Jump to content

Wessex HC2 Crab Cabs Pt II (Fly Wessex - why on earth did I?)


hendie

Recommended Posts

7 hours ago, Wafu said:

While your in the area of the upper pylon grip, look at the pylon fold lock mech, more Hendie scratch building coming up I feel.

 

That was always part of the plan. - Bill made me do it on my last build.

 

Looking at photo's (I don't have any decent plans of the tail), I reckon the top line of the mesh should be where the bottom line of the top hand hold is at present, and everything else swiveled (or raised,depending upon your view) to suit.  Of course, that then means that my internal framing is out.

I need to take a long hard think about this.  Any correction no matter how slight then means that other things are going to have to move also.

I may be better off scanning the 4+ drawings as there doesn't appear to be anything worthwhile on t'internet.  Bugger.

  • Like 1
  • Sad 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I trawled the web for ages but couldn't find any pictures or drawings better than the 4+ ones

 

To be honest, and to be fair to yourself this area is one I would consider leaving wrongish and I am not easily fobbed off by Kit maker's inadequacies

 

The upper grille on the lower end of the pylon should not be a parallelogram but a rhombious shape like a truncated triangle that runs to the top of the bottom grille on its topline

The Modeldecals diagram shows the lines quite well

Antrimwessex_fishery_protect.jpg

 

Pity it wasnt as clear on the starboard side decal fixing locations, but that is 'a tale of a different safari'

Link to comment
Share on other sites

29 minutes ago, perdu said:

I trawled the web for ages but couldn't find any pictures or drawings better than the 4+ ones

 

and to be honest, I'm not all that impressed with them either.  I went and grabbed the book with a view to scanning the drawings, but just looking at them was enough.

Take a gander at this shot.   That area in the 4+ book doesn't look right either so I don't know if we can point the finger directly at Fly for this. They really don't look to be too far off the mark compared to this drawing. 

 

P1150001.jpg

 

grumble mumble frumble hmmmphhh

What to do, what to do.  I think I may have a plan forming.  It won't take care of everything that's wrong with the tail but I think I can make it look better.

I think the two reinforcement strips either side of the top hand hold are too far apart, ergo, the top hand hold is just a bit too long.  I don't think thre's too much I can do about that.  If I close tehm up, I have to shift the entire mesh opening further up the tail

I think I may be able to make another mesh panel that's narrower than the kit part - if I can close up some of that opening.  That will allow me to move the bottom hand hold up the tail just a tad. Hopefully that will look a little bit better (but then my internal panels are in the wrong place.... damnit).  This is going to take some thought.

 

Does any body have any other versions of the Wessex from Fly.  I've seen from photo's that they have done some rework to the tail - can someone post a photo if they can please ? It would be nice to compare with the HC2

 

 

*edit*  never mind - I just found some photo's of the HU5 on t'interwebby and it looks just the same. - which then begs the question, where did I see the tail photo's where the hinge was actually molded ???

Okay I just found it again - why is the HC2 not like that ?  It's still not right but it's a darn sight better than the parts I got

 

ylf32011_13.jpg

 

edit again

arghhhhhhh now I need to go and check the runner trees.  I spotted a photo which looks like the runner may contain the parts - but no mention of them in the instructions (unless I'm going blind!)

 

 

 

 

Edited by hendie
  • Like 4
  • Sad 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Even on that one the front grille looks 'not quite the thing'

 

I'm a bit fed up with myself, when I went to Hendon II took lots of pictures of the tail area but it seems I missed the bottom hand hold location to take lots of the IFF thingy in the supplementary fin thingy

Doh, it only just takes in the upper stiffener strip but misses the hand holds but I can send 'em to you if  they'd help

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks Bill, but I still have all the photo's you sent me a while back.  I think I have enough to keep me digging further into trouble for a while yet.

