KI 61 interior colour

[Nick Millman]

1 hour ago, Troy Smith said:

HI Nick (or anyone)

 

Just to clarify,  RAL6003 is a similar colour for  the overall exterior colour of the Ki-100?  

 

Thanks

T

 

No, just the propeller blades! To make it clearer I should have written:-

 

". . . go for the Ki-100 propeller colour which is similar to FS 34082 and RAL 6003 (Revell 361)."

 

Nick

[Seawinder]

21 hours ago, Nick Millman said:

 

The question was about propeller blades and not spinners. Although # 7 was supposed to be applied to the whole prop the blades on some late war types were painted a different green. This has been well known by modellers in the case of Hayate but not for some other types. The reason for this and the precise changeover is not known. The green colour mentioned was reported for Ki-84, Ki-87, Ki-43-III, Ki-94, Ki-100, Ki-102 and Ki-106 but not specifically for Ki-61-II. However, the Ki-61-II and Ki-100 props were both made at the Sumitomo Tsu plant and shipped to Kagamigahara Army Air Arsenal rather than direct to the aircraft manufacturers, hence my suggestion of there being a choice regarding the colour of the II Kai prop blades.

 

The point about what people expect to see is still valid. To some the green blades on a II Kai would look "wrong".

 

Nick     

Yes, I understand it was about blades. I still thought there wasn't certainty about whether Ki-100 prop blades were brown or green.

[Nick Millman]

4 hours ago, Seawinder said:

Yes, I understand it was about blades. I still thought there wasn't certainty about whether Ki-100 prop blades were brown or green.

 

Well, as previously stated, the UofI Ki-100 seemed to have a dark brown prop but I was providing the green hue data as a choice from the reporting of green, not mandating against a possibility of brown! 

 

Nick

[Jon Kunac-Tabinor]

Hi Nick - my MYK decals for the Tei just arrived, and looking at their side views they seem to show the  #7 yellow-green top colour wrapping around onto the leading edges of the undersurfaces of the wings too.  Thats not something I've seen in the profiles in your 'aces" book.  Any thoughts?

 

Jonners, currently perusing his range of olive/brown hues for a good match....

[Nick Millman]

4 hours ago, Jon Kunac-Tabinor said:

Hi Nick - my MYK decals for the Tei just arrived, and looking at their side views they seem to show the  #7 yellow-green top colour wrapping around onto the leading edges of the undersurfaces of the wings too.  Thats not something I've seen in the profiles in your 'aces" book.  Any thoughts?

 

Jonners, currently perusing his range of olive/brown hues for a good match....

 

The wrap around on the leading edges tends to be more typical of depot or unit painted aircraft delivered in natural metal than the factory-finished aircraft where the demarcation is along the leading edge. But it was evidently not a standardised demarcation as photos show it at both the mid-point and slightly lower (but not wrap around). This difference between non-factory and factory is illustrated by the photos on pages 73 and 74 of the Osprey book (the post-factory painted aircraft also have natural metal canopy framing, dark brown spinners and anti-glare panels on the cowlings). But the photos were reproduced smaller than I would have liked and these detail differences are therefore difficult to see. The one on page 74 is a factory-finished Tei, despite the caption! The original image shows clearly the spinner painted in the exterior colour and the prop blades still dark brown with the spinner overspray visible on the blade roots.

 

I also checked the factory schematic for the Tei and there is no sign of a wrap around on the lower wings. The upper surface colour extends to the radiator sides and there is no anti-glare.

 

Don't miss that the exhaust shroud on the # 7 Tei was painted black including the panel behind the front teardrop - and not matt but a more satin finish - with the aircraft serial stencilled on the teardrop in yellow. This detail often gets missed off even celebrity modeller's show stoppers! 

 

Nick

[politicni komisar]

Hi Nick and other I'm studying Japanese aircraft over the years I was with the help of resources Nikolas Millman, Ian.k.Baker and different sources and images on the Internet .

the colors are mostly their base or Italian German and French course of their licensed copies of proxies so as to find the basic Nature around very close to the original example Enamel paints WEM have enabled a range that satisfies Kit Builder .

Ever since it emerged from the Slovak manufacturer MrPAINT has a very wide range and will soon also Japan palette of paint from WWII.
now to find and I am sure that these two paint .

To start a my  collection of Ki-61 Tony,, Build it from my stash.

 

Kawasaki interior color  RAL 7028   im sure that the color of the nearest sample.

