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PVA and Canopies - Advice Required


BIG X

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Afternoon All,  I have been using neat PVA for attaching my canopies and other clear parts - but I'm not 'overly' happy as they don't seem very 'sturdy'.  I did fall for the newbie mistake of using liquid poly on my first model - with the inevitable fogging.  Am I missing a trick - is there a 'super' product out there that is off my radar.

...as always - any advice or tips gratefully received - thanks in advance - Steve

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Formula 560 Canopy Glue I use all the time: dries completely clear, fills gaps, and is actually very strong after 24 hours to cure fully. (It sets much faster than that, but it continues to gain in strength for 24 hours, so if I'm using some nice rigid clear parts to pull a car body into shape,  for example, I leave it taped and clamped for that long in the airing cupboard)

 

http://www.modelshopleeds.co.uk/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=105

 

best,

M.

Edited by cmatthewbacon
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Kristal Klear (which I use) is basically just PVA.  As are similar products.  I've found the Humbrol product a bit weak, and there is a Gorrilla Glue equivalent which I have tried.  Others simply use a varnish, I'm told.  I've not known any canopies come loose, but then surely they shouldn't be put to any great pressure.  (My problems with the Humbrol product was when trying to get the Airfix Blenheim nose in place, so that may not have been a fair test of the product.)

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I have long used both Kristal Klear and Formula 560 with excellent results---particularly the latter, as cmatthewbacon so effectively describes---but my new 'go to' is the sort of '5 second fix' UV-hardening resin adhesive advertised so pervasively on television (at least here in the US).

It's a crystal-clear resin applied through a built-in needle applicator. It remains a viscuous liquid---a bit thinner and far less 'stringy' than old-style tube cement---and can be easily leveled or wiped away until cured. Once hit with the tiny UV light built into the applicator---it only takes 5-10 seconds, just like the adverts say---it forms a crystal clear segment, with little or no apparent shrinkage, which is approximately the same hardness as styrene. It can be easily and cleanly sanded, if required, and buffs/polishes out to its original clarity.

Downsides: it is a bit pricey, and there is a distinctive (but not overwhelming) resinous odor, for those who are sensitive to such things. Can't speak as to long-term survival---since I've only been using it about six months---but of the half-dozen or so projects I've used it on, there is so far no evidence of fogging, color-change, cracking, shrinking (or expansion) or shedding of paint. [The latter regular Tamiya acrylics, some applied with primer, some not.]

What I especially like is its easy gap-filling ability. I will typically apply as much as needed, then set the canopy in place---give a quick wipe with a cotton-bud to smooth any 'oozed out' extra---then hit it with the UV light, while (if necessary) keeping the canopy in place with a thumb or rubber band. Canopies that used to pop off with 560 stay solidly in place.

I hasten to add I own no stock in said product...I've just had really good luck with it. I found it myself via a recommendation on another modelling forum.

Cheers

Edited by thorfinn
spelling typo
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4 hours ago, BIG X said:

 I did fall for the newbie mistake of using liquid poly on my first model - with the inevitable fogging.  Am I missing a trick - is there a 'super' product out there that is off my radar.

The trick being missed is dunking the canopy in acrylic varnish first.

That prevents the fogging.

I used old stock Johnsons Klear, others will recommend newer products - but have fitted a canopy with SuperGlue - no fogging.

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I've used superglue (CA) if I 've done the Klear treatment and so far haven't had the fogging problem.  There again I've also used Resin W external wood glue (professional woodworking PVA) equally well, which has the advantage that the canopy doesn't have to be a perfect fit as it does with .CA.  I bought some Kristal Klear to try out but haven't got to the canopy stage yet.

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I've used super glue as well

Let your PVA thicken [by evaporation] before using

I've also used Humbrol Clearfix

and that UV setting resin glue- especially good for thin vac form canopies

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I've just ordered some 5 second fix on amazon.  It has some terrible reviews on there - from people trying to use it on things that aren't transparent and the UV light doesn't cure the hidden glue - Muppets :doh:

 

As I only want it for canopies and lights etc - I think it is worth a go for £4

 

I'll keep you posted - if I don't blind myself

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I also use Formula 560 for clear parts. I also find it useful for temporarily fitting parts if you're not entirely sure if it's in exactly the right place, eg a cockpit assembly before dry fitting the fuselage. If you were wrong the first time you can wiggle it off for another try. 

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On 2017-7-6 at 14:01, cmatthewbacon said:

 

Formula 560 Canopy Glue I use all the time

 

Thanks for that - I've ordered some.

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4 hours ago, BIG X said:

I've just ordered some 5 second fix on amazon.  It has some terrible reviews on there - from people trying to use it on things that aren't transparent and the UV light doesn't cure the hidden glue - Muppets :doh:

 

As I only want it for canopies and lights etc - I think it is worth a go for £4

 

I'll keep you posted - if I don't blind myself

4 squids?

I pay 99p, from china.

 

takes about 10 days to arrive but things take 5 days from England anyhows

 

the UV gel is handy for making landing light lenses and such too

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Where do you get it from for 99p?

 

I was terribly sceptical about this stuff when I first bought it but if you use it correctly it is superb! Don't bother using it where the light won't reach and it can make a mess if not used correctly.

 

There are different kinds of UV torches available and I have a weak one so I'm planning to get another stronger one.

