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      Ongoing DDoS Attack causing Forum Slowness   26/04/17

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44 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

I'm planning to build an aggressor A-4, options are classic airframes, monogram, italeri and hobbycraft.  Just wanted opinions on which kit builds up best, detail and accuracy wise.

Edited by Blitz23
Speling

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There's two other options, Hasegawa and Ed's rebox of Hasegawa.

And both are winners by far against all the others.

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Forget all of the above and hunt down a Hasegawa kit on evilbay or failing that a 

earlier boxing of the Esci kit

Back when I was on 724 Squadron I did a roaring trade building the Esci kit for Scooter drivers

from VC724 & VF 805, buy for 10 bucks at the canteen flog em for thirty. Kept me in beer tickets :)

The Italeri kit is a rebox of the Esci but those molds would be getting pretty tired by now.

The CA kit is a T bird and far too much work for what it is.

The Monogram kit was garbage when it came out, riddled with errors and poor fit.

The Hobbycraft kit is could have been good but isnt, the earlier marks are let down by the fuselage

being made at the width of the big canopied A-4M/N and ending up being too wide with a squashed 

canopy made to fit.

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Hasegawa is the best by far. But if you don't want to spend that much, having built all of them, I would put them in the following order (best to worst):
* Hobbycraft (easy to build and quite accurate)
* Classic Airframes (more demanding to build but also accurate and slightly more detailed)
* Monogram (nice one, belonging to a different era. Raised details and some building skills will be required to get it done)
* Italeri (hated it. Engraved details in the fuselage, raised on the wings. Bad bad bad!)

 

Something to get you inspired:

 

This is the Hobycraft example...

israeli_skyhawk_a-4h_1_of_5.jpg

 

This is Hasegawa:

10703846_453739328097277_451537468815112

 

...and this is monogram:

11053564_540395742764968_847953195309149

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FYI, Pro-Modeller also re-issued the standard HAS A-4E/F som years ago in the Blue Angels boxing. 

Which adversary are you planning to build? 

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8 hours ago, DIO said:

Hasegawa is the best by far. But if you don't want to spend that much, having built all of them, I would put them in the following order (best to worst):
* Hobbycraft (easy to build and quite accurate)
* Classic Airframes (more demanding to build but also accurate and slightly more detailed)
* Monogram (nice one, belonging to a different era. Raised details and some building skills will be required to get it done)
* Italeri (hated it. Engraved details in the fuselage, raised on the wings. Bad bad bad!)

 

Something to get you inspired:

 

This is the Hobycraft example...

 

 

This is Hasegawa:

 

 

...and this is monogram:

 

Question

Have you actually seen an A-4?

I ask because you've described the Hobbycraft kit as quite accurate yet even in your build the odd shaped canopy and windscreen are glaringly obvious

Fuel probe way undersize, landing gear fairings aft of the gear mounts are dead flat, detail is typical hobbycraft Best thing about these kits were the weapons

and decals.

The Monogram single seater has a canopy almost as bad as Hobbycraft plus the landing gear is bodge, main wheels are too large nose wheel is way undersize

and the general detail on the gear legs is overstated. The OA-4M is a bit better but as it shares a lot of parts with the A bird it suffers greatly

 

Just for reference. The arrestor hook sits on the ground when its dropped,but only until the strap got put on it, the rudder will migrate back to the centre position

and I hope youve got ground locks in the speed brakes, safety first.

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Posted (edited)

I do not respond to people that are aggressive. Feel happy with yourself...

Edited by DIO

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8 hours ago, DIO said:

Hasegawa is the best by far. But if you don't want to spend that much, having built all of them, I would put them in the following order (best to worst):
* Hobbycraft (easy to build and quite accurate)
* Classic Airframes (more demanding to build but also accurate and slightly more detailed)
* Monogram (nice one, belonging to a different era. Raised details and some building skills will be required to get it done)
* Italeri (hated it. Engraved details in the fuselage, raised on the wings. Bad bad bad!)

