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hurries night fighter:how many black spin ?


Davide Calzolari

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In World War 1 the squadrons used shapes painted on their aeroplanes to show which squadron they were; some used circles, squares, lines, etcetera.

85 squadron used a hexagon and always used it up until they were disbanded

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thnx so much-i'm doing the 48sc revell(hasegwa)kit of hurri mk II and i've modified it in night hurri, ive yet glued the spin to fuselage and it's for me more simply make all..black..spin included 

Edited by Davide Calzolari
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A further small point on the hexagon marking.

 

James Goulding writes that the marking was used by 85 Squadron in France in 1939-40.  The French not being au fait with squadron code letters, 60 Wing (85 and 87 Squadrons) removed them and were given permission to substitute a device.  85 naturally opted to resurrect the hexagon.  The A Flight presentation was point up, and B Flight on the flat.

 

I'm not sure how long that (meaning the flight differentiation) lasted but it is the sort of tidbit that keeps modellers up at night.

Edited by RJP
amended for clarity
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18 hours ago, italian intruder said:

9s5ax0.jpg

 

 

was more typical the red spin or the black spin?and the stylized exagon wich meaning   has ?

 

 

 

usually black, red in  few cases, eg 87 Squadron.

 

pic above warbird

real thing, a Mk.I

hemm4.htm.JPG

large.jpg

 

 

 

18 hours ago, italian intruder said:

208ehq1.jpg  again

 

bad profile, all the  specific details are wrong roundel, code letters, fin flash : :fraidnot: 

Hurricane_IIC_247_Sqn_RAF_in_flight_c194

 

 

d2f0ce30bd9db91fab38d1ec22d72acd.jpg

 

 

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On 6/10/2017 at 8:37 PM, italian intruder said:

9s5ax0.jpg

 

 

Very nice and useful photo there! I'm building the Revell Hurricane as LF363 in this scheme. I like the way you can still make out the GN-A codes from the previous colour scheme.

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Quite right, Hurricanes were used in the night role early on, including the Mk I (8 guns) and also the Mk IIB with twelve, all .303.  

 

James Goulding's Camouflage and Markings No 3 - an excellent reference - illustrates an 85 Sqn machine and also has a photograph of a IIB.  The overall black finish didn't come into use until late 1940 and any used prior to that were in standard day colours.

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On 11/6/2017 at 15:09, Troy Smith said:

 

usually black, red in  few cases, eg 87 Squadron.

 

pic above warbird

 

real thing, a Mk.I  

 

 

hemm4.htm.JPG

large.jpg

 

 

 

Mk.I above

 

5 hours ago, italian intruder said:

ciao fightersweep:

 

a fast question (for everyone)

 

night black painted hurries were always mk II version with 4 x 20 mm guns or exixted even some all-black night hurri mk I with 8 x 7,7 guns?

Mk.I, IIA, IIB, all used

 

Ian Gleed's Mk.I

Gleed%20Hurri%20nightfghter_zpskyhb6ejc.

 

 

 

famous shot of 87 Sq after they got intruder camo (note paint flaking on LK-A  wing)  so were all black before this

 

LK-T is a IIA with 8 gun wing 

 

hurricane_87sqn.jpg

 

Hurricane Mk IIB night fighters code SW-S Samasthans II of No 253 Squadron RAF lined up at Hibaldstow

de56cdebd617fc61ebc994fe138d1ce9.jpg

 

486 sq IIA or IIB

Hurricane_night_fighters,_486_Squadron.J

 

30 Squadron RAF's Hawker Hurricane Mark Is “H” nearest) at Idku, Egypt, employed as night fighters 

4cc8828557364e6208e7a744a256bd91.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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4 hours ago, RJP said:

Quite right, Hurricanes were used in the night role early on, including the Mk I (8 guns) and also the Mk IIB with twelve, all .303.  

