilot, so I would expect his name to be on the front seat but It doesn't seem to be present.  His Wing Commander Pennant is visible, just above the Cockerel on the nose.  Sqn Ldr Mike Pugh was the Bosses' Nav when XV582 (Foxtrot on 43 Sqn, and later 111's Black Mike) did the John O'Groats to Lands End speed record in 1987, but I don't know if he would have been Wing Commander Brady's Nav in Alpha. 

I'm intrigued now, as I think their may be names on the canopy in the picture below! Need a better shot. 

 

XV571 Alpha 70th Anniversary Scheme 1986

Yes, that's the exact point in XV571's life that I am planning to finish up my 32nd conversion I am working on at the moment.

Thanks for the great info, and good spotting of the Wing Commander pennant...hadnt seen that!  Do you think the Cockerel was on both sides of the nose??

 

Cheers and thanks for your reply

Anthony

[Troffa]

The Cockerel was on both sides of the nose, having been displaced by the chequers on the fin. 

I'm going to ask about on the Sqn association sites to see if I can get a definitive answer regarding the Crew names. 

Are you doing the Wild Hare conversion on the Tamiya F-4J ?  I look forward to seeing it on BM.

All the best,

Cheers,

 

Mark

[Anthony in NZ]

8 hours ago, Troffa said:

The Cockerel was on both sides of the nose, having been displaced by the chequers on the fin. 

I'm going to ask about on the Sqn association sites to see if I can get a definitive answer regarding the Crew names. 

Are you doing the Wild Hare conversion on the Tamiya F-4J ?  I look forward to seeing it on BM.

All the best,

Cheers,

 

Mark

Hi Mark, yes I am mate.  Not using a lot of the conversion set though.  This is turning into quite a complex undertaking.  I have a build on LSP, maybe I should start one up here too?

https://forum.largescaleplanes.com/index.php?/topic/86105-raf-fg1-xv571-wild-hare-phantom-conversion/

 

Cheers Anthony

[Troffa]

Thanks for sharing that thread Anthony, I will have a cuppa and have a peruse through your exploits so far. One word of warning, don't put any names (Especially Wing Commander Brady's !) on the canopies just yet,  as I was a bit off the mark with the Sqn CO- It was actually Wing Commander Al Winkles in 1986, and I have a request running with the Sqn association that will hopefully bear some fruit! 

I wonder what the market would be for an injection moulded 1/32 Scale F-4K/ M ?

[Anthony in NZ]

9 hours ago, Troffa said:

Thanks for sharing that thread Anthony, I will have a cuppa and have a peruse through your exploits so far. One word of warning, don't put any names (Especially Wing Commander Brady's !) on the canopies just yet,  as I was a bit off the mark with the Sqn CO- It was actually Wing Commander Al Winkles in 1986, and I have a request running with the Sqn association that will hopefully bear some fruit! 

I wonder what the market would be for an injection moulded 1/32 Scale F-4K/ M ?

All good mate....I am not doing anything unless you give me the all clear...I hope you like the build so far!

[Troffa]

 

Alpha (XV571) as she appeared as she departed the paint shop- full story and Pic  courtesy of former 43 Sqn member Mr Jim Evans follows: 

 

" ‘Alpha’ on the day we got her back from the painters on the Friday. I ‘project managed’ the task, starting from a bit of design. The Boss, Al Winkles, liked the idea of her being painted as a fighting cock so I coloured over one of the Sqn Prints. Meanwhile, Alan Carlaw or Dougald Cameron of Sqn Prints, submitted the design that the AOC agreed to. However, Al Winkles just told me to go with Alan’s/Dougald’s design, forgetting to tell me that the AOC’s parting shot was “without the spine”. I don’t think Alpha ever flew with the spine paintwork, she was back in the paint shop straight after the anniversary weekend....In answer to your question, you will see that there are names on the canopy. Definitely Al Winkles on the front but for some reason I recall it might have been Flt Lt Ian Brain on the back. The other thing to note is the non-standard Wg Cdr’s pennant. Al and I had visited the paint shop the day before and I noted that there was no pennant. I assumed that the painters would have a standard pattern but was surprised by blank faces. I said “ you know, a little triangular blue flag with a light blue inner triangle and red stripes”. They nodded and that’s pretty much what we got! "

 

My sincere thanks to Jim for sharing this historic image and background.

 

So, WG CDR  A WINKLES on the Front and FLT LT I BRAIN on the back?,  until I get a close up!  🙂 

[Anthony in NZ]

7 hours ago, Troffa said:

 

Alpha (XV571) as she appeared as she departed the paint shop- full story and Pic  courtesy of former 43 Sqn member Mr Jim Evans follows: 

 

" ‘Alpha’ on the day we got her back from the painters on the Friday. I ‘project managed’ the task, starting from a bit of design. The Boss, Al Winkles, liked the idea of her being painted as a fighting cock so I coloured over one of the Sqn Prints. Meanwhile, Alan Carlaw or Dougald Cameron of Sqn Prints, submitted the design that the AOC agreed to. However, Al Winkles just told me to go with Alan’s/Dougald’s design, forgetting to tell me that the AOC’s parting shot was “without the spine”. I don’t think Alpha ever flew with the spine paintwork, she was back in the paint shop straight after the anniversary weekend....In answer to your question, you will see that there are names on the canopy. Definitely Al Winkles on the front but for some reason I recall it might have been Flt Lt Ian Brain on the back. The other thing to note is the non-standard Wg Cdr’s pennant. Al and I had visited the paint shop the day before and I noted that there was no pennant. I assumed that the painters would have a standard pattern but was surprised by blank faces. I said “ you know, a little triangular blue flag with a light blue inner triangle and red stripes”. They nodded and that’s pretty much what we got! "

 

My sincere thanks to Jim for sharing this historic image and background.

 

So, WG CDR  A WINKLES on the Front and FLT LT I BRAIN on the back?,  until I get a close up!  🙂 

That's brilliant!

Thanks Mark and Jim, I couldnt want for better information!  This really adds life and motivation to my build, that's for sure.  Please pass my thanks on to Jim and let him know what I am up to.  fantastic info...this really made my day!

 

Cheers

Anthony

[Troffa]

Glad to be of help Anthony, your thread over on LSP is Phabulous!  I will keep seeking a close up shot of the Canopies and will let you know if I hear anything more regarding this historic 70th Anniversary scheme. I will pass on your thanks to Jim, but hopefully he will pop by and see it for himself.

 

Regards,

 

Troffa