 

Something to get you inspired:

 

This is the Hobycraft example...

 

 

This is Hasegawa:

 

 

...and this is monogram:

 

Can't say I know the technical aspects of a real A-4 but I do know a nicely made model when I see one (or more). They all look very nicely made and painted to me, even if they don't have the exact number of rivets in place.

 

Duncan B (now about that odd panel on the back end of the Zoukei Mura Phantom :suicide:)

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Posted (edited)

4 hours ago, DIO said:

I do not respond to people that are aggressive. Feel happy with yourself...

Aggressive got nowt to do with it mate. your the one that came in (in two separate threads) determined to prove me wrong.

Big difference between looking at one on a computer screen or a book and hands on experience on the real thing.

Had you bothered to ask instead of showing how much more clever you are I'd opened my A-4

library in an instant, as I usually do.

I'm quite happy with myself, I think my record for assisting others on this site speaks for itself.

Good day to you.

 

Edited by NAVY870
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I thought you both "violently" agreed that Hasegawa is the way to go but due to cost some other options were provided and buildexamples??  As a subtext for a "6ft view" modeler like me the advice was excellent (I was looking for a 1/48 one myself) and for a non-Skyhawk ninja the images are inspiring but also total respect for those with amazing hands-on experience.

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34 minutes ago, BristolBlue said:

I thought you both "violently" agreed that Hasegawa is the way to go but due to cost some other options were provided and buildexamples??  As a subtext for a "6ft view" modeler like me the advice was excellent (I was looking for a 1/48 one myself) and for a non-Skyhawk ninja the images are inspiring but also total respect for those with amazing hands-on experience.

 

 

Well, happy we managed to help, even in this very super extream way lol lol lol.

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Now Hobby Boss is coming out with an A-4E too. How it will be in the A-4 kit rating list I'm not sure. Will be tough for it to replace the Hasegawa one for me. Initial images show molded on slats/flaps and like Hasegawa's kit has the same solid tire/gear nose landing gear.

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35 minutes ago, ziggyfoos said:

Now Hobby Boss is coming out with an A-4E too. How it will be in the A-4 kit rating list I'm not sure. Will be tough for it to replace the Hasegawa one for me. Initial images show molded on slats/flaps and like Hasegawa's kit has the same solid tire/gear nose landing gear.

 

 

...plus a couple more other issues... This will not be a Hasegawa killer, but a relatively good alternative, as all the other examples are either old or not good enough.

 

On the other hand, the small parts number will make it good for starters, or for the in-flight-canopy-closed type of modelers lol lol lol.

 

 

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If I were looking for help on the accuracy of an A-4 kit, Steve would be the first person I'd check with. Your A-4s are very nice, DIO, but as you commented on accuracy, I think that Steve was right in making his comments about the accuracy of the kit(s). Steve is very generous of his time an resources when it comes to A-4s and all things RAN. 

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Stay cool, fellas, or it's goooonna hurt... :bleh: Hi, Don, my good mate! :bye: How's it going, luv?

 

Well, I've had the Esci, Fujimi and Monogram Scooters, and forgot about all of them after I built my first Hasegawa Skyhawk (a -B and a -C). They're like day and night by comparison. Very nice kits, a tad on the expensive side of the scale, though, by comparison once again.

Now, had I to choose another kit manufacturer to build a Scooter in 1/48, I'd pick the Monogram kits because the wing and fuselage closely match the shape and dimensions on the Hasegawa kits (this was done by enlarging the decal instruction sheet on the Hasegawa assembling instructions itself to 1/48 - both the side profiles and top/bottom ones - to then place both the Hasegawa and Monogram fuselage halves and wings over them. They both match perfectly).

Of course, one is to resort to the Brassin wheels set, Falcon/Squadron vac-form canopy and so on in order to build a decent replica out of the Monogram kits.

