Jump to content

AMG 1/72 Bf.109B kit - thoughts, impressions?


Wm Blecky

Recommended Posts

Now that AMG has released their series of early Bf.109 kits, I wonder if anyone who has dropped the coin for one has any thoughts or impressions they can share?  I've seen pictures of it and have developed my own opinion as this point, but that is all, just an opinion as I have not picked one up yet.

 

I'll admit that I am also having more than just a little difficulty swallowing the price (price plus shipping running around the $30 plus USD mark) that I see being asked for it (on eBay anyways).

 

I will say that I am not a fan of the photoetched landing gear covers (that may, or may not, change).  I am sure they are truly "to scale" being photoetch, just not sold on them though.  I suppose that if anything, it can not be any worse than the Avis release from several years ago.  That was one I had high hopes for but was quite disappointed once in hand.

 

Anyways... thoughts, impressions anyone?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 weeks later...
On 7/27/2017 at 6:51 PM, Corsairfoxfouruncle said:

I looked & cant find a US dealer. Cant afford the kit and overseas shipping. If i can find one in the states i may spring for one. 

Judging from the prices that I have seen on eBay and elsewhere, I don't think it will come any less expensive than what I have already seen ($30 USD and up) and this kit does not strike me as being worth that kind of money.

 

From the "uniform" pricing that I've seen on this kit, I almost wonder if that is coming from the manufacturer or if sellers just think they can get that for this kit since it is supposed to be so good (I say supposed as I have not seen one review yet - here or elsewhere).

 

I think if you can find a dealer in the US, the price will be worse that what you've already seen.  Case in point, Fine Molds Bf.109 kits, any time that I have seen them from a retailer (online or store), they have been ridiculously expensive ($35 - $40 USD or more), yet if purchase them direct from Hobby Link Japan, they can be had for $17 (give or take) USD plus a very reasonable shipping cost when if you use SAL.

 

Let us know if you have any luck scoring one at a reasonable price.

Edited by Wm Blecky
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

There are some comments  regarding the kit by a friend who bought one:

 

"I've had one of these for some time now. While the initial viewing makes it look very good, it has issues. As far as the shape goes it is very good. Nice scribing and most of the small parts are done well. Photo etch and masks included and all of the parts for all of the variants are apparently included in all of the kits.

However... there's no canopy framing and the engineering of the wing is preposterous. The wing does not for the most part break on panel lines. The wing root is split up the middle, cleaning up this seam will most likely take out the fairings that cover the spar bolts requiring their replacement. At the trailing edge of the wing root are rather wonky keys on the lower surface of the fuselage that are supposed to slot into openings on the lower wing panel. They don't fit. Then there's the join at the trailing edge. Most 109 kits I have seen the lower wing panels aft edge is at the flap/aileron juncture on the underside. Not here, no that would be much too simple. Instead there is a sweeping joint that runs through two panel lines on it's way to the wingtip. In addition the lower wing is too thick to sit flush in it's provided recess adding insult to injury.

Then we get to the cowling. I believe there are ten pieces involved in the cowling assembly. It appears that the lower radiator area will fit fairly well, the rest of it looks like it will be a challenge. Another issue with the cowling is that the rather prominent angled vents fore and aft of the exhausts are merely represented with a scribed outline rather than an indentation. This will also be a challenge to rectify.

So what do we have at the end of the day? It's got a better shape than the Heller kit. It's got better detail, better fabric surfaces and it's scribed. It also looks to be a bitch to build. The Heller kit, which has just been rereleased, will be an easier build but not as accurate. Which you choose will depend on your priorities and skill level. I was really hoping for a reasonable kit here, but the engineering of the wing has really put me off. Which is a shame as I would have bought about two dozen of these things. I guess I'll have to wait and see what the competition brings out.

Now for a little editorial content. I have it on good authority that the 1/48 scale early 109's by AMG do not have the ludicrous engineering around the wing. So why did they do this on the 1/72 scale kit? The only thing I can think of is to leave fingerprints. So that if one of the less principled manufactures tries to copy the AMG kit it will be glaringly obvious that they did so or they have a lot of extra work to do to cover their tracks. I can see their point but the disservice they did to the consumer is appalling.
Cheers,
Woody"

 

 

Complete discussion here

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

A mate of mine nearly fell over when he heard the price.  He's sticking to the old Heller kit and the Avis/Amodel ones.