 

 

- and I just checked the runner trees.  It looks like the "hinges" are included on runner tree C, parts 20. - but only 2     i.e. one side of the tail only. 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Can't help but agree. The lower handhold should be where the mesh starts, and the mesh is not rectangular. 

 

Sorry, but you know you have to do it.....

 

Ian

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Feeling your pain Hendie, the lower hand hold should be parallel with the lower hinge of the tail break. The whole lot on the trailing edge seems to be knocked out by the fact the grill is to wide. I feel a bit of Hendies special metal fret coming😉

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't suppose the other pair of errant hinges are there attached to a simulacrum of the lock assembly are they?

If I'd been moulding the tail end as a kit maker that is where MY other side hingery would be

Two separate parts for the port and one unit for the starboard to give all the gubbins in one place

 

Won't matter now, you just had a slightly unnecessary gauntlet bunged atcha

😨

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, perdu said:

I don't suppose the other pair of errant hinges are there attached to a simulacrum of the lock assembly are they?

 

lemme check No they aren't.     I'm not even sure the parts I'm looking at are the hinge parts in question - they just sorta look like them.. almost.

 

And the resin part they supply as the center bracketry/bellcrank lever thingy looks like it came off the back of a Massey Ferguson that towed tanks in it's spare time.  Guess I'll be making that too.

and possibly 3D printing the tail wheel casting - the kit part is the wrong shape, is missing a few features, and generally is all lop sided.

 

 

17 hours ago, perdu said:

Even on that one the front grille looks 'not quite the thing'

 

I know what you mean Bill.  It looks very close according to the drawings, but something about it just doesn't look right. - but that's a rabbit hole too far.

 

 

 

gauntlet caught and added to the gauntlet stash

  • Like 1
  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Follower of this build, I think you should be made aware of something thats out there. Now hen die is never going to blow his own trumpet but I am.

 

I've just taken delivery of Mr 'H' SACRU in 1/32 from Shapeways and its amazing, yep amazing. The level of detail on the little mucker is jaw dropping, it felt like I could actually lean over and open the arm with the mechanical lever. Heres a link to the shapeways page https://www.shapeways.com/product/GR3FN4FJY/westland-wessex-sacru-cargo-hook-1-48?optionId=64489486&li=marketplace

 

Well done Hendie, ill be ordering a few more in 1/48 for future Wessex and Sea King build.

 

I've seen the future and its in 3D...

 

 

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 minutes ago, Wafu said:

Follower of this build, I think you should be made aware of something thats out there. Now hen die is never going to blow his own trumpet but I am.

 

I've just taken delivery of Mr 'H' SACRU in 1/32 from Shapeways and its amazing, yep amazing. The level of detail on the little mucker is jaw dropping, it felt like I could actually lean over and open the arm with the mechanical lever. Heres a link to the shapeways page https://www.shapeways.com/product/GR3FN4FJY/westland-wessex-sacru-cargo-hook-1-48?optionId=64489486&li=marketplace

 

Well done Hendie, ill be ordering a few more in 1/48 for future Wessex and Sea King build.

 

I've seen the future and its in 3D...

 

 

 

Thanks Ian - I'm glad you're happy with it.   That was quick - I only got notified the other day that they had successfully printed it.

I should point out that the link you posted is actually to the 1:48 version.  Searching for SACRU on Shapeways will bring up both versions if anyone's interested.

I was really happy with the quality and level of detail of my 1:48 Version on the last Wessi build, but since Shapeways have enhanced their material selection I thought I could add a little bit more detail to the SACRU and it looks to have worked.

I'm not sure the detail would translate down to 1:72 but it may be worth a shot sometime.  

In the course of full disclosure, I am now pretty certain that I will be doing the tail wheel casting through Shapeways as well - the kit part just has too many details missing

 

I'd be interested in seeing any photo's you have of the SACRU, particularly when painted up. 