 

James Goulding's Camouflage and Markings No 3 - an excellent reference - illustrates an 85 Sqn machine and also has a photograph of a IIB.  The overall black finish didn't come into use until late 1940 and any used prior to that were in standard day colours.

 

Indeed, as these are available here

 

http://www.boxartden.com/gallery/index.php/Profiles/Camoflage-Markings/03-Hawker-Hurricane

 

here's the relevant bits for ease of reference

 

Hawker%20Hurricane%20Camo%20&%20Marks_Pa

 

Hawker%20Hurricane%20Camo%20&%20Marks_Pa

 

 

Hawker%20Hurricane%20Camo%20&%20Marks_Pa

 

Note comments on 87 sq intruder camo, and compare to photo  below

hurricane_87sqn.jpg

 

 

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  • 1 year later...

Hi...a question:what exhaust type are installed on VY X MKI Hurricane?On the web I found another serial:P3118 not LF 363 ....and what about the spinner?It's seam a Dh one's.....and the oil ring?.....can someone help me??Thanks in advice Enrico.

https://www.worldwarphotos.info/gallery/uk/raf/hurricane2/hurricane-mk-i-vy-x-p3118/

Edited by Enrywar67
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In the photo of VY.X above the propeller roots are thick, therefore this is a Rotol prop.  It appears to be the late "bullet"-shaped one that became standardised, but was not common on Mk.Is.  Yes to oil ring.  There will have been a lot of VY. aircraft coded X, with a range of serials.  X is the individual identifier within the squadron, and as an aircraft was replaced or lost a new one would gain the X.

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From that lower photo, I'm not convinced it is either.  LF363 is a surviving Hurricane Mk.II in the Battle of Britain Memorial Flight, so not the original in the photo.  P3118 is an early serial, aircraft in RAF use from April/May 1940, so it is possible but it would imply a long time with the same unit, or perhaps a recycled example.

 

The upper of the two photos, which I admit not studying previously, appears to be fitted with the earlier Rotol spinner, originally intended for Spitfires and wider in diameter and blunter than the later spinner.  The photos of Mk.I LK.A in black show this early spinner, the one below it of Mk.II LK.A in camouflage shows the later spinner.  The 30 Sq photo shows aircraft H with the DH spinner and propeller, the aircraft behind has the later Rotol.

 

The exhaust on VY.X appears to be a variant not seen elsewhere, but it is not a good angle to judge from.

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Probably neither, but in the maintenance unit that fitted the assembled but unfitted machine with its armament, radio, and other service equipment.  I don't recall seeing any photo of a Hurricane off the assembly line in Night camouflage, but I wouldn't rule it out completely.  Certainly Supermarine, later in the war, were complaining about the excessive variety of camouflage schemes that were being demanded, and their adverse effect on production rates, so this suggests that it was possible that Hawkers could have been tasked with one or more runs of Night aircraft.

 

When initially the squadrons were moved from day operations to night work, then their aircraft would have been painted on the unit (or so it seems to me), but this would necessarily have been a botch job as there would be no spray guns available at this time.  However a blotchy appearance in a photo could well be due to the shortcomings of the highly matt Special Night paint (RDM2 and 2A).  A smooth finish, such as those in the Hurricanes in Egypt, strongly hints at an MU job.

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On 6/12/2017 at 11:27 PM, RJP said:

Quite right, Hurricanes were used in the night role early on, including the Mk I (8 guns) and also the Mk IIB with twelve, all .303.  

 

James Goulding's Camouflage and Markings No 3 - an excellent reference - illustrates an 85 Sqn machine and also has a photograph of a IIB.  The overall black finish didn't come into use until late 1940 and any used prior to that were in standard day colours.

Twelve .303 guns? That was news for me. I newer seen or noticed an Hurricane with more than eight guns. But maybe I didn't count the guns...

 

What I understand would the new 1/72 metall winged Hurricane Mk.I be good as an nightfighter as well?

 

Is there any manufacture making an twelve gunned Mk.IIB in 1/72?

 

Cheers / André

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