speedbird Posted May 7, 2017 Share Posted May 7, 2017 Hey up....any F-4 Phantom or more specifically, Israeli Air Force Phantom experts able to recommend a 72nd scale decals sheet for an early Israeli F-4? I was thinking of using the old decals from the old Airfix kit but to be honest they look a bit boring. Were early Israeli phantoms really that boring and are the Airfix decals are authentic? If they are indeed accurate what unit and time period do they represent? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antoine Posted May 7, 2017 Share Posted May 7, 2017 Hi, ??? Forget about airfix decals. Hi Decal will do, nice and cheap, covering most squadrons but not before the war of 1973. But still you can use them for an early phantom from 1969/70 during the Attrition war. The other option is Isradecal, very nice but expensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedbird Posted May 7, 2017 Author Share Posted May 7, 2017 OUCH!!!! expensive indeed.... so what exactly is wrong with the Airfix decals? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainpeden Posted May 7, 2017 Share Posted May 7, 2017 They would probably fall apart when you introduce them to water. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedbird Posted May 7, 2017 Author Share Posted May 7, 2017 They're from a later boxing and look ok, they haven't any signs of yellowing.. I'm more concerned about their authenticity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antoine Posted May 7, 2017 Share Posted May 7, 2017 38 minutes ago, speedbird said: They're from a later boxing Ok, but which one? Can't even remember any F-4E from airfix. Any picture of the sheet, or the box? Whatever, they must be too old to be accurate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Smith Posted May 7, 2017 Share Posted May 7, 2017 this one Given it's a red stripe kit, it's late 60's/early 70's and the Phantom was then very much state of the art for the Israeli's, and they were pretty security concious, so pics were vetted, if not censored. Some units have coloured tails, the Hi-decal has some of these. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oliver d Posted May 7, 2017 Share Posted May 7, 2017 Okay first off the Airfix decals show a non existing squadron,secondly the Isradecal set is for phantoms from 73 onwards until there retirement in the early 90s.I think your best opption would be to try the Hi-decal ones.Just to add the coloured tails only came about in the 82 Lebanon war and latter. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainpeden Posted May 7, 2017 Share Posted May 7, 2017 You also need to check if your choice of a/c has unslatted or slatted wings - the Airfix one is unslatted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedbird Posted May 7, 2017 Author Share Posted May 7, 2017 This kit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedbird Posted May 7, 2017 Author Share Posted May 7, 2017 These are the decals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedbird Posted May 7, 2017 Author Share Posted May 7, 2017 (edited) The kit I'm using is the Bilek kit which is I think the Testors/Italeri F-4/E/F/G Wild Weasel kit and it does have the leading edge slats...I was really hoping to do an F-4 from the Yom Kippur war Edited May 7, 2017 by speedbird Predictive text misbehaving Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antoine Posted May 8, 2017 Share Posted May 8, 2017 They doesn't look so bad, but I'm surprised by your choices, kit & decals, if your concern is accuracy. better go for any Hasegawa F-4E, together with the Hi Decal sheet. then you'll need some weapons, AIM-9D, AIM-7E, M117, ALQ-xxx, etc.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedbird Posted May 8, 2017 Author Share Posted May 8, 2017 I was originally going to go with airfix kit, built as an E but after being advised against it on the grounds that the airfix kit can't really be built as an E, I went for a cheap kit that could be built to represent one...once that was decided I still intended using the Airfix decals but as they are fictitious, I'm now looking for alternative Israeli markings. It's turning out to be a bit of a struggle as I wanted to build it to represent an aircraft from the Yom Kippur war.. as for the airfix kit, that's now in line to be finished as an F-4B from the sundowners.