Steve_farrier Posted November 6, 2017 Share Posted November 6, 2017 I started on this a little while back before my motorbike orderly. Its not really a kit i I was that enthused to do I bought it in a bundle from another member, and being an empty shell (no interior) I just could get motivated to get it started. then I bought the voyager PE set from eBay... only to find out that it didn't come with the side skirts.. slightly annoying as these were really the only parts I wanted... I did get a partial refund! I shelved the kit for a couple of weeks and decided to go buy the E.T PE kit. Never heard of them but delivery takes until 4th December! So whilst waiting I've decided to crack on with what's in the voyager kit...and 😳😳😳 some of that is TINY!!! I soent over an hour just trying to get the 3 part functioning tool brackets to go together. The carpet monster ate them!! And I am glad to have fed it today!! I've stuck with the Tamiya parts..... has anyone PLEASE some tips on joining PE that is smaller than the lettering on a 1 pence piece! Anyway here's where I am The voyager kit that doesn't contain the side skirts!! Anyway enough winging from me... got to sleep... horses to shoe in the mornin! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingsman Posted November 7, 2017 Share Posted November 7, 2017 You have to watch Voyager. Their box art usually shows the subject kit with multiple products applied. The clue is in the number of numbers along the bottom. I have some sets from ET and, although I haven't actually used any yet, I like the look of them. However, some are a bit minimalist - but some also have resin parts, as do some Voyager sets. Another brand well worth a look is Part, from Poland. Hardly ever seen on eBay and rarely seen in the UK, but their range now stretches to over 270 1/35 etch sets and over 1,000 items across all scales. Although they have a lot of WW2 German sets they don't have anything for the Jagdtiger. They are distributed by Jadar Hobby in Warsaw, a store with whom I have long had dealings and for whom I have nothing but praise. If I'm looking for an etch set I try to find multiple pics of alternative brands on WWW, especially those showing frets and other parts included. As far as adhesion is concerned, I can't get on with soldering at the best of times and extreme skill is needed to solder tiny parts. Some time ago on another forum site I came across a suggestion that "acrylic glue" worked well for etched parts, providing a bit more grab and a bit more adjustment time than cyano. Hunting around for this unknown-to-me substance it turned out to be the sort of glue that is used for attaching false nails, sometimes also known as Alpha Cyano. Comes in nozzle bottle and brush bottle forms, is dirt cheap and widely available on eBay, in the beauty aisles of big supermarkets and presumably anywhere else that sells false nails. Since I discovered this product I haven't used anything else to build etch or join it to plastic. The nozzles can be a little large for fine work and I prefer the brush product. Although the brush is quite large and coarse - similar to those that come with some brush-cap liquid poly - it can be used with finesse with a little practice and can of course be cut down to fewer bristles. I also came across an old-school US product in my local Hobbycraft called G-S Hypo Cement. This seems to be a similar multi-material glue which comes in a tube with a very fine metal nozzle, almost hypodermic fine. Haven't actually used it yet, though. I've tried several different types of cyano applicator tools, including metal - one of which turned out to be nothing more than a blunt sewing needle cut off through the eye - plastic and glass. But none of them worked for me: none would flow unless the drops were far too large. For fine parts I find that holding them with fine point tweezers and touching them to the glue brush from my nail glue worked pretty well. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hewy Posted November 7, 2017 Share Posted November 7, 2017 I'm not skilled at tiny pe either steve, but those tamiya tool clasps look fine to me any way I use a piece of fine copper wire dipped in thin ca that i put in bottle tops, to wick the part to the plastic, i shall try the nail glue above though, i bet the daughter will have some of that i can half inch,. Looking good though i like the damage to the grills Glynn 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_farrier Posted November 7, 2017 Author Share Posted November 7, 2017 Thanks very much @Das Abteilung I will either raid the girlfriends stash of nail products or head to the shop... which undoubtably I'll have to do to replace her product anyway lol. The bits I struggle with was worse than trying to tree needles the holes seem to be as small as a human hair, even with magnifying lenses it didn't help. I think I'll invest in a couple more pairs of self holding tweezers and file the points down ... something I end up doing to all my tweezers anyways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dads203 Posted November 7, 2017 Share Posted November 7, 2017 Hi Steve, nice work so far on the build fella, I built the Dragon version a year or so ago which I had kicking about the workshop for a few years part built. I also found the lack of photos was a bit of an issue but settled on a dark yellow scheme, here is a link to my build which might be of use http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/235001254-sd-kfz-186-jagdtiger/&tab=comments#comment-2335060 As for PE, I ended using the Aber sets, they are a bit more expensive than some other brands but you get exactly what you need and what’s shown on the packaging. I also found them to be more accurate than other brands, I started out using the Eduard sets only to frustrated that they were not really better than the plastic parts being replaced. I solder and CA glue all my PE parts, you’ll be be surprised on how quickly you’ll pick up soldering and the size of the parts you can assemble after a bit of practice. As for Acrylic glues, I don’t bother, they just don’t grab the PE like CA and are difficult to clean up any access glue afterwards, with CA glue