Murdo Posted April 18, 2017 Share Posted April 18, 2017 (edited) I agree with Dave, the binnacle ( a compass with dial ) should generally be in front of the wheel. It would at least need to be in a position where the compass dial and heading could be clearly seen by the helmsman. By the way, that "steam powered gramophone" in the photos looks like a scary piece of kit. Edited April 18, 2017 by Murdo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longshanks Posted April 18, 2017 Author Share Posted April 18, 2017 (edited) Dear Mr Swindell whilst you are entitled to your own opinion, you are not entitled to talk down to me!! 2 hours ago, Dave Swindell said: are you sure you've got the relative positions of the binnacle and wheel correct? An emphatic yes! 2 hours ago, Dave Swindell said: You've got the wheel hard up against the forward bulkhead and the binnacle directly behind the helmsman, it's neither use nor ornament there if you're trying to steer a compass bearing! You are talking total rubbish as your orientation is wrong. Aside from anything else I left the Merchant Navy as Chief Officer. I think I might remember which way to use a compass. You and Murdo have based your assumptions on the gearing for the transmission of movement being in front of the wheel. I have pics and plans taken from builders drawings depicting the wheel in front. The helmsman stood to one side. Logical when you stop and think, as right in front of the wheelhouse on the centreline is the smoke stack. I am more than happy to take advise and criticism where it is justified / researched until that time I suggest you refrain from jumping in with both feet One last point I am building a prototypical puffer for FUN! Kev Edited April 18, 2017 by longshanks 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murdo Posted April 18, 2017 Share Posted April 18, 2017 Umm... My apologies Kev, I really didn't mean to offend you. I wasn't criticising, just trying to help... And quite curious about your subject and build and the intricacies of it. What you mentioned about the smoke stack makes sense. Was the wheel offset from centre (e.g. to port) for the helmsman to see past the funnel? Man, I really have to go and watch Para Handy again, and the "Maggie". I suppose it might make sense for the wheel to be in the middle as the helmsman would meet different situations and berths in each port. I'm still curious as to why the binnacle would be behind the helmsman though? No criticism and not saying it wasn't like that, just saying in a clumsy way that I'm very curious as to why. The puffers seem to have been relatively specialised boats and designed with a particular purpose in mind - getting stuff to people in often remote and difficult to reach areas. This would explain their shape, hull and keel etc. They could even be beached to deliver goods (probably with difficulty but it could be done) without needing a quay / harbour. Please continue to enjoy the fun build, as I will and I really hope to learn more from you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clipper Posted April 19, 2017 Share Posted April 19, 2017 (edited) No matter where it was, binnacle ?? .... sheer luxury! Oh and the funnel was sometimes in front of the wheelhouse! There is nuthin' rougher than a puffer. Thats why they are loved so much in these parts! VIC32 below - definitely not representative - Oban North Pier, 30th Sep 2011. Heading home from the Caley Canal, to Crinan (Canal Basin) for the Winter lay up Edited April 19, 2017 by clipper pic addition 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longshanks Posted April 19, 2017 Author Share Posted April 19, 2017 (edited) Murdo, no offence taken. It was the manner in which Swindell set out to correct me. Looking again at the pics I posted I can see where some confusion may have arisen. I have put the compass binnacle in the wrong way round. The iron correcting ball should be red to port Pic that hopefully will clear up the confusion, Forward is to the top of the page. I can't put the bits on top as everything is still on tails for holding/painting etc. So in answer to your question the compass binnacle was in front of the helmsman. There is nuthin' rougher than a puffer Love it Clipper and thanks for dropping in the word binnacle I'd been racking my brains for it . Tis an age thing Kev Edited July 5, 2017 by longshanks 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Swindell Posted April 19, 2017 Share Posted April 19, 2017 Hello Kev I'm quite surprised at your reaction to my post last night, and apologise that my wording of what I thought of as a friendly heads up to a potential inaccuracy, at a point where it could (and has been) easily rectified, has been perceived as something else. This was not my intent, and neither is this post. The first part of the post was a question to alert you to a potential problem and give you the opportunity to educate myself and others as to why this arrangement was chosen if my observations were incorrect. I based my orientation on the colours of the Kelvin's balls on the binnacle; as you modelled it originally, this put the binnacle at the rear of the wheelhouse, whereas the plans you posted on page 1 show the binnacle at the front of the wheelhouse, as do the photo's in the link I included of VIC32's wheelhouse interior. As the first photo you posted was of VIC32, I made the assumption that this was at least in part being used as a reference for the model. As you've now rotated the binnacle through 180 degrees, this now gives the correct orientation within the wheelhouse. The photo's, and the David Hayman program linked to on p1 also show, that on VIC32 at least, the gearing is forward of the wheel and the helmsman has enough room around the wheel to steer from either side, in front of or behind the wheel (and the program shows this being done whilst manoevring and on passage) I'm well aware that there were other arrangements for the layout of Clyde Puffers, and as it's your model, the wheelhouse design is entirely up to you. I've done my research, and I've done 37 years in the Merchant Navy, for the last 10 years I've been sailing as Chief Engineer. My advice was based on this and was, as far as I can see, factually correct. You are free to take or disregard my advice, it was offered with the best intent, and I apologise again that this was percieved otherwise. You're making a lovely little model, I've enjoyed watching it progress, and I wish you every sucsess in completing it. Best Regards Dave Swindell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gremlin56 Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 Before you open fire on me Kev I was rather confused about the positioning of the magnetic compass too. I spent 4 months on a very old harbor tug before "promoting" to the big, modern, b****y strong anchor handling tugs that had a bollard pull of 120 tons,and the bridge arrangement was rather unusual to say the least. Your explanation does however remove any doubts. The build is quite magnificent, lovely little work ship (hate the word "Boat"). Ok, fire at will, I can handle it 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ripaman