MRP-37 : Dk brovn RAL 7028

 

Kawasaki camo  Olive green RAL 6003

MRP-35 Olive green 6003

www.mrpaint.sk

 

Greetings to plastic  kit bulding comrades 1

 

P.k

[Nick Millman]

RAL 7028 is no longer included in the RAL colour standard and I can't answer for it or the Mr Paint hobby paint shown above as a match to the Kawasaki interior colour as I've never analysed either. RAL 7028 has been reported as matching the Wehrmacht Dunkelgelb (Dark yellow) colour but there seems to be a lot of discussion, debate and controversy about the actual hue. Those who wish to explore that aspect further might start  here , where a rather dark greyish-green 1944 chip of 7028 is shown, and here. Many refer to RAL 7028 as Dunkelgelb but the official designation is asserted to be Boden grau (ground or soil grey) and this particular paint manufacturer attributes brownish looking "mushroom" greys which appear at odds with that 1944 chip:-

 

RAL 7028 

 

The RAL 7000 series are indeed greys although there are some quite brownish and yellowish looking greys amongst them. The problem with the Kawasaki interior colour is that it is not linked to a verifiable IJAAF colour standard (or to Dunkelgelb!) and one authoritative source in Japan asserts that it simply represents a degraded paint surface resulting from a photo-chemical colour shift of the standard Army Grey Green paint (as applied to exteriors). Another source references it as appearing similar to FS 33440 which has no equivalent RAL value. That would also be similar to the Army paint colour standard # 30 Karekusa iro - dry grass colour. As mentioned before the recent Aoshima kits suggest the grey-green for the Ki-61 cockpit interior whilst Tamiya sticks with the "traditional" yellowish brown.    

 

The Army dry grass colour is a mustard yellowish-brown colour with a slight greenish undertone. Humbrol 83 Matt Ochre is an approximate match but Humbrol 93 Matt Desert Yellow is also ok. Vallejo Model Color  978 Dark Yellow is an approximate match. All lack the slight greenish undertone but a dab of olive green can correct that. 

 

RAL 6003 looks like this:-

 

RAL 6003

 

That is approximate to the prop blade colour and not the camo colour. Revell 361 is matched to RAL 6003 and is quite close. The original exterior paint on the RAF Museum Ki-100 does not have a close or useful RAL equivalent. It is slightly lighter and greener than RAL 6014 Gelboliv (Yellow olive) which looks like this:-

 

RAL 6014

 

and a little browner (yellower) than FS 34083. But the # 7 paint on the Ki-100 - and other types - showed variance between manufacturers and batches, rather like US Olive Drab and weathering variously in much the same way. 

 

My humble suggestion is not to sweat this but to enjoy the interpretative choices and experiment with your favourite paints. 

 

 

Nick

 

[Seawinder]

6 hours ago, Nick Millman said:

RAL 7028 is no longer included in the RAL colour standard and I can't answer for it or the Mr Paint hobby paint shown above as a match to the Kawasaki interior colour as I've never analysed either. RAL 7028 has been reported as matching the Wehrmacht Dunkelgelb (Dark yellow) colour but there seems to be a lot of discussion, debate and controversy about the actual hue. Those who wish to explore that aspect further might start  here , where a rather dark greyish-green 1944 chip of 7028 is shown, and here. Many refer to RAL 7028 as Dunkelgelb but the official designation is asserted to be Boden grau (ground or soil grey) and this particular paint manufacturer attributes brownish looking "mushroom" greys which appear at odds with that 1944 chip:-

 

RAL 7028 

 

The RAL 7000 series are indeed greys although there are some quite brownish and yellowish looking greys amongst them. The problem with the Kawasaki interior colour is that it is not linked to a verifiable IJAAF colour standard (or to Dunkelgelb!) and one authoritative source in Japan asserts that it simply represents a degraded paint surface resulting from a photo-chemical colour shift of the standard Army Grey Green paint (as applied to exteriors). Another source references it as appearing similar to FS 33440 which has no equivalent RAL value. That would also be similar to the Army paint colour standard # 30 Karekusa iro - dry grass colour. As mentioned before the recent Aoshima kits suggest the grey-green for the Ki-61 cockpit interior whilst Tamiya sticks with the "traditional" yellowish brown.    

 

The Army dry grass colour is a mustard yellowish-brown colour with a slight greenish undertone. Humbrol 83 Matt Ochre is an approximate match but Humbrol 93 Matt Desert Yellow is also ok. Vallejo Model Color  978 Dark Yellow is an approximate match. All lack the slight greenish undertone but a dab of olive green can correct that. 

 

RAL 6003 looks like this:-

 

RAL 6003

 

That is approximate to the prop blade colour and not the camo colour. Revell 361 is matched to RAL 6003 and is quite close. The original exterior paint on the RAF Museum Ki-100 does not have a close or useful RAL equivalent. It is slightly lighter and greener than RAL 6014 Gelboliv (Yellow olive) which looks like this:-

 

RAL 6014

 

and a little browner (yellower) than FS 34083. But the # 7 paint on the Ki-100 - and other types - showed variance between manufacturers and batches, rather like US Olive Drab and weathering variously in much the same way. 

 

My humble suggestion is not to sweat this but to enjoy the interpretative choices and experiment with your favourite paints. 

 

 

Nick

 

From what you say, Nick, it sounds as if British Middle Stone might work as well, perhaps slightly darkened with some olive green?

[Nick Millman]

6 hours ago, Seawinder said:

From what you say, Nick, it sounds as if British Middle Stone might work as well, perhaps slightly darkened with some olive green?

 

Yes, it could do. Middle Stone is a bit "rich" so you would need to darken it a little and tone it down with the addition of some olive green or grey-green. The closest FS to Middle Stone is actually 10266 so you'd need to shift that appearance to be closer to FS 33440.

 

Regards

Nick