1/72 Mirage F1CR & F1CT

[Andrew]

I eagerly purchased a couple of Special Hobby Mirage F1s when they were first released and have been keeping them aside with this GB in mind (I may have purchased a few more since then, I couldn't possibly comment). Although I haven't narrowed the subjects of this project down to particular machines, the intended builds will both be late service examples, probably reflecting some of their operational use. To that end, I'll almost certain that I'll be using Berna Decals for both jets; I haven't used them before but they look very nice. Other aftermarket will include Master pitots, Peewit paint masks and a CMK 'Iraqi' centreline tank for the F1CT. The F1CR will utilise one of the kit-supplied recce pods.

 

Pics of the sprues - apologies for odd effect created by photographing two sets of sprues together...

 

P1000621

 

P1000623

 

thanks for looking,

 

Andrew.

[Wez]

Andrew,

 

Welcome to the GB, very pleased to see late scheme CR and CT versions.

 

I know what you mean about these kits falling into your ownership, I seem powerless to resist them, I now have the CE, 2xB, CR and two Simple kits in the stash and I'm always on the lookout for more!

 

The F1 so far appears to be the most popular Mirage.

[Andrew]

Thanks Wez,

 

From the small amount of work I've done thus far (assembled part of the cockpit and installed the nosewheel bay), the Special Hobby kit looks as though it will be as straightforward to construct as it looks nice on the sprue, so I think we owe it to them to purchase their product!

[Wez]

Don't forget the extra belly intakes on these jets and the deletion of a cannon, the Cocardes book has all the details, well worth getting hold of!

[Graeme H]

I like the sound of you proposals Andrew

I don't really know a terrible lot about F1's, sure to learn more here

and one of those SH kits accidentally fell into my hands just over a month ago, oh well might make it if I get time  

[Giorgio N]

These look like great kits to me, I will have to buy at least one ! Looking forward to your builds

[Avgas]

5 minutes ago, Giorgio N said:

These look like great kits to me, I will have to buy at least one ! Looking forward to your builds

 

Don't they just. I only build 1/48 but these kits have me seriously considering purchasing a pile of them.

[Andrew]

On 26/06/2017 at 5:16 PM, Wez said:

Don't forget the extra belly intakes on these jets and the deletion of a cannon, the Cocardes book has all the details, well worth getting hold of!

 

Awesome, thanks very much Wez. I didn't know of those changes, so will pay careful attention when the time comes (come to think of it, the deleted cannons ties in with something I noticed recently, but I thought no more of it). It's just possible that I have a copy of that book on the way to my corner of the Antipodes (no comment) - when it arrives I'm sure that there's a lot more I'll be learning.

 

Assuming I'd bought that book, of course...

[Andrew]

A spot of pre-assembly painting:

 

 

 

 

Then I glued some bits together...

 

 

Yes, I broke off part of the refuelling probe on one of the radomes. I have the broken bit and hopefully can restore it at a later stage ...

 

Curiously, the very front of the instrument coaming piece did not interact nicely with the corresponding bits of the fuselage halves; I hacked significantly more than felt comfortable (approx 1mm) in order to get the instrument panel into the cockpit tub and the fuselage together around it. The work paid off though as the coaming now looks quite okay -I wonder why there was so much additional plastic at the front?

 

The settled alignment of the fuselage halves is not bad, but both kits will require some work to clean / fill seams. A quick trial fit of each radome suggests that a bit of work is also necessary to render a neat join to the fuselage.

 

Andrew.

[Wez]

Coming together nicely Andrew, looks like you can make quick progress with this kit.

 

One thing to note is the CT had the opposite gun removed to the CR (CT had the port gun removed, CR the starboard).

 

Thinking about the coaming, IIRC some of the earliest kits came with one of the coaming/fwd fuselage sections broken, the later ones didn't, maybe they tweaked the mould to overcome this and added some extra material causing the fit problem you encountered?

 

Keep up the good work

[Flyingdutchman]

Very nice progress on this parallel build. Smart idea to assemble the refueling probe at this stage.

 

Cheers Evert

[Jabba]

10 hours ago, Andrew said:

The settled alignment of the fuselage halves is not bad, but both kits will require some work to clean / fill seams. A quick trial fit of each radome suggests that a bit of work is also necessary to render a neat join to the fuselage.

 

Andrew.

 

Phew I thought that it was just me. I did a trial fit of the nose onto my build, and it just does not want to fit no matter where I try to shave off plastic to make it fit. Almost lost patience with it. I will perceiver and continue tomorrow.

 

Nice work on both builds so far.

[Cookenbacher]

Fantastic work so far Andrew, I'm following along closely as I've just made a start with the SH F.1 CR kit. I'm glad to have some warning about the coaming and nose.

[Graeme H]

I Like what I'm seeing, although I don't know what you used to mark which is which on the fuselage halves, I recently did that and it kept bleeding through

[Wez]

27 minutes ago, Graeme H said:

I Like what I'm seeing, although I don't know what you used to mark which is which on the fuselage halves, I recently did that and it kept bleeding through

 

I always use a Sharpie or similar, but it's important to remember to wipe it off with isopropyl alcohol or similar before proceeding to paint.