Posted April 25, 2017 Share Posted April 25, 2017 Man I am learning things everyday, should have paid more attention when I was on boats going around Poole Quay By the way love the Puffer Regards Richard 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longshanks Posted April 25, 2017 Author Share Posted April 25, 2017 Hi Richard Glad you had a good break.... I could see a 'Puffer' alongside in Poole. definitely wouldn't look out of place I grew up in Ferndown 10' NNE of Poole, Happy Days Kev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longshanks Posted April 29, 2017 Author Share Posted April 29, 2017 (edited) Life has been interfering with the model world recently... but we have a small update Wheelhouse fitted out including chart table Then it was the turn of the portholes, using a variation of a technique used before First rough cut to length holding in a pin vice For sizing depth wise. I drilled a hole of suitable depth in a maple block. I've found with this sort of work hardwood is better. If you don't have any use the knot in softwood. Sanded down Finished product, to give a sense of size the tube is 1.5mm diameter Using a piece of 0.1mm card to set depth The finished product including handle and hinges on the door Thanks for stopping by Kev Edited July 5, 2017 by longshanks 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gremlin56 Posted April 30, 2017 Share Posted April 30, 2017 Nice detailing Kev, you even added the old grey scale type British Admiralty chart instead of the modern dull yellow and blue (modern about 40 years old if I remember correctly ) Like it a lot 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray S Posted April 30, 2017 Share Posted April 30, 2017 Hi Kev, what a neat idea for the portholes! The cabin is looking good too, in fact the whole thing... I am probably going to use your 'bread and butter' technique on my next project. All the best, Ray 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted April 30, 2017 Share Posted April 30, 2017 Interesting technique with the port holes. Martian 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longshanks Posted April 30, 2017 Author Share Posted April 30, 2017 (edited) Thanks for the comments guys Stepping out today Soldered up the mast & boom Mast located in tabernacle to allow the mast to be lowered for passing under a bridge Goose neck General view Thanks for looking in Kev Edited July 5, 2017 by longshanks 14 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hewy Posted April 30, 2017 Share Posted April 30, 2017 Most exquisite modelling skills on display yet again there kev,very nice indeed Glynn 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael M Posted April 30, 2017 Share Posted April 30, 2017 I like the Vector Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clipper Posted May 1, 2017 Share Posted May 1, 2017 (edited) On 30/04/2017 at 06:19, Gremlin56 said: Nice detailing Kev, you even added the old grey scale type British Admiralty chart instead of the modern dull yellow and blue (modern about 40 years old if I remember correctly ) Like it a lot Charts?? Think you guys are being a bit optimistic .... maybe a company or personal notebook (I'm sure I seen one illustrated on the internet somewhere) about harbours and anchorages, approaches, etc but relied far more on local knowledge and experience Edited May 1, 2017 by clipper 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longshanks Posted May 1, 2017 Author Share Posted May 1, 2017 Probably be right ................. Us Big Ship men don't go anywhere without our charts, we'll call it the wrapping paper from his fish & chips. Reminds me, many years ago I was working on the lightening ships in Torbay. We were joined with a 300,000 ton Liberian oil tanker. Her Second Mate ask if he could look at our charts for the Dover Straits as they were off to Rotterdam next. I pulled out the chart and he pulled out a roll of tracing paper!!! For those unaware the Dover Straits is divided into relatively narrow shipping lanes and the vessel would only have a few feet clearance in some areas. When questioned about the lack of charts he took from his pocket a map of Africa taken from the National Geographical magazine. On it were plotted their Noon position from the Gulf to Torbay. Does it make it good or bad seamanship that he had got thus far? Kev 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrantGoodale Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 11 hours ago, longshanks said: Does it make it good or bad seamanship that he had got thus far? Can't say about the seamanship but it was one heck of a good navigation job. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 Good work Kev! Martian 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beefy66 Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 This is building up to a very good little Puffer Did not know how small this actually was until the last photo with the pen unless that is one hell of a big pen mate Beefy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robgizlu Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 Cracking work on those masts. I agree about it being Tiny!! Rob 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gremlin56 Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 On 1-5-2017 at 4:04 PM, longshanks said: Probably be right ................. Us Big Ship men don't go anywhere without our charts, we'll call it the wrapping paper from his fish & chips. Reminds me, many years ago I was working on the lightening ships in Torbay. We were joined with a 300,000 ton Liberian oil tanker. Her Second Mate ask if he could look at our charts for the Dover Straits as they were off to Rotterdam next. I pulled out the chart and he pulled out a roll of tracing paper!!! For those unaware the Dover Straits is divided into relatively narrow shipping lanes and the vessel would only have a few feet clearance in some areas. When questioned about the lack of charts he took from his pocket a map of Africa taken from the National Geographical magazine. On it were plotted their Noon position from the Gulf to Torbay. Does it make it good or bad seamanship that he had got thus far? Kev It's very familiar Kev, had a Greek mate pop on board on an identical mission. His Captain had sent him to ask for a good course from the Panama Canal to Lisbon. Go figure, Julian 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longshanks Posted May 6, 2017 Author Share Posted May 6, 2017 (edited) Been playing about to see what is possible in this scale Plug made from three layers of ply. The advantage of using ply is that it's easy to see if the shape is symmetrical Plastic card and industrial hair dryer produces... In the process of fitting out... and here is one I made earlier I thought the idea of working at smaller scales was that there was less to do Thanks for looking in Kev Edited July 5, 2017 by longshanks 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael M Posted May 6, 2017 Share Posted May 6, 2017 Nope, everything is just... smaller 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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