 

From experiments so far. Adding the glue to a part then giving it a very short 1 to 2 second burst of the UV torch generally sets it slightly but not completely. This allows a wee bit more fine fettling before giving the full setting burst of light.

 

My first glue pen is now running out and I'm extremely keen to get more of this stuff, and a better UV light but prices so far seem rather silly.

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I use G-S Hypo Cement.

 

Used for glueing crystals optics beads.

 

I can best describe it as being a little bit like translucent silicone.

 

It takes about 10 minutes but needs 24 hours to cure. Will fill gaps. Very tacky. Dries clear.

Like silicone it stays slightly rubbery unlike PVA which goes hard and can rupture easily

I bought some Formula 560 and found it is just a modified PVA.

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Hypo-Cement-Precise-Applicator-Essential/dp/B0053TN1C2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1499559846&sr=8-1&keywords=g-s+hypo+cement

Edited by LaurieS
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8 hours ago, LaurieS said:

I use G-S Hypo Cement.

 

Used for glueing crystals optics beads.

 

I can best describe it as being a little bit like translucent silicone.

 

It takes about 10 minutes but needs 24 hours to cure. Will fill gaps. Very tacky. Dries clear.

Like silicone it stays slightly rubbery unlike PVA which goes hard and can rupture easily

I bought some Formula 560 and found it is just a modified PVA.

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Hypo-Cement-Precise-Applicator-Essential/dp/B0053TN1C2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1499559846&sr=8-1&keywords=g-s+hypo+cement

Gets my vote too - switch to this recently from PVA and I think it's  top whack stuff.

 

Jonners

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23 hours ago, BIG X said:

:doh:99p - well done!!!

 

14 hours ago, Murdo said:

Where do you get it from for 99p?

...

My first glue pen is now running out and I'm extremely keen to get more of this stuff, and a better UV light but prices so far seem rather silly.

Light and gel glue = £1.09

Gel glue refill only 99p

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/5-Second-Fix-Fill-Seal-Repair-Liquid-Plastic-UV-Light-Glue-Welding-Tool-Pen-Hot-/142438219126?var=&hash=item2129fabd76:m:mHX2iHMclMF2tJizFzpFjmA

The light lasts a long time, just need one, change the battery when it needs doing

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  • 3 weeks later...
On ‎08‎/‎07‎/‎2017 at 08:14, BIG X said:

I've just ordered some 5 second fix on amazon.  It has some terrible reviews on there - from people trying to use it on things that aren't transparent and the UV light doesn't cure the hidden glue - Muppets :doh:

 

As I only want it for canopies and lights etc - I think it is worth a go for £4

 

I'll keep you posted - if I don't blind myself

5 Second Fix - Well it arrived!!!  And what a waste of £4 that was...  The pen had leaked throughout the packaging and all over the pen itself - Amazon and China - when will I ever learn.  Save your money folks - even if you are paying only 99p - this stuff isn't worth the money or the wait.

 

Now what was that other stuff called again - G-S Hypo Cement - let's see if I can get that on Amazon... from China... :giggle:

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Sorry to hear this

My two refills arrived yesterday. They too had leaked but not very much, just a tad sticky on the barrels and the boxes. Not enough to fuss me, there is plenty left in them.

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1 hour ago, BIG X said:

5 Second Fix - Well it arrived!!!  And what a waste of £4 that was...  The pen had leaked throughout the packaging and all over the pen itself - Amazon and China - when will I ever learn.  Save your money folks - even if you are paying only 99p - this stuff isn't worth the money or the wait.

 

Now what was that other stuff called again - G-S Hypo Cement - let's see if I can get that on Amazon... from China... :giggle:

 

My Lazer Bond is perfect after about a year. But it was manufactured in the USA. Cost as bit more than 5secFIX.

 

You will not go wrong with G-S Hypo Cement. Manufactured in the USA. Careful as it keeps coming out of the tube

until you put the pin in the nozzle. Probably best to apply with a tooth pick.

 

Laurie

Edited by LaurieS
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40 minutes ago, Black Knight said:

Sorry to hear this

My two refills arrived yesterday. They too had leaked but not very much, just a tad sticky on the barrels and the boxes. Not enough to fuss me, there is plenty left in them.

Damned disgraceful - "not very much" is too much for me I'm afraid to say.  If you get them for 99p and your happy - then I'm happy for you.  I'm just used ordering something that turns up in a useable condition - especially for 4 times the price. Call me picky - I just want perfection :D 

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7 minutes ago, LaurieS said:

 

My Lazer Bond is perfect after about a year. But it was manufactured in the USA. Cost as bit more than 5secFIX.

 

You will not go wrong with G-S Hypo Cement. Manufactured in the USA. Careful as it keeps coming out of the tube

until you put the pin in the nozzle. Probably best to apply with a tooth pick.

 

Laurie

I would have been happy to pay more for something that actually turned up in a useable condition.

 

I don't have a tooth pick - I guess a cocktail stick will have to suffice ;)

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26 minutes ago, BIG X said:

I don't have a tooth pick - I guess a cocktail stick will have to suffice ;)

 

Dirty boy Big X no toothpicks.

 

Actually the best are Dental Sticks by Boots entitled "smile". They have a blunt end and are much better for spreading.

 

When finished wipe the end and you can multi task them on your teeth. :clap2:

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