albacore Mk1 camouflage

[span]

Hi every one as title suggests question  about the Fairey Albacore Mk1 .Thinking of doing the Special Hobby 1/48 kit according to the instructions it will be X9053/5C 817 Sq 1943-44. Now the colour call out is upper matt black over Dark sea grey lower Extra dark sea grey. Would I be right to assume that this is a typing error and it would be the five colour scheme, checked the site and can't find any mention of this scheme on FAA aircraft or RAF aircraft , even the box art shows different colours .

All help gratefully accepted

Thanks Paul

[Graham Boak]

Looks like a typing error to me.  At that date, it may be the three-colour scheme rather than the five, but I don't know of any other difference.

[Seahawk]

Firstly, according to Sturtivant's FAA Aircraft.., X9053 never served with 817 Sq.  She was however "5C" with 820 Sq in April 1942.  By July 1944 she was with the RAF, first with 415 Sq (okay, RCAF!) and later 119 Sq, by which time I doubt that she was wearing the "5C" code. 

 

As to whether she was in the shadow compensating scheme, an earlier date makes that more likely.  However I look forward to a learned exposition some day on when the shadow compensating scheme was officially abandoned, how long it took factories to comply, whether it even then persisted longer on lower mainplanes, whether older aircraft were repainted, etc.  The picture seems inconsistent with Sea Otters (quite late aircraft) apparently retaining it even on fuselage sides.

 

Edited March 23, 2017 by Seahawk

[ClaudioN]

Hello Paul,

 

from what I can see here, there are three colour schemes:

• X9053/5C - from the video, to me it looks a standard Temperate Sea Scheme (TSS). I've seen a picture of it, but I can't recall where. I'd say it hasn't any shadow shading either, so just three colours;
• X8942/5B from 828 Sqn. in Malta - this unit flew night missions from Malta (full code would be S5B, the 'S' meaning shore-based for the FAA), hence the black undersides. I'd go for TSS as well;
• L7114 "MOANA II" - this is a much earlier machine belonging to 826 Sqn., the first unit equipped with Albacores in 1940. This also had black undersides added, as it was used in cross-Channel mine-laying missions, or something similar. I have a dim memory of a code ('4M' or '4P' ?) stacked vertically over the fin flash, but I'd need to dig into my references and I do not have them at hand. The camouflage scheme in this case is open to debate. My feeling is that it might be finished in the five-colour S.1E camouflage scheme, that is: upper surfaces in Extra Dark Sea Grey/ Dark Slate Grey/Dark Sea Grey/Light Slate Grey (the latter two for the shadow-compensating effect); under surfaces, fuselage and fin sides in Sky Grey. TSS with shadow compensation could be an alternative.

Just my thought.

 

HTH

 

Claudio

 

Edited March 23, 2017 by ClaudioN

[Graham Boak]

One quibble amongst much interesting information.  S was introduced as a shore-base code in 1940, but only seems to have been used at St. Merryn, Dekheila, Wick, Hatston, Mersah Matruh, Hal Far and Belfast.  All shore bases I grant you, but so were an awful lot of other letter/number combinations.  Other later uses were 47 Wing on HMS Victorious, HMS Indefatigable in the British Pacific Fleet after they had switched to 3-digit numbers on the sides, HMS Shah, HMS Stalker and HMS Searcher (without the squadron on-carrier number following).   

 

For those familiar with the RN's habit of giving ship names to shore bases, the named ships above are all floating ones not concrete frigates.

[ClaudioN]

34 minutes ago, Graham Boak said:

S was introduced as a shore-base code in 1940.  

Graham,

you're right. Oversimplification on my part.

The 1940 code system was revised at some point during the war and, of course, a number of shore stations had different letter codes.

 

Claudio

 

[Graham Boak]

It does look as though 828 Sq may have been following that system at Malta, and possibly the squadrons in the Western Desert 1941/43.  The land-based FAA fighters in the same theatre seem to have ignored it.  I must admit having started the answer above by saying it simply wasn't so - there was considerable editing when I found that at some time it actually was!  I suspect that a fuller description of the intention might be "carrier-borne squadrons temporarily operating from land bases" but even then there are exceptions - everyone but the Albacores, it seems, and only in the Middle East.  Which is a little suspicious, but perhaps they were the only ones to actually read the relevant order at a relevant time?

[span]

Hi

First I would like to apologise for the delay in replying ,I'm having a lot of trouble logging in at the moment for what ever reason. Thanks for the info what I though was a easy question turns out to be a bit more complicated, I think I'll stick with the 5C but will reference it to 820 SQ thanks Seahawk for that , ClaudioN and Graham thanks for the help with the codes, Now I know the correct squadron, and what the codes relate to I'll be able to get better info from the web

Thanks for the help

Paul