 

Didn't someone else do a series of early 109s about 15 years ago?  One of the small eastern European manufacturers?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks Chuck for posting that, I appreciate it.  You've certainly confirmed my initial impressions.  I balked at the price and was hesitant based on the impressions I formed from the pictures I had come across on the net.  I certainly am quite glad that I held off and I do not foresee myself grabbing one of these kits any time soon.  Although not the latest and greatest, I'll be sticking to my Heller kits, raised panel lines and all!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, The Wooksta! said:

A mate of mine nearly fell over when he heard the price.  He's sticking to the old Heller kit and the Avis/Amodel ones.

 

Didn't someone else do a series of early 109s about 15 years ago?  One of the small eastern European manufacturers?

Wooksta, I think you are thinking of Avis.  If so, their 109 kits are a let down as well.  From what I recall, I did not care for the shape of the nose among other things.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Corsairfoxfouruncle said:

I guess i will hold off on my Dora. Unless anyone makes a resin backdate set for an "E". 

Many years back, DB Productions did a nice little resin nose conversion set with white metal prop.  It may not have addressed the wing differences but it certainly gave you a good head start.

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

It seems the Heller kit has been described as having some shape issues- can somebody educate me as to what they might be? I started a Heller kit years ago, as it looked pretty good to me, and got the airframe together, but stopped at that stage and I don't recall why, as I don't have that model anymore, just two unbuilt ones still in the box. From what I have read and seen of the sprues on the Avis and AMG kits, I'm not sure they are worth the asking price. Could the Heller nose be grafted on a Bf-109E-3 kit at the firewall, the underwing radiators removed and the blisters and fairings removed and the wings re-scribed and the correct oil cooler fitted? I sure do like the C/D versions! I'm guessing the early canopy w/o the armored windscreen is also called for? Maybe AZ Models or Zvezda will get around to them some day!

Mike

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, 72modeler said:

It seems the Heller kit has been described as having some shape issues- can somebody educate me as to what they might be? I started a Heller kit years ago, as it looked pretty good to me, and got the airframe together, but stopped at that stage and I don't recall why, as I don't have that model anymore, just two unbuilt ones still in the box. From what I have read and seen of the sprues on the Avis and AMG kits, I'm not sure they are worth the asking price. Could the Heller nose be grafted on a Bf-109E-3 kit at the firewall, the underwing radiators removed and the blisters and fairings removed and the wings re-scribed and the correct oil cooler fitted? I sure do like the C/D versions! I'm guessing the early canopy w/o the armored windscreen is also called for? Maybe AZ Models or Zvezda will get around to them some day!

Mike

I believe there are some differences from the B - C - D models, but other than that, I do not recall reading anything really disparaging about the Heller kit, other than it's age and the raised panel lines.  IMHO, certainly better than the Avis kit and, at this point, I'd take it over the new AMG kit as well.

 

As for grafting the nose to another kit, why not? equally, why not try scribing it instead?  I am sure that either method would present it's own set of challenges.  FWIW, Part makes a nice photoetch set for the Heller kit and I believe that it is still available.

 

As for Zvezda or AZ doing one, that would be nice.  I'd prefer to see it from Zvezda as AZ seems to have problems getting the nose correct on their 109G kits and I'd be concerned that the same problem would follow a 109B kit from them.  Mind you, if their sister company KP were to do it, that might be well worthwhile as they got the nose on their Avia S-199 kits right (which, if you think about it, is ironic as they use the same wing sprues as the 109G kits).  Oh well...

Edited by Wm Blecky
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 hours ago, The Wooksta! said:

A mate of mine nearly fell over when he heard the price.  He's sticking to the old Heller kit and the Avis/Amodel ones.

 

Didn't someone else do a series of early 109s about 15 years ago?  One of the small eastern European manufacturers?

