clive_t Posted July 17, 2017 Author Share Posted July 17, 2017 46 minutes ago, Hewy said: Just had a look through this thread Clive,your doing a fantastic job, really nice detailing and weathering, Glynn Thanks Glynn, very kind of you. I had a rush of blood to the head this evening after tea, and joined the two lengths of track together: It's not long enough to go all the way round yet, but it's not far off 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clive_t Posted July 18, 2017 Author Share Posted July 18, 2017 This evening, I decided it would be a good idea to try and determine how many more links I'd need to fit in order to complete the circuit, as it were. The good news is, I managed to work out that I still need 17 links added on. This implies that there was some not-so-good news to go with it... Now, one does not have to be an art aficionado to recognise and even appreciate certain paintings; Da Vinci's Mona Lisa, Van Gogh's evocative self portrait, Vermeer's Girl with a Pearl Ear-ring all have the capacity to leave one wondering what was the inspiration for such memorable facial expressions. This evening, I learned exactly what was in the very forefront of Edvard Munch's mind when he painted 'The Scream'... he was obviously imagining what it would be like to spend countless hours hand-making some double-I pattern track, having previously glued together the top and bottom halves of a Grant hull, complete with PE fenders at least partially obscuring the sprocket wheels... only to find that the track was TOO %^&$$%£-ing WIDE for said sprocket wheel to engage with!!!!! By about 1mm if you pleasey! Exhibit 'A' m'lud - facilitated by rather brutally ripping the PE fender off the left side, and removing the (thankfully dry-fitted) sprocket wheel: The main culprits are the links, which between them contribute about 0.8mm of excess width, the additional 0.2mm width attributable to the track section itself. Here's my 'Panda' track with the supplied rubber track lying on top of it - the additional width becomes plainly evident: Some good old Anglo Saxon invective was required to adequately convey my feelings of joy and goodwill in this matter... It is fortunate that I used Tamiya Extra-Thin - and sparingly at that - to put the two halves of the sprocket wheel together. Running carefully round the join with a scalpel soon separated them; introducing a 1mm gap seemed to allow the track links to fully engage with the sprocket teeth: I now have the problem of trying to excise the right hand sprocket without trashing the sponson and having the whole thing reduced to its original constituent parts... I am told that 'these things are sent to try us'... funny how there's never a return address... 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceG Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 Long time lurker on this forum. However, I share your pain, having had the same issue with an Academy Achilles with Panda tracks. The issue is the Academy sprockets, which are too narrow, as are the roadwheels, though this is less noticeable. Panda tracks fit everything else, no problem. ive done three or four sets of these now. A jig is a luxury to be honest. You can assemble them simply link by link. The pins are amazingly resilient; they rarely bend and I've only snapped a couple of them. There are plenty of spares, so it's not the end of the world. I wouldn't use anything else. The Bronco ones are stupidly complex, and the Friuls are just wrong! Nice job so,far. My grant has just risen to close to the top of the pile, complete with lots of etch, Panda tracks, and some natty resin, only to,be usurped by the new Takom kits. Ho hum... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clive_t Posted July 19, 2017 Author Share Posted July 19, 2017 8 hours ago, BruceG said: Long time lurker on this forum. However, I share your pain, having had the same issue with an Academy Achilles with Panda tracks. The issue is the Academy sprockets, which are too narrow, as are the roadwheels, though this is less noticeable. Panda tracks fit everything else, no problem. ive done three or four sets of these now. A jig is a luxury to be honest. You can assemble them simply link by link. The pins are amazingly resilient; they rarely bend and I've only snapped a couple of them. There are plenty of spares, so it's not the end of the world. I wouldn't use anything else. The Bronco ones are stupidly complex, and the Friuls are just wrong! Nice job so,far. My grant has just risen to close to the top of the pile, complete with lots of etch, Panda tracks, and some natty resin, only to,be usurped by the new Takom kits. Ho hum... Thanks for your comment BruceG, in fact you have answered a question I was going to ask, which is - whose was the right track dimension, Panda or Academy? I should have guessed, really! I should also say, a belated welcome to BM! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullbasket Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 Morning Clive, My vote would definitely be for the Academy sprockets to be too narrow. When I built the Grant years ago, I used the WE210 tracks from the Dragon Sherman lll and I had trouble getting them to fit the sprocket. It would be interesting to do a comparison between the Academy sprocket and the one from the new Takom kit. It's all looking good though despite the sprocket woes. John. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clive_t Posted July 19, 2017 Author Share Posted July 19, 2017 13 minutes ago, Bullbasket said: Morning Clive, My vote would definitely be for the Academy sprockets to be too narrow. When I built the Grant years ago, I used the WE210 tracks from the Dragon Sherman lll and I had trouble getting them to fit the sprocket. It would be interesting to do a comparison between the Academy sprocket and the one from the new Takom kit. It's all looking good though despite the sprocket woes. John. Thanks John. I've just gone back to page 1 of this thread (where I talked about the trials and tribulations of getting the sprocket teeth to line up properly!) and amended the post to add a 'warning from the future' for anyone contemplating using Panda tracks with the Academy sprocket! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceG Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 No problem. I ended up using a spare Tasca sprocket, and mounting, as their kits seem to supply spares of all the different types. Very useful I must say! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clive_t Posted July 19, 2017 Author Share Posted July 19, 2017 Thankfully, the saga of the tracks has reached as satisfactory juncture... I was able to part - and widen - the two sides of the other sprocket wheel without having to remove the assembly from the shaft, and thereby dismantle/destroy any more PE: With that, the track fitted as it should: So, about those additional 17 links, then... Looks pretty good! Just 2 more links to add, and they are on there! Of course there is the small matter of painting and weathering first, but we appear to be back on track - as it were 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullbasket Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 That's given the sand shields a nice battered look. Unrelated question for you Clive. What hosting site are you using? After all of my trumpet blowing for Village Photos, I'm unable to post anything from them. Others are in the same boat too. John. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clive_t Posted July 20, 2017 Author Share Posted July 20, 2017 2 minutes ago, Bullbasket said: That's given the sand shields a nice battered look. Unrelated question for you Clive. What hosting site are you using? After all of my trumpet blowing for Village Photos, I'm unable to post anything from them. Others are in the same boat too. John. Thanks John, hopefully when I get to the weathering stage I will be able to make that look like dented and bent (and a bit rusty) steel, rather than dented and bent brass! I now host my pics on Flickr. Pretty reliable so far - famous last words and all that! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullbasket Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 Thanks Clive. John. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gremlin56 Posted July 22, 2017 Share Posted July 22, 2017 I can imagine the horror when you discovered the drive wheel wouldn't fit properly. You made a nice save though Looking very good. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrancisGL Posted July 22, 2017 Share Posted July 22, 2017 In spite of everything, you have solved it very intelligently, being very well.We have to be very careful with the spare tracks, as I realize, when adjusting them in the rear wheel, the teeth, do not usually fit in their mark, or is simply a little wider.I think a faster solution (and a little more expensive ...) is to buy also the rear wheel add-on ... Cheers Clive 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clive_t Posted July 22, 2017 Author Share Posted July 22, 2017 Thanks once again for your comments @Gremlin56 and @FrancisGL No progress at all yesterday as real life once again intervened at just the wrong moment, however I was able to compensate to some extent today, during which time I managed to complete the entire second track. Once that was done, I was able to give both tracks a quick coverage with some of the sand yellow spray primer: Once that was looking dry, I made a start on the rubber portions, using the same simple black acrylic that I used to paint the road wheel tyres: That's it for today really, not much of an update but the completion of both tracks was a major step forward today, so all in all I am happy Thanks for watching! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzy Posted July 22, 2017 Share Posted July 22, 2017 Fantastic progress on the tracks Clive they will complement your build really well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clive_t Posted July 23, 2017 Author Share Posted July 23, 2017 On 22/07/2017 at 7:07 PM, Ozzy said: Fantastic progress on the tracks Clive they will complement your build really well. Thanks Ozzy, the level of detail on the worn tracks is starting to become apparent. Today was a bonus day as I managed, unusually, to get about 15 minutes of Sunday bench-time in. Enough to have a go at applying a sepia wash, stippling some sandy colour and finally dry-brushing some metallic colour (on the links and guide horns only, obviously) on top of yesterday's work: Hawk-eyed persons will note that I have only done the links and guide horns on one side of one track at the moment. This was really just in case I didn't like the results, whereupon I could have done something different on the other side. As it turns out, although it's not finished yet, I am quite happy with it so far. Sorry, but I couldn't resist another dry fit of the track on the vehicle: [/url] A bit more to do yet, but we are getting there! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kris B Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 It is probably to late, but I think the tracks is bit too loose as for the M3/M4 type. Painting on them looks good. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceG Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 Agree with Kris. There is no sag in these tracks. Losing a link shouldn't be too difficult. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clive_t Posted July 23, 2017 Author Share Posted July 23, 2017 1 hour ago, Kris B said: It is probably to late, but I think the tracks is bit too loose as for the M3/M4 type. Painting on them looks good. 19 minutes ago, BruceG said: Agree with Kris. There is no sag in these tracks. Losing a link shouldn't be too difficult. Thanks Kris and Bruce, yes I think you're right about the sag. However, although the tracks are not yet fixed, I've tried unsuccessfully to stretch them so that I can join them with one link less. The only way I can think of to hide the sag is to concentrate it on the bit between the front return roller and the sprocket wheel. The front fender should then hide it from view once I return it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullbasket Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 Good progress Clive. One thing that you might want to think about adding. The end links/guide horns, rubbed against the road wheels and wore the rims down to bare metal. John. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clive_t Posted July 24, 2017 Author Share Posted July 24, 2017 9 hours ago, Bullbasket said: Good progress Clive. One thing that you might want to think about adding. The end links/guide horns, rubbed against the road wheels and wore the rims down to bare metal. John. Good point well made I did a bit of dry-brushing with my metallic colour this afternoon, around the road-wheel rims, also the return rollers, the idler wheel and the sprocket teeth - also the guide horns themselves. It might stand a bit more but I have other things to go on as well afterwards so I might get away with what I've done today. I also bit the bullet and tried fitting the track with one link removed: I had one heart-stopping moment when I managed to engage the track pin on one side, but then couldn't get the other side to reach far enough... but eventually I managed it!!!! Yeee haaww! Absolutely zero slack there now! In fact the front and rear road wheels are riding up as the track is obviously finding the path of least resistance. I put some gentle weight on the hull to force the road wheels to be in contact with the ground, and it's now better than it was. I may end up securing the suspension with glue to make sure the wheels don't ride up again. Not a massive update, but still it's yet more progress! Thanks for comments, and your continued interest! 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hewy Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 Cracking work on the tracks clive, you've painted and weathered them superbly Glynn 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullbasket Posted July 25, 2017 Share Posted July 25, 2017 100% improvement on the tracks Clive. John. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clive_t Posted July 25, 2017 Author Share Posted July 25, 2017 23 hours ago, Hewy said: Cracking work on the tracks clive, you've painted and weathered them superbly Glynn 8 hours ago, Bullbasket said: 100% improvement on the tracks Clive. John. Thanks, Glynn and John. Yes, I'm glad I took a punt at trying to fit the track with one link less as suggested. I'm really happy with how it turned out. Flushed with the success of fitting that track, I got busy this evening repeating the exercise with the other track: Slightly trickier than the first, on account of having to thread the track between the sprocket wheel and the fender, but we got there. As you can probably see, I also took the opportunity to complete another of my remaining tasks, that of fitting the 75mm gun periscope: Getting there! 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hewy Posted July 25, 2017 Share Posted July 25, 2017 Like it, That first photo clive, very arty, the patina on your table too is also worth a mention Glynn 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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