The Fujimi Scooters in 1/48 are awfully wrong from the cockpit aft, so forget about them. They're actually 1/50, but the nose and cockpit are strangely 1/48. :hmmm:

A whole lifetime ago I got an old Esci 1/48 A-4M/N kit which has the A-4B/E sort of windshield on it. It's still somewhere in the stash (or forgotten in the battlefield?), but if I recall correctly, the only thing which bothered me about that kit was the kind of plastic in which it had been moulded - too grainy.  

Could any expert on the Scooter please tell me what's wrong about the Esci kits? How about shapes and dimensions?

Cheers,

 

Unc2

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Posted (edited)

8 hours ago, Don McIntyre said:

If I were looking for help on the accuracy of an A-4 kit, Steve would be the first person I'd check with. Your A-4s are very nice, DIO, but as you commented on accuracy, I think that Steve was right in making his comments about the accuracy of the kit(s). Steve is very generous of his time an resources when it comes to A-4s and all things RAN. 

 

Nevertheless, I have the right to add my own comments and opinion as well, or am I wrong to think so? I don't mind being critiqued, but when done in an aggressive tone, I prefer to not respond.

(By the way, I said "quite accurate" not "accurate" and if my English is not letting me down, those are different)

 

Accuracy is one thing, rivet counting another. We do not all expect the same from our models.

Edited by DIO

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Looking at pics if you want to do one in flight with slats retracted the new Hobbyboss kit will be excellent. Far less work than blending those Hasegawa slats into the leading edge. For parked id still go Hasegawa...all the kits you listed need work of some shape ie rescribing etc.

Accuracy it really depends how serious you are about it...seen some nice looking Hobbycraft builds but really ifyou can save yiurself the work and grab a Hasegawa kit.

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Posted (edited)

15 hours ago, Don McIntyre said:

If I were looking for help on the accuracy of an A-4 kit, Steve would be the first person I'd check with. Your A-4s are very nice, DIO, but as you commented on accuracy, I think that Steve was right in making his comments about the accuracy of the kit(s). Steve is very generous of his time an resources when it comes to A-4s and all things RAN. 

Thanks Don, I very much appreciate that mate.

7 hours ago, DIO said:

 

 I don't mind being critiqued, but when done in an aggressive tone, I prefer to not respond.

I'd suggest your not fond of being critqued at all, given your responses. However any aggressive tone is what your

reading in to it, it is after all the written word on a screen.

If you have a problem with me then there is a message function on this site where your more than welcome to take me to task.

 

Now if we can put the long range urinating contest to bed I have a suggestion.

When I get 5 minutes I will venture down to Nowra and run a knotted string over my lovely lady friend here

_1079408_zpsr7hz05bx.jpg

(Truth be told I preferred her sister but some idiot Kiwi dumped her in the Indian Ocean)

Nowra also has an A bird in the collection, its a B model with an F nose glued on but all the important bits are there.

I will then lay out all the relevant parts of the previously mentioned kits (except the Fujimi thing, nobody needs to see that)

and do a comparison between the various kits and the relevant dimensions from 880 and 882 (the second)

Thoughts?

Edited by NAVY870
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Heres the sister

N13-154912 881, first one I flew in and "My" Skyhawk

 

Skyhawk_881_Photo_via_Dave_Masterson_b_z

An absolute bad girl this one was, quite the looker though.

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Posted (edited)

12 hours ago, Uncle Uncool said:

 

Could any expert on the Scooter please tell me what's wrong about the Esci kits? How about shapes and dimensions?

Unc2

Shape wise and dimensionally its bang on.

The cockpit is poor, being both poorly detailed (decal instrument panel and consoles) and undersize

Fuselage has reasonable detail though a bit sparce, wings need a bit of a rescribe and can be flimsy.

Gear well detail is basic, gear itself is fine though the nose gear only has a snubber fitted and not the later

NWS so all you can build is an early A-4E. No squat switch on the port main gear.