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antoine Posted May 8, 2017 Share Posted May 8, 2017 Well, whatever, all your questions are answered, and the choice is yours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hook Posted May 8, 2017 Share Posted May 8, 2017 14 hours ago, iainpeden said: You also need to check if your choice of a/c has unslatted or slatted wings - the Airfix one is unslatted. And thin. Cheers, Andre Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DennisTheBear Posted May 8, 2017 Share Posted May 8, 2017 There is the old Microscale 72-106 decal set which includes a Phantom, also includes a Skyhawk and a Mirage. Can't vouch for accuracy or period of the markings. Have this set in my stash. DennisTheBear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedbird Posted May 9, 2017 Author Share Posted May 9, 2017 Bet they're rare has hens teeth too.. incidentally, would the early Israeli f4 from the Yom Kippur period have the long or short nose fairing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giorgio N Posted May 9, 2017 Share Posted May 9, 2017 2 minutes ago, speedbird said: Bet they're rare has hens teeth too.. incidentally, would the early Israeli f4 from the Yom Kippur period have the long or short nose fairing? Both short and long fairings were seen on Phantoms during the 1973 war. Speaking of slats, a number of Israeli Phantoms had slatted wings during the war, as part of the aicrafts delivered through the Peace Echo IV program were in Israel before the war started and all the aircrafts from this contract had slatted wings. Then there's 187... this was an aicraft used to test a configuration with fixed leading edge slats and served during the war. The configuration was non standard so I don't know what kind of modifications would be needed to reproduce this aircraft. Decals: there is another option that may or not be easy: the Esci 1/72 kit included decals for aircraft 618. This was one of the original aircrafts supplied under Peace Echo I in 1969. As such had no slats and the short gun fairing. The aircraft served during the Kippur War when was badly damaged by Syrian flak. The crew managed to fly the crippled aircraft over Israeli waters and then ejected, being picked up by friendly SAR soon after. The problem with these decals is that they don't represent a slatted aircraft. In any case Israeli aircrafts had very little in way of markings, just national markings, the unit insignia and the individual numbers, once you have the national markings and a proper squadron insignia, you only need the number for a slatted aircraft and these can at worst be printed at home. It may be difficult though to find out which aircraft served in which squadron, as Israeli censorship has long been very tight on this kind of information. The other potential problem with Esci decals of that vintage is that they may disintegrate as soon as they touch water... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giorgio N Posted May 9, 2017 Share Posted May 9, 2017 Forgot to add: early Israeli Phantoms had standard USAF stencilling in English. Later the Phantom fleet adopted Hebrew stencils. Regarding 618 of the Esci decal sheet, this belonged to the One Squadron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedbird Posted May 9, 2017 Author Share Posted May 9, 2017 (edited) So basically I need to find some decals first then decide which one to build? Edited May 9, 2017 by speedbird Bad speeling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainpeden Posted May 10, 2017 Share Posted May 10, 2017 Speed bird, I think I may have some spare Israeli decals in the spares box. Give me a couple of days to check the boxes. By the way, if the kit you have is a repop of the Italeri one and you don't want perfection - which given every phantom was hand built and therefore different to the point the wings off one could not be guaranteed to fit another one - is a bit subjective anyway it will look fine when finished. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hook Posted May 11, 2017 Share Posted May 11, 2017 On 2017-5-8 at 7:55 AM, speedbird said: It's turning out to be a bit of a struggle as I wanted to build it to represent an aircraft from the Yom Kippur war.. I could send you some spare unslatted outer wing panels from a RoG F-4F. You could simply cut off the slatted Italeri / Bilek wing portion. Presto - unslatted Yom Kippur F-4E. Cheers, Andre Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainpeden Posted May 11, 2017 Share Posted May 11, 2017 Hi Mike I have found the remains of a Cutting Edge decal sheet with some numbers and a few squadron badges on. I can copy the intructions - which includes slatted and unslatted a/c as wel as one in SEA camo rather than the usual sand/brown/green. I also have a few old Esci sheets with Israeli stars on. I'll give them a few coats of decal film before I send them but try out some of the spare stuff on the sheet first as it would be a shame if the decals disintegrate on dipping in water. I've still got your address in my message box so just let me know and I'll post ithe stuff. Iain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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