I use a fibreglass pencil to clean up any messy joints and a couple of swipes is all you need. I also use an optivisor, it’s a must for dealing with the small fiddly PE parts mate, it’s got to be my number 1 item in the tool box which gets used on every session. HTH Dan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_farrier Posted November 7, 2017 Author Share Posted November 7, 2017 I use an optivisor too I just think it's my dexterity that's the issue... and there is nothing more frustrating than PE when it "wont go" ... reminds me of a lee Evans sketch about womens hair... anyway!! Soldering i I have struggled with. I think I need to invest in some liquid flux because the solder just sticks to the %%#*#😡 Tip of the soldering iron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dads203 Posted November 7, 2017 Share Posted November 7, 2017 The secret that works for me is one of those miniature gas torches but get a good quality one with precise flame control, stops you from melting some of the smaller parts Steve, again I use a fibreglass pencil to clean up the brass parts, it doesn’t take long but some of the Eduard sets are now plated which is a real frustration as you need to clean off the plating. I use Carrs liquid solder, it’s got flux mixed in and you can apply it with a small paint brush, it’s expensive but a bottle will last you a lifetime. A little bit of practice will have you making some really fine and strong parts and you’ll never look back Dan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullbasket Posted November 7, 2017 Share Posted November 7, 2017 2 hours ago, Steve_farrier said: Soldering i I have struggled with. I think I need to invest in some liquid flux because the solder just sticks to the %%#*#😡 Tip of the soldering iron. Not sure if it's still available, but I bought a product many years ago (still got it) that acts not only as a flux, but also cleans the brass surfaces when applied. It came in a small pot and has the appearance and texture of Vaseline. You apply it with a small brush. Works a treat. I think that I got it from a central heating supplier. John. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soeren Posted November 7, 2017 Share Posted November 7, 2017 Aber sells liquid soldering aid. It is cheap and lasts forever. Just brush it where you want it and the solder runs where you want it. But remember, the two pieces need to have both the correct temperature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingsman Posted November 7, 2017 Share Posted November 7, 2017 You can have a clean-up problem with any adhesive or solvent: I don't find the acrylic/nail glue any worse to deal with than anything else. I try to use the minimum necessary of any adhesive, which sometimes works against me. I guess I'm chicken with soldering: I'm and old dog and it's a new trick for me. I do have a variable-temperature fine tip iron and a range of fluxes, fluids and different size and temperature solders including tubs of tiny pre-cut balls. Just can't bring myself to risk cocking it up. Practice on left-over etch parts perhaps. I agree that Eduard have perhaps lost some mojo, perhaps since they diversified into other products. I only have their sets where there is no alternative, usually older kits. Aber suffer with relatively high cost. Voyager can, in my admittedly limited experience, be over-complicated and inaccurate. Example: some elements of German hull side tool clamps are solid blocks, whereas Voyager fold them up from sheet with the inevitable edge joins and a resin part might be more appropriate. ET I have yet to play with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_farrier Posted November 16, 2017 Author Share Posted November 16, 2017 Not much to report recently as I've been waiting on the postman. I decided to order some liquid lux and have managed to get my hands on some old lead solder. And I'm AMAZED at the difference in my soldering abilities now. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dads203 Posted November 16, 2017 Share Posted November 16, 2017 See ... Easy peasy when you have the right tools 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_farrier Posted November 21, 2017 Author Share Posted November 21, 2017 Some more done over the weekend. I'm not proud. But in a 8 hour sitting I only managed to get the 2 rear "mudflaps" soldered together. But considering they are 18+ pieces each and had to almost reconstruct one twice due to overheating and causing all the solder to let go. Neither piece is what I would call pristine work but I think with some undercoat it won't look that messy.... nothing some mud can't hide 🙄🙄 That's it for a few days thanks steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soeren Posted November 21, 2017 Share Posted November 21, 2017 18 pieces at 1:35 scale? That is crazy. I would also not want to build that in 1:16. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dads203 Posted November 21, 2017 Share Posted November 21, 2017 Steve, for cleaning up post solder work, grab a fibreglass pencil , it works a real treat. Also really good for cleaning up the brass before you solder and it cleans gluey fingerprints off plastic as a bonus http://www.hobbycraft.co.uk/modelcraft-glass-fibre-pencil/568802-1000?glCountry=GB&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI_LO8ha3Q1wIVEeEbCh01kQ-7EAQYBCABEgKTbfD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds You’ll thank me 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_farrier Posted November 21, 2017 Author Share Posted November 21, 2017 Fibreglass pencil. Never heard of them but I'll have a YouTube n see what happens :-) thanks!!! Yeah crazy. Each little hinge is made of 3 pieces, 2 plates 1 pin. 2 hinges per side. That's 6 just there. Another 5 pieces of the large hinge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaubar Posted November 22, 2017 Share Posted November 22, 2017 I find fibreglass pencils also to work great for smoothing styrene in tiny corners and edges. They are one of those must have tools, which I only learned about recently also. I was not aware that you could use them to clean solder, thanks for sharing this. Keep