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Fresh from the plumbing disaster that was my weekend - 9 hours, 5 trips to the hardware store, numerous bits, bobs and tools purchased, only to end up in a worse position then when I started - and I'll still need to bring a plumber in as this is now out of my skill set  :worry:  :rage::wall::badmood:

 

So, what else could go wrong ?...

 

Actually a couple of hours worth of modeling calmed me down somewhat and stopped me from turning into Ballistic Bob a la Chewin' the Fat.    :angry:

 

First order of the day was to attack the upper hinge casting. Believe it or not I actually used a kit part in here - part 20 from Runner Tree C (I think) - I scanned through the instruction manual (which I've largely been ignoring since I started this build) and could find no reference to those parts either by number or by look-a-like parts in the assembly diagrams.  I did have to modify it slightly to get it to fit - that was then faced off with two small wedge shaped strips of styrene as per the big chunky bracket on the 1:1

 

P1210002.jpg

 

When viewed straight on, the hinges are perfectly parallel to each other - due to the fact that Fly haven't got the same gap between the hings on the port side as they do on the starboard side.  I could have made them parallel but then the brass tubes I've used for the hinge pins would not be in the center of the hinge brackets - you win some you lose some....

 

Next up was a lot easier than I thought it was going to be... a small piece of brass rod with the end squeezed in the vise to flatten it out.  That was then drilled with one of those carbide micro drills (a favorite piece of kit even although they break very easily).  1:1 Finger shown for comparison purposes.   No real care was put into the position of the hole - the excess flattened rod was removed after drilling.  The end was then radiused with a file...

 

P1210005.jpg

 

and hey presto... we have one part of the bell crank lever hinge mechanism thingy which you can just about see protruding from the slot about halfway up the tail innards here.

 

P1210008.jpg

 

Reeling from the euphoria of nothing disintegrating on me or leaking or blowing up I turned my attention to one of the more recently found 'oh-crap-on-a-biscuit' deficits of the kit. Yes, we're talking about the lower mesh panels on the tail.

After a bit of thought I determined the following course of action... make them narrower !

Simple!  Job Done!

Now all I had to do was figure out how to do that.  My first stab at this was merely to glue a 1mm strip of styrene in the aperture.  I realize that this does not fully address all the flaws in this area, but visually, this is the most apparent.  ( I may yet change my mind and attempt some further butchery... tbd and all that...)

 

P1210009.jpg

 

Once those infills have hardened up, I'll add a sear of filler and smooth it all back down

Of course, this requires that I scrap the kit PE and find a suitable alternative.  Like this...

 

P1210010.jpg

 

Success!   That piece of PE mesh looks perfect for the job.  Unfortunately, it's the last piece of that particular mesh that I have and I need it for the train build.  It's also been OOP for several years now

Best I scout around and see if I can locate another ebayer charging gouging prices for it.

 

 

 

Edited by hendie
  • Like 10
Link to comment
Share on other sites

It seems like I have hardly been anywhere near here this year... life is proving rather difficult but I did finally manage to sneak an hour or so in the basement today though with results that were slightly less than earth shattering.

 

First up is a question...  On the console mounted on the cockpit rear bulkhead - does anyone know if there should be a cut out similar to the one shown here midway up the left side?   I've been scouring photo's and t'interwebby but all the evidence I have found has so far proved to be inconclusive.  There does appear to be one on the right (port) side as far as I can tell, but I don't thinkit's as deep as the one on the starboard side.

 

P1270001.jpg

 

I had to do a bit of remedial work on this resin part as a few bits had broken in transit - such as all the switches at the top.  I also removed what I assume to be Fly's interpretation of the map light - which was larger than the fire extinguisher for the cabin!   I then spent a ridiculous amount of time scratching a replacement which is more in keeping with the scale.  The replacement lamp was made from two lengths of brass tube sleeved together, a piece of wire inserted into the inner tube, then finally, a mounting hole drilled though the casing.

 

P1270002.jpg

 

Now, jumping back to the tail again I spotted another oopsy from Fly - the lower hand holds are not at the same height.  Sloppy! 