[Andrew]

2 hours ago, Graeme H said:

I Like what I'm seeing, although I don't know what you used to mark which is which on the fuselage halves, I recently did that and it kept bleeding through

 

Thanks Graeme. Like Wez said, I use a Sharpie to indicate part nos. and versions/Marks etc. The writing seldom survives to the painting stage and if they do, then again as per Wez's suggestion I'll clean the surface with isopropyl alcohol or methylated spirits to remove the Sharpie inscriptions. As you say, there's a big risk of them bleeding through once paint is applied, even after priming and several layers of paint!

[Mountain goat]

Nice work going on there. I like your instrument panel in particular. Word of warning regarding the wings: the bottom wing parts need LOTS of sanding not only to eliminate an ugly step but also because the wings will look too thick otherwise -I ended up sanding ridiculous amounts both sides of the part with 80 grit thereby destroying all surface detail but at least the wing looks suitably thin as it should. 

 

Jay

Edited July 9, 2017 by Mountain goat

[Andrew]

On 7/7/2017 at 6:52 PM, Wez said:

...One thing to note is the CT had the opposite gun removed to the CR (CT had the port gun removed, CR the starboard).

 

Thinking about the coaming, IIRC some of the earliest kits came with one of the coaming/fwd fuselage sections broken, the later ones didn't, maybe they tweaked the mould to overcome this and added some extra material causing the fit problem you encountered?

 

Thanks again for the info Wez, I'm learning a lot from your posts about the differences between the versions, plus the Cocardes book (that I didn't ..ahem... order) is yet to turn up, so I'm more-or-less blundering in the dark at this stage. To the credit of Special Hobby, they did note in the instructions for their F1CR kit to remove the starboard gun, so all is not down to you to save me from my own ignorance.

 

On 7/8/2017 at 4:37 AM, Jabba said:

 

Phew I thought that it was just me. I did a trial fit of the nose onto my build, and it just does not want to fit no matter where I try to shave off plastic to make it fit. Almost lost patience with it. I will perceiver and continue tomorrow....

 

Thanks Jabba. As you'll see below, I took off the lip of the assembled radome in an attempt to ease the assembly concerns and probably made things worse; for instance, the angle at which the radome and fuselage joined was affected such that I had to insert a shim between the two, just to avoid a ridiculous nose-down cant to the radome. The second of the two kits was a little more refined in how it went together, but it still took a lot of shaving, shaping and fiddling to get the radome onto the fuselage.

 

As was suggested elsewhere, a solution might be to join each radome half to the corresponding fuselage piece in advance of joining the two halves. I'll have to try that on my next build.

 

Andrew.

[Andrew]

Thanks to all for their interest and kind comments.

 

The fuselages needed a bit of work to remove some gaps and misalignment, which led me to do what in retrospect might be excessive - I've removed all the moulded ventery (you know, all the vents and intakes etc) from the underside of the jets. I just couldn't get to the fuselage centreline to do what I needed to do, so I removed the bits that were in my way. While it's been a success thus far, in that I've managed to clean and fill the join, I now need to replace all that moulded goodness. Only time will tell whether it was a prudent move.

 

Anyway here are some pics of the fuselages with Tamiya putty soup (Tamiya grey putty thinned with lacquer thinner) painted on to test the effectiveness of my Superglue mixed with pigment filler. The CMK centreline tank has also been assembled, primed and painted with the same concoction to address some pinholes in the resin's surface.

 

 

 

I then hammered the radome onto the F1CR with maximum prejudice, having attempted to solve the fit issue between the fuselage and radome by making things worse. A shim was necessary to correct an ugly case of nose droop and although the alignment was pretty good (if you squint while looking the other way), in clean-up today I've realised that my solution was far from ideal. I will have to rescribe a fair bit of the lost radome detail, such was the work necessary to get the sides and top and bottom lined up. I took a little more care with the second kit's radome and this has paid dividends in how well the bits relate to each other.

 

 

At least I remembered to add weight to the radomes before gluing them to the fuselage.

 

16 minutes ago, Mountain goat said:

Nice work going on there. I like your instrument panel in particular. Word of warning regarding the wings: the bottom wing parts need LOTS of sanding not only to eliminate an ugly step but also because the wings will look too thick otherwise -I ended up sanding ridiculous amounts both sides of the part with 80 grit thereby destroying all surface detail but at least the wing looks suitably thin as it should. 

 

Jay

 

Thanks Jay, it's an important point for anyone attempting this kit - I picked it up as I was trialling the fit of lower to upper wing pieces last night and ended up grinding away large quantities of plastic from the underside of the lower wing (i.e. the internal side that meets the underside of the upper wing) with my Dremel and an 80 grit sanding stick. Even then, I think I could have taken even more off...

 

 

Thanks to all for looking in.

 

Andrew.

 

[Wez]

Thanks Andrew, some good gen there.

 

Jay had mentioned the wing in his F1B thread, I was thinking of taking the excess from the top surface of the lower wing insert, would this work?

 

That big old drop tank will hide some of the lost detail.