AML did a Bf109D-1 (ref.72008) and Sword a Bf109D (ref.72005) years ago.  If my memory serves me, the Sword kit was alleged to have provided the "inspiration" for the Avis (and hence later AML) kits

Link to comment
Share on other sites

No, there was definitely another early 109 kit from one of the east European manufacturers, possibly Polish - a friend picked one up in Italy about ten years ago and the resulting model looked better than the Heller kit.  For some reason the name Aeroplast keeps coming up in me head.

 

Yep. Definitely Aeroplast and they're still available. A quick search on ebay found these:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/MESSERSCHMITT-Bf-109-B-SPANISH-AF-LUFTWAFFE-MKGS-1-72-AEROPLAST-/381942062583?hash=item58ed855df7:g:hBAAAMXQVT9S0oWM

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/MESSERSCHMITT-Bf-109-C-SPANISH-LUFTWAFFE-MARKINGS-264-1-72-AEROPLAST-/381697317591?hash=item58deeedad7:g:qVEAAMXQydtTN9Q2

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/MESSERSCHMITT-Bf-109-D-LEGION-CONDOR-LUFTWAFFE-MARK-1-72-AEROPLAST-RARITAT-/361573244947?hash=item542f71e013:g:1~EAAOSw1vlUtYps

 

And they do a T as well, although I suspect that's the old Face kit.

 

I had the Sword 109D but the rear fuselage looked very small.

Edited by The Wooksta!
Added info!
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, The Wooksta! said:

No, there was definitely another early 109 kit from one of the east European manufacturers, possibly Polish - a friend picked one up in Italy about ten years ago and the resulting model looked better than the Heller kit.  For some reason the name Aeroplast keeps coming up in me head.

 

Yep. Definitely Aeroplast and they're still available. A quick search on ebay found these:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/MESSERSCHMITT-Bf-109-B-SPANISH-AF-LUFTWAFFE-MKGS-1-72-AEROPLAST-/381942062583?hash=item58ed855df7:g:hBAAAMXQVT9S0oWM

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/MESSERSCHMITT-Bf-109-C-SPANISH-LUFTWAFFE-MARKINGS-264-1-72-AEROPLAST-/381697317591?hash=item58deeedad7:g:qVEAAMXQydtTN9Q2

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/MESSERSCHMITT-Bf-109-D-LEGION-CONDOR-LUFTWAFFE-MARK-1-72-AEROPLAST-RARITAT-/361573244947?hash=item542f71e013:g:1~EAAOSw1vlUtYps

 

And they do a T as well, although I suspect that's the old Face kit.

 

I had the Sword 109D but the rear fuselage looked very small.

Hi Wooksta, I'd have to disagree with you about the Aeroplast kit looking better than the Heller offering.  Here is a review of the kit along with pictures of the sprues and if you just look at the fuselage, you can see it does not look right.  The reviewer does speak to and identify the issues with the fuselage.  I do agree with the reviewer about the wings as they do look good.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I merely bring the option to the table.  The model I saw about ten years back looked okay from what I remember.  I'm no accuracy fanatic, especially when it come to the Luftwaffe...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well I have bought a few of the AMG kits just this very week so haven't had the chance to cut plastic yet but have had a good look over the plastic. I noticed the rather odd shape to the aileron area and hope that it won't be a big issue if I use a filler that can have the excess blended away rather than by sanding. There are a lot of tiny parts that will probably never make it off the sprue in one piece but equally will probably not be missed on the kit and the spade style control column is a nice touch for the earliest of 109s but wrong for a Bertha onwards. In 1/72 scale these are nit picking issues providing the overall shape and dimensions are accurate.

I have a fair old collection of 1/72 scale Bf109s (lost count when it got to about 120!) and I probably have every one of the various brands of Jumo engined 109s produced. All bought in the hope that they would be better than the previous purchase. From what I can tell the AMG kit offers the best detailed Jumo 109 from straight out of the box. There will be work needed if you intend making one for each of the Jumo engined variant as there were some subtle (and less than subtle) differences between them, the most obvious being the engine cooling vents on each side of the fuselage which changed position depending on the variant. AMG have provided optional front fairing though which is to be applauded. Their approach to the propellor variations I'm not so convinced about, particularly how we'll depict the early wooden one by adding a tiny nose cone. It might look OK once done but I would have preferred a separate early, late wooden and the metal prop. I've got spares somewhere anyway so no big deal for me. 