 

P1270004.jpg

 

Again some remedial work on the tail - this time blocking off the hand holds so you can't see into the tail.  Thankfully, my inserts for the mesh area seem to have worked though I still have some more work to do there.  When I started working on this tail I thought it would be done in a few hours... it's turning into a real tale of woe (sorry!)

 

P1270005.jpg

 

In other news.... more resin.... more broken parts. This time the cockpit center console.  Fly really ought to do a better job of packaging these things.

Missing parts this time included a bunch of switches, and the middle two throttle levers.  The bag was emptied out and examined and while there are the remnants of a bunch of brokenparts in there, there was no throttle levers, which leads me to conclude that they were broken off before anyone even attempted to bag the console.

 

P1270009.jpg

 

After working on that lot for a while, I decided it was time to go wild in the country with some primer and try and get an idea of how things were coming along.  Consoles don't look too bad after the repair work.... and that map lamp is a thousand times little bit better!

 

P1270013.jpg

 

And a quick spray over the tail area and this is also looking much better. Way superior to the kit parts I think.

 

P1270014.jpg

 

Actually, the real reason for firing up the primer to day was to have a good look at these bad boys....  Yup, the SACRU's from Shapeways. 

On the left we have the 1:48 version and the two on the right are 1:32, all printed in Frosted Extreme Detail.   Pleased? Oh yes I am... well, sort of.

The 1:32 scale parts printed perfectly and are in the shop.  However,  Shapeways software picked up a 'flaw' in the 1:48 version - I put 'flaw' in quotes as the are in question was part of a round surface and it picked up one small fragment of the surface. Had there truly been a flaw, it should have selected the entire surface as it had uniform wall thickness.  I opted to use their a "print it anyway" option, and of course, it printed perfectly.  However, because their software has determined there is a 'flaw' (there go those quotes again), I had to change the design very slightly in the 1:48 version before they would let me sell it.  You would not be able to tell any differences between the items other than a scale factor but it was slightly annoying to have to deal with that issue.

 

P1270008.jpg

 

So what do they really look like ?.... cue the infernal and completely unforgiving macro shot.  (Them big poles is cocktail sticks by the way!).  I've merely sprayed primer on them - no clean up of the parts whatsoever.  I think they'll pass muster.  Close enough for government work at least.

 

P1270010.jpg

 

But what do they really really look like?  Well, at a normal viewing distance, this is more like what you would see. Standard scale comparisons of pencil and knife blade included.

 

P1270011a.jpg

 

I'll try and get those painted up over the next few days before I have to head off on my travels again. I'm also going to try and get some more photo etch done this weekend if at all possible.

 

 

 

 

  • Like 9
Link to comment
Share on other sites

This one is a SAR2

A17.jpg

seems it might just miss the spot

This one too

Picture_203.jpg

 

Id say the upper one shows the beginnings of the recess at the bottom

 

Some git let the sheepskin get in the way on number two  :(

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks Bill, I have photo's that clearly (well, sort of...) show the recess on the starboard side, but the port side is another matter. It seems this is not a very photogenic part of the a/c and the masses in general have avoided taking any (good clear) shots of the area in question

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 2018-01-08 at 10:25 AM, Corsairfoxfouruncle said:

I wonder what the item is thats sticking out of the Tail boom facing port/rearwards 45* just ahead of the Code letter ? Are the two items connected or is this a seperate device ? Could the be some sort of sensor/recon. devices ? 

Definitely Radar Warning Receivers, there are two on the front too.

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The "dangly thing behind the wheel" was a Bae IR jammer, not the US ALQ-144, and was always fitted to 72 Sqn aircraft in NI. It was never used anywhere else. The 4 sensors are missile approach warners, RWRs were never fitted to any Wessex. Often only the housings were present with a blanking plate instead of an actual sensor head.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Whadya know... 2 days and 2 visits to the basement!  Then just to top things off... I found some more photo's that I didn't realize I had - and I have a photo of that rear console which lets me know exactly what to do!   (I should have looked before I ask so I'm feeling a little bit :sheep:ish - but many thanks to all of you who responded to my request!)