[Mountain goat]

49 minutes ago, Wez said:

Jay had mentioned the wing in his F1B thread, I was thinking of taking the excess from the top surface of the lower wing insert, would this work?

 

That big old drop tank will hide some of the lost detail.

 

Indeed I just did exactly that with the current F1C I'm doing. Works well. Indeed you lose all the detail, but there's not that much to begin with. 

 

The area of the bottom near the leading edge of the inner part of the wing, ie between the dogtooth and fuselage, is quite a bother though. That area needs particular sanding down and viewed from front could also do with a sharper edge. Additionally the edge should sit higher than the original SH part - - I'm not making much sense am I? Look at the area dogtooth-fuselage and compare with kit:

 

http://www.hottail.nl/basevisits/2005/0611-Cazaux/Images/France-MontDeMarsan/MirageF1CT-330AP-227-2.jpg

 

Jay

 

 

 

 

Edited July 9, 2017 by Mountain goat

[Wez]

17 minutes ago, Mountain goat said:

 

Indeed I just did exactly that with the current F1C I'm doing. Works well. Indeed you lose all the detail, but there's not that much to begin with. 

 

The area of the bottom near the leading edge of the inner part of the wing, ie between the dogtooth and fuselage, is quite a bother though. That area needs particular sanding down and viewed from front could also do with a sharper edge. Additionally the edge should sit higher than the original SH part - - I'm not making much sense am I? Look at the area dogtooth-fuselage and compare with kit:

 

http://www.hottail.nl/basevisits/2005/0611-Cazaux/Images/France-MontDeMarsan/MirageF1CT-330AP-227-2.jpg

 

Jay

 

 

 

 

 

Jay,

 

I've just taken a look at the kit without comparing it to the photo and it's obvious that the inboard section of the wing leading edge between the dog-tooth and the fuselage is quite blunt, the outboard section is fine by comparison.

 

Once you compare it to the photo it's glaringly obvious, not sure how to tackle that, I might scrape it so its a bit sharper then blend it in by careful sanding.  Thanks for the heads up.

 

Nice photo in the link BTW.

 

[Cookenbacher]

Andrew, your thread continues to be a treasure trove of information to this Mirage newby. Not the least of which, is to remember nose weight!

 

My current plan is to attach a nose half to the side with the best fit, then put the fuselage halves together, and finally attach the other nose half. I learned this process over the last couple of years building Griffon engined Spitfires with Merlin engined kits, and it seems the best for getting everything lined up.

[Andrew]

10 hours ago, Wez said:

Thanks Andrew, some good gen there.

 

Jay had mentioned the wing in his F1B thread, I was thinking of taking the excess from the top surface of the lower wing insert, would this work?

 

That big old drop tank will hide some of the lost detail.

 

Yes, that's what I did - take a lot from both of the mating surfaces of the upper and lower wings and then take a bit more... Obviously it's difficult to remove much from the inner surface of the upper wing, but do what you can - I took to mine with a steel scratch pen, convinced that there was an excess of plastic built up around the ejector pin marks to cause the lower wing piece to sit so proud, but in reality there wasn't that much.

 

10 hours ago, Mountain goat said:

 

Indeed I just did exactly that with the current F1C I'm doing. Works well. Indeed you lose all the detail, but there's not that much to begin with. 

 

The area of the bottom near the leading edge of the inner part of the wing, ie between the dogtooth and fuselage, is quite a bother though. That area needs particular sanding down and viewed from front could also do with a sharper edge. Additionally the edge should sit higher than the original SH part - - I'm not making much sense am I? Look at the area dogtooth-fuselage and compare with kit:

 

http://www.hottail.nl/basevisits/2005/0611-Cazaux/Images/France-MontDeMarsan/MirageF1CT-330AP-227-2.jpg

 

Jay

 

Another good point Jay. I found exactly the same thing and have cleaned up the mould line on the inboard portion of the wing leading edge but not yet addressed the sharpness of the edge or the height of that edge (I understood exactly what you meant having seen it first-hand). When the time comes, I think I'll be grinding away some material from the underside of the leading edge to both thin the appearance and lift the height of the edge.

 

2 hours ago, Cookenbacher said:

Andrew, your thread continues to be a treasure trove of information to this Mirage newby. Not the least of which, is to remember nose weight!

 

My current plan is to attach a nose half to the side with the best fit, then put the fuselage halves together, and finally attach the other nose half. I learned this process over the last couple of years building Griffon engined Spitfires with Merlin engined kits, and it seems the best for getting everything lined up.

 

Cookie, it's my pleasure to help where possible. I like your thinking about joining respective halves together - I'm keen to see how it goes for you. I should have been more prepared to follow this process with this kit given the experience I have with Hasegawa's family of F-4 Phantom kits.

 

Thanks again to everyone for your interest and insights.

[Romeo Alpha Yankee]

This is a nice detailed build thread, I am sort of glad I did not end up getting any of these.

 

Let me add that it looks like you are beating these kits into submission nicely Andrew! 

 

I have the Hasegawa single seater and Heller twin seater lurking in the stash in 1/72 (they make an appearance if I get my Mirage III builds finished).