Weapo racks are ok, the MER for the centreline is pants. Charlie tanks are good but need filler caps

You get a set of Mark 82's that arent too bad as are the set of ZUNI's

The A-4M/N kit you mentioned isnt either of those marks, missing the larger canopy big bore intakes

internal starter exhaust and a few other bits.

What it is though is a nice little A-4K with the hump and square fin tip.

What I've done with a few of my Esci kit is use the E/F left overs that come out of the short nosed Hasegawa kits

and dropped in E/F cockpits that I've replaced with Aires pits.

I would stay far away from the Italeri reboxes though as the mold is, as I noted above wel and truely flogged out.

Go for the early Esci boxing with the aircraft framed in a gunsight reticule.

1 minute ago, NAVY870 said:

 

 

Edited by NAVY870

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6 hours ago, NAVY870 said:

I will then lay out all the relevant parts of the previously mentioned kits (except the Fujimi thing, nobody needs to see that)

and do a comparison between the various kits and the relevant dimensions from 880 and 882 (the second)

Thoughts?

 

Yes, P*L*E*A*S*E!, Steve. That'd be such a blast!

Incidentally, have you ever seen the list on the Jet Aircraft Kit Tweak section regarding the Hasegawa Scooters on Zone Five?

It'd be quite interesting to know what your thoughts are about it.

 

1 hour ago, NAVY870 said:

Shape wise and dimensionally its bang on.

I would stay far away from the Italeri reboxes though as the mold is, as I noted above wel and truely flogged out.

Go for the early Esci boxing with the aircraft framed in a gunsight reticule.

 

Good to know; thanks! The Esci boxing I got is the Esci/Ertl one, which hasn't got the gunsight reticule on it:

 

4016.jpg

 

Is it the same kit? Fortunately for me, I'll backdate it to either an A-4Q or an A-4P. It's good to have learnt that the Aires cockpit could be grafted onto it.

Cheers,

 

Unc2

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Posted (edited)

16 hours ago, Uncle Uncool said:

 

Yes, P*L*E*A*S*E!, Steve. That'd be such a blast!

Incidentally, have you ever seen the list on the Jet Aircraft Kit Tweak section regarding the Hasegawa Scooters on Zone Five?

It'd be quite interesting to know what your thoughts are about it.

 

 

Good to know; thanks! The Esci boxing I got is the Esci/Ertl one, which hasn't got the gunsight reticule on it:

 

4016.jpg

 

Is it the same kit? Fortunately for me, I'll backdate it to either an A-4Q or an A-4P. It's good to have learnt that the Aires cockpit could be grafted onto it.

Cheers,

 

Unc2

The zone 5 list is quite good, Calumn Gibson worked on the same aeroplanes I did

I hadnt noticed the slightly pudgy fin buts its not a show stopper for me.

The step in the wing where the slat sits when retracted is a fault of all A-4 kits (with extended slats)

not just Hasegawa.

If your going to backdate the Esci kit to a P or Q you'll need a short nose, new intakes change a lot of panel work

on the forward fuselage and add the various antennaes that the Argies glued on.

I may have a short nose from a Hobbycraft kit in the junk box, you can have it if I can find it.

 

 

Just noticed this is my 870th post, bit of a personal milestone :)

 

Edited by NAVY870

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4 hours ago, NAVY870 said:

The step in the wing where the slat sits when retracted is a fault of all A-4 kits (with extended slats)

not just Hasegawa.

 

Except Classic Airframes' TA-4!

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1 hour ago, gingerbob said:

 

Except Classic Airframes' TA-4!

Correct

 

Now to sneak back and edit my comment to"almost all" before anyone notices :) 

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16 hours ago, NAVY870 said:

Correct

 

Now to sneak back and edit my comment to"almost all" before anyone notices :) 

 

 

Ah! I just missed the chance to prove you wrong! (note: this is a joke!)

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