corsaircorp Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 Hello Greggles, That's what I call modelling too ! Ideas like the one of using electrical tubing as a Template ! Really enjoyed that way to do thing, Congrats Nice job on that floats. A Schneider trophy collection ! Please No do not induce me into such an idea, it will be hard to resist ! Have a very good modelling time ! Sincerely. Corsaircorp 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrlx Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 Really clever idea and execution Cheers Jaime 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pheonix Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 That was an ingenious piece of plastic engineering. Very good idea - could you make them in 172 scale? P 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greggles.w Posted September 7, 2017 Author Share Posted September 7, 2017 26 minutes ago, pheonix said: could you make them in 172 scale? .. oh that's just cruel! Just imagine trying .. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caerbannog Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 cool solution 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexN Posted September 11, 2017 Share Posted September 11, 2017 Neat work - hat off to you, sir! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg in OK Posted September 11, 2017 Share Posted September 11, 2017 A bold start on a great looking kit!! Can't wait to see this one finished. Greg in OK 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greggles.w Posted September 12, 2017 Author Share Posted September 12, 2017 Hello & thanks for the encouragement! Work on the floats is nearing completion. Next has been layering up some detail. Here using an adhesive label with set-out guides to lay out the raised strips along the top spine of the floats & drill locating holes for the future struts: You can see those strips here ... Two other details apparent in the photos above are the rectangular covers to access the strut junctions, and all those recessed, shallow-domed ... 'plugs'. Presumably relating to the watertight compartments within the floats, as written about in the references. The same rectangular covers & 'plugs' were present on the R3C-2 floats, built two years later, as seen here circled in red in a restoration photo: But at the time of racing, 1925, the R3C-2 'plugs' had flush covers, shown here: Here's one back in place on the Smithsonian's exhibited R3C-2: I think a similar effort to streamline was made with the earlier CR-3. In contrast to the initial CR-3 float photos I opened with - which were taken a few months before the race - photos such as these - taken at Cowes during the race - suggest the 'plugs' were covered over. To the point where it is difficult to spot them, but they are there ... So here's me having a go at these.. I took a punch to the thinnest styrene sheet, then deformed them using a metal kitchen skewer, to raise the centre bump, something like as seen in the photo above. Some more adhesive labels to help with set out: ... and then position them like so ... ... all 10 of them!! Four out & six in. My aim is to have them only subtly discernible, so the photo above shows them after a little effort to sand down the rim of each to blend them down into the float. Unfortunately in a few instances the little bump in the middle of the circle has collapsed. I've decided to stop fiddling with them, as it's pretty hard to judge the overall effect while they are in stark white against the grey. So I think it best I hold judgement until I get a monotone of a coat of primer on. I'll do that tomorrow morning, all going well. In the meantime, I'm trying to make sure float No.2 keeps up! Thanks for checking in .. g. . 12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBaron Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 Excellent research and replication greggles! I'd say that you're right to withold judgement until a snort of primer gives some uniformity to appearances. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pheonix Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 That is a very tricky exercise indeed: I can commiserate with the thin plastic bulges on the plugs as I have had similar problems in the past. I agree that a coat of primer is the best way forward - the feature is so subtle to achieve. Good for having a go though. P 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greggles.w Posted September 12, 2017 Author Share Posted September 12, 2017 3 hours ago, TheBaron said: I'd say that you're right to withold judgement until a snort of primer gives some uniformity to appearances. 4 minutes ago, pheonix said: I agree that a coat of primer is the best way forward - the feature is so subtle to achieve. Thanks gentlemen, it's nice to have that judgement seconded. Having said that (!) I have kept fiddling a bit on other things.. There's an extra detail only found on the inner chine (I had to look that word up!) of the float, seen below left, a blade-like strip which presumably was there to deflect water spray down away from the fuselage. So while having a go at that with some fine strip (foreground), in much the same manner as the keel strip (background) ... ... I belatedly notice the size of the float step there, which is more apparent to me now the excess white sheet has been trimmed off at the back. Here's an image of the real thing showing a proportionally much smaller step... So, it seems primer may be put off for a little longer. A slab of thick sheet laminated to the under surface to lower the step .. Trim that tomorrow after the glue dries & repeat for the other face. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roadrunner Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 Great work on the floats. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greggles.w Posted September 12, 2017 Author Share Posted September 12, 2017 2 minutes ago, roadrunner said: Great work on the floats. Thanks S.! To keep myself from impatiently causing further harm to the near-to-finished floats, I've opened up the packaging for the airplane they will support. Laid out below are the lovely resin & (quite soft) white metal parts which will be used for this CR-3 project. The zip lock bag contains the various jewel-like bits for the undercarriage, tail skid, and Lamblin radiators of the CR-2 - which won't be used - together with cockpit bits like seat & so on which will be replaced by a pilot figure. I've undertaken no clean-up of these parts. This is how they came out of their wrapping. Minimal flash, minimal casting blocks, very fine panel lines, lovely form. Looking forward to transitioning to this stage soon! 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greggles.w Posted September 13, 2017 Author Share Posted September 13, 2017 (edited) Today's work in cardboard. A jig to bring together Float + Plane. It occurred to me that I didn't have an easy way to hold these floats for priming. The logical thing would be to have a few struts connected & to use them. But to make the struts I would first need to confirm the geometry & dimensions. So a jig. One of those exciting moments when plastic bits hint at becoming a plane! Edited September 13, 2017 by greggles.w 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pheonix Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 That is some jig! Very impressive indeed - I may have to make something elaborate when I come to mount the wing on my Dornier - until now I have never tried anything nearly so elaborate as that. P 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBaron Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 Wot Mr.Phoenix said. That jig is incredible! Almost a piece of Modernist architecture in it's own right... Tony 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greggles.w Posted September 14, 2017 Author Share Posted September 14, 2017 12 hours ago, pheonix said: That is some jig! 12 hours ago, TheBaron said: Wot Mr.Phoenix said. That jig is incredible! Almost a piece of Modernist architecture in it's own right... Thanks Pheonix, thanks Tony. Brutalist modern architecture perhaps? As it happens architecture is my trade, and the jig is made of a low cost card which we used to use to make models back at university (before 3D CAD had taken over). The jig is evolving, a little less 'architecture' & more shanty... The additions being to join the dots, between the locating hole I've already drilled on the float, and the tiny locating hole in the fuselage. As far as I can tell Curtiss used the CR-2's undercarriage fixing locations for the CR-3's float strut fixings, as shown below, so that helpfully lets me use the Noix kit's locating holes on the fuselage. So out with the soft brass tube, flattened & ground to a symmetrical aerofoil profile: Then use the jig to grind down the angle to the end joining the float ... ... and then much the same for the junction with the fuselage: Then next I laminated some thin plastic sheet to the ends to capture the 'sleeve' detail which can just be seen here: Like so, with a brass pin inserted too... And fixed in place to the float! That'll do for today.. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBaron Posted September 14, 2017 Share Posted September 14, 2017 'Great architecture should always be applauded.' 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pheonix Posted September 14, 2017 Share Posted September 14, 2017 Excellent bit of scratch building there. The evolving jig is interesting too. P 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Stuart Posted September 14, 2017 Share Posted September 14, 2017 This is a very interesting build, and read. I'm in admiration of your rebuilding of those floats- excellent 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greggles.w Posted September 15, 2017 Author Share Posted September 15, 2017 13 hours ago, TheBaron said: 'Great architecture should always be applauded.' Very kind sir, thanks Baron! 8 hours ago, Robert Stuart said: This is a very interesting build, and read. I'm in admiration of your rebuilding of those floats- excellent Thanks Robert. A few things going in my favour with those floats: the relatively straightforward geometry; plywood construction meaning no panel lines or rivets; and a very close likeness to the donor R3C-2 floats. 9 hours ago, pheonix said: Excellent bit of scratch building there. The evolving jig is interesting too. Thanks Pheonix! Well the jig is evolving further, with a new growth ready to support the rear strut. Joining the dots again, this time from the float to the Noix kit underwing undercarriage locating hole, visible on the upturned plane in the background below: The resulting geometry is markedly different, leaning forward not back, and leaning further in. That greater inward lean can be seen in the photo on left, and is confirmed as OK & generally consistent with the drawing on the right: Yet for all that, the resulting strut length is only 1.5mm shorter than the front strut. I didn't predict that. Here's one of my spare strut cast-offs sitting in place: That will have to do for today, as I'm due to head out of town shortly. No more work on this for me until Monday at the earliest. Will keep my eye on all the other great projects underway here in the meantime ... 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrlx Posted September 16, 2017 Share Posted September 16, 2017 Impressive work detailing the floats and on the jig and struts. Really interesting and inspirational read. Cheers Jaime Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBaron Posted September 16, 2017 Share Posted September 16, 2017 I don't know whether to admire the aircraft or the jig more at this stage! Neck and neck at the moment. Tony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caerbannog Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 Brilliant work as usual. This jig is a kit in it's own René Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spookytooth Posted September 20, 2017 Share Posted September 20, 2017 Lovely work the Greggles.w , The jig and floats etc look great. Will follow the rest of this build. Simon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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