 

As always, I had already gone and painted up the cockpit boxes.  No great harm done - I'll be happier once I know it's correct! or at east more correct than it currently is.  I'm also starting a fantastic collection of dust - I have resin dust, plastic dust, metal dust, dust dust, and some mummified crickets to start things off with.

 

 

P1280001.jpg

 

Anyways,  I got to thinking that if I ever want to get this finished I had better start actually gluing things together and the cockpit are looks like it;'s next on the assembly list. So out with the instructions, find the parts in the diagram, then look at them on the runner tree... and then think oh!

The cyclic lever sort of looks okay - as far as bits of plastic go, but you are expected to glue the control grip on top of the lever, the boot on the bottom of the lever, and expect it to stay together throughout the build - Sorry, t'aint gonna happen. I'm a klutz. I break things all the time. Particularly small finely detailed bits I've just stuck on!

Out with the brass rod again and three attempts at a cyclic lever later (using the plastic part as a template, obviously). Not too bad - a little bit of clean up and they should be fine.

 

P1280002.jpg

 

That way, I can drill completely through the boot, and into the control grip, and have the cyclic lever mounted through the floor.  That will provide much more strength and have half a chance of staying together for the remainder of the build.

 

P1280004.jpg

 

Of course, no bit of tiny diameter tube is complete without having to drill at least one hole into it somewhere.  This hole is where the cables from the control grip exit the lever and continue through some trunking on the floor.

 

P1280005.jpg

 

... and here's where things started gnawing away at my grey matter.

See that grey boot placed about a third of the way forward on the floor ?  That's where Fly would have you place the cyclic - WRONG!!  The cyclic lever is positioned more where I am showing it. In reality, it's just forward of the rear edge of the cabin floor.  (Fly are also particularly vague on the placement of the seats. - very unhelpful)

 

P1280007.jpg

 

At this point I began mocking things up as I had one of those uneasy feelings. 

It just doesn't look right and I'm not quite sure what's wrong.   The front edge of the seat is about right in relation to the rear edge of the cockpit floor - but the instrument panel is too far forward. It's also at a rather steep angle for my liking.

 

P1280008.jpg

 

Something's not right here.  I don't ever remember having that much leg room climbing in and out of there. I was always banging my knees on things.

The relationship between the cockpit components is out of whack somewhere.

 

P1280009.jpg

 

This shows the angle of the instrument panel a bit better - that's way too sloped for my liking. Some forward planning is required here methinks.  The bulkhead to the right of the instrument panel is also way too far forward.

Okay, some creative bodging ahead by the looks of things

 

P1280011.jpg

 

Don't you just love it when  kit falls together?

 

 

 

 

Edited by hendie
  • Like 6
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree about the IP (caveat: I only ever flew in a Wessex as a LHS passenger).  The cockpit coaming looks approx right via Mk 1 eye-ball (un-calibrated), but the vertical bit needs to swing anti-clockwise by about 30 degrees, I reckon.

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, hendie said:

Don't you just love it when  kit falls together?

I might do if I ever get to experience such a strange phenomenon.

 

It might not be possible to correct the distance  between the IP and the seats without losing detail from the centre consul but lessening the IP's angle some more will go a long way to improving the look.Why do I get the feeling that you will re-build the consul as well Hendie?

 

Martian

  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think the cowling should be behind the screen rather than tucked under it within the fuselage

That would immediately improve the picture

The cowling is very obviously quite broad in the picture above

 

From what I've seen it would be dead easy to lose your packet of ten Park Drive at the front of it

 

You'd be able to pick em back up when you landed though

😀

Edited by perdu
  • Like 1
  • Haha 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...