on rocking the Jagdtiger, it is a nice one. /Stefan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badder Posted November 22, 2017 Share Posted November 22, 2017 On 07/11/2017 at 6:48 AM, Hewy said: i bet the daughter will have some of that i can half inch Reminds me of a time when I was held for shoplifting at B&Q. The police turned up and were going to arrest me, but they let me off when I told them I was just obeying the signs all over the shop. Steel ladders, Pinch pliers, Half inch nails. Thanks to everyone for the info on PE. I've only tried using it once, almost completely unsuccessfully, but I'm going to have another go with a Churchill for my current diorama. My fingers don't work properly due to a disease I have and even self-gripping tweezers are a bit of a drag, with parts pinging off across the room. So I started using blu-tac to hold and manipulate the tiny parts. It doesn't mean I can always bend and shape them correctly, but I guess it's a case of try, try and try again until it's either done or ruined! Also thanks for the info on the fibreglass pen. I've heard people mention them, but I thought they were one of those tools for jobs that could just as easily be done with a toothpick or the end of a needle file. Having read the praise about them I think I will have to invest in one. Finally, Steve, Good luck with the PE! As you say, paint will improve the look, hiding that solder etc. If you're anything like me you'll finish your tiger and be happy with it for about a year, and then you'll decide it could be better and you'll end up buying another! AND THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT! In fact, I plan to purchase second models of all those I've made so far. (That's not too many cos I only started model-making again 2 years ago), Rearguards, Badder 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hewy Posted November 22, 2017 Share Posted November 22, 2017 Steve, I had a go at soldering pe for the first time last night, doing the width indicators for the scammell, and I feel your pain, must have done them 10 times and I only had one part of brass to solder to another, we must persevere, Well done on the soldered parts count, there's a good chance I'd have flipped out and binned it, the finished parts will look great Glynn 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dads203 Posted November 22, 2017 Share Posted November 22, 2017 If you use the fibreglass pencil to clean up post soldering then you don’t need to hide any scrappy soldering it actually removes the overspill solder without damaging the brass it’s that good 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_farrier Posted November 22, 2017 Author Share Posted November 22, 2017 Thank you all for the input and praise. @Hewy for soldering individual parts like those I've found the best way is to use a Jet lighter (1300°C) . Cut some solder off to the amount you need (little pellet) liquid flux everything. Then dry fix the parts together and put the pellet on the flux. Click the lighter and it will all stick together. (Use on a non flamable surface... cuttting mats melt VERY quick!! Ha ha .... erm oops) @Badder I understand your issues, I'm 32 but my fingers sometimes shake uncontrollability ... I think it's because being a blacksmith the ringing of he hammers got to the nerves. Have you invested in a folding Jig for pe?? Me either... I bought a little multi position hobby vice and bluetacked a Hinge in to the jaws. Gives me a perfectly tight close and certainly helps my folding. Currently at my desk so ahould get some photos up later cheers guys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badder Posted November 22, 2017 Share Posted November 22, 2017 2 minutes ago, Steve_farrier said: I understand your issues, I'm 32 but my fingers sometimes shake uncontrollability ... I think it's because being a blacksmith the ringing of he hammers got to the nerves. Have you invested in a folding Jig for pe?? Sounds like it. I used to play the drums in a heavy rock band before my illness took it's toll. But even then, repetitive striking does cause damage. I would imagine belting metal on metal would be even worse! Have you ever thought of becoming a cocktail maker? All that shaking..... I do have two jigs for PE yes. But for those complicated parts where you are having to bend something in all three dimensions and back on itself, it all gets a bit confusing. It doesn't help if the instructions were written in Ukrainian and then translated poorly into English. And whoever drew the diagrams needs to be the first up against the wall when the revolution comes! Rearguards, Badder 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_farrier Posted November 22, 2017 Author Share Posted November 22, 2017 Oh what was the band called?? Lol no i couldn't make cocktails ... i struggle to pour a pint!! 😂 One thing ive found from using PE parts is you always have leftovers... bits that are for the kit yet nowhere in the instructions are they visible... it's like the manufactures go... "have fun... guess!!" Also they seem to be numbered incorrectly too 🙄 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badder Posted November 22, 2017 Share Posted November 22, 2017 (edited) We were called Broadside - funnily enough named after the beer, not a row of ship's cannons all firing at once. There are some tracks on the web somewhere. Oh, there's another band called Broadside, but we were the lesser known of the two! For 'lesser known' read 'unheard of'' Edited November 22, 2017 by Badder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_farrier Posted November 22, 2017 Author Share Posted November 22, 2017 I'll have a nosey around badder :-) well im annoyed at Voyager PE instructions for the JT gun barrel retaining clamp for fixing the gun during transport... they miss labelled it!! Resulting in a non functioning clip that's supposed to be functioning. I've had to take it apart. Snapping pieces and having to them rebuilt it using spare PE to construct various bits. Ill do photos another day. Right now I'm off to bed 😡😡 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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