With regards to some of the other kits mentioned, forget the Aeroplast kit (a horrid waste of petrochemicals), only attempt the AMK kit if you are a masochist (although it has some nice resin/PE depending on which edition you buy), do have a go at rescribing the Heller kit and add an after market cockpit if you are into adding detail that will mostly disappear, the Sword kit is basic but looks ok (again this has some nice resin) and as for the Avis kit (and it's non Ltd Edition version from AML?) which was the last one to appear a few years back I think it's probably best used as a donor for grafting the nose onto a decent kit like the Tamiya Emil (or ICM clone which has the rear fuselage length issue of the Tamiya kit sorted) as the scribed surface is quite rough in places and not what you'd expect from a modern tooled kit.

That's my initial thoughts on this new release anyway, the build will be the clincher but hopefully it'll turn out ok with a bit of patience.

 

Duncan B 

 

p.s. I second the hope that AZ stay clear of any more 109s as they have taken the type backwards in my opinion. Lets hope Finemolds reappears with the rest of the 109 family instead.

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, bil said:

Is the plastic in each of the 4 boxes the same?

Yes, it's identical as far as I can tell, just the decals vary. Hence my comment about the fuselage cooling vents only being correct for one of the versions (can't remember off the top of my head which but suspect it's for the Dora).

 

Duncan B

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks for your comments Duncan.  Regarding the AMG kits, while I was looking at pictures of the sprues,  (I haven't seen any instructions yet), I noticed that there were 3 different sets of cooling vents (upper front cowling ???).  It was my impression that these are used to differentiate between the 109 (B, C & D) variants.  Am I correct with that?  Is there any appreciable difference between these parts?

 

If so, I'd be tempted to lay my hands on a few and use them to tweak my Heller kit.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Wm Blecky said:

Thanks for your comments Duncan.  Regarding the AMG kits, while I was looking at pictures of the sprues,  (I haven't seen any instructions yet), I noticed that there were 3 different sets of cooling vents (upper front cowling ???).  It was my impression that these are used to differentiate between the 109 (B, C & D) variants.  Am I correct with that?  Is there any appreciable difference between these parts?

 

If so, I'd be tempted to lay my hands on a few and use them to tweak my Heller kit.

I will be doing a small review of the kit at some point but to answer your question regarding the upper cooling vents the kit does include 4 optional parts. There is a plain part for the very early aircraft along with 3 others with varying layouts of vents for the different variants, as always photo references should be used to confirm which to use.

 

Duncan B

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I also have gotten the AMG kits and have very mixed feelings about them. I'm elated that there is a 1/72 scale kit that appears to have nailed the shape of this aircraft. I'm impressed with the finesse and detail of most of the parts. The spade grip control stick is remarkable with no flash and good detailing. The nose is a real puzzle, both as pertaining to the parts breakdown and as to what in the world they were thinking. Perhaps one solution would be to assemble one correctly, then cast it for future builds. Incidentally, they are now in stock at Hannants for $21.45; about right for what you get.

As mentioned by others, the wing parts breakdown defies logic. It would have been much easier to split the wing along the flap/aileron line as they did with their 1/48th kit.

That being said this model should present no greater problems than a typical short run kit (which it is not). 

As for the Heller kit; it is a product of the 1970's, and it shows. The wheel wells are not boxed in, the canopy is very thick, the landing gear is someone's best guess, and the spinner and prop are near misses that can be fixed by sanding. But the greatest problem is the nose, which is far too thin in profile. Can it be fixed? Yes, probably by cutting off the lower cowl scoop, building up the the lower fuselage, then sticking the whole thing back together. Could make the AMG kit look easy. And incidentally, the DB nose is just the Heller kit part, cleaned up and scribed. In one way it would be even more difficult to use since the whole thing is one piece. The lower cowl radiator would have to be painted after the other painting is finished. Lots of luck making that look good.

Not one to shrink from the challenge, I have started the AMG kit and will build it up side by side with a Heller kit that has been a shelf queen for years now. I had made a few rudimentary corrections to the upper cowl of the Heller model, since it has some bulges in all the wrong places, but will leave the lower cowl alone. More soon in the in progress models section.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...