SEAC 1/72 aircraft kits?

[sapperastro]

Hello all,

 

Can anyone list the aircraft types primarily used by South East Asia command that used the light blue on dark blue roundels? And good kits for those aircraft? I know there is a Hasegawa P-47 of the correct type that includes the correct decals, but I am coming up short on finding any others. I assume there would be Mosquitoes, Beaufighters, Spitfires, Hurricanes and god knows what else.

 

 

[Graham Boak]

Generally speaking, you are better looking for dedicated transfer sheets that you can then apply to models of your choice.  You may not want the Frog Spitfire Mk.XIV, the Hasegawa Spitfire Mk.VIII. the Eduard/Academy B-24 or AZ Hurricane Mk.IV (although in this case I can't see why not),  Airfix Lysander?  I can't think of SEAC versions of the Mosquito and Beaufighter in kit form, but that may be my fault.  Given a transfer set, you could also include Dakota, Wellington, and even Halifax.  Expeditor.  Skymaster. Warwick. Argus? Auster?

 

I think there are/will be better Spitfire Mk.XIVs kits with SEAC roundels - check AZ and Sword, or even Fujimi?  Certainly there are more Mk.VIIIs - Check AZ again and look out for the new Eduard.  There are lots of Hurricane kits around...

[rio]

As Graham said, you need to look for a dedicated decal sheet, I know one of the Hurricane kits I have includes SEAC markings and I have a decal set with generic SEAC markings.

 

rio

[sapperastro]

Hmm, I guess you would be correct there. I will see if I can find any sheets with SEAC markings along with sheets that include the proper colour/size alpha numeric markings on them. Thanks for the advice, and also for the list of aircraft to look for Graham.

[rio]

Have a set of hurricane mkiic markings you can have.

 

Rio

[Gwart]

The new Airfix Beaufighter has a SEAC option.

 

For a mk.viii Spit wait for the forthcoming Eduard kit.

For P-47's use the Tamiya razorback and bubble kits with the Xtradecal RAF T-bolt sheet

For a low back Spit XIV the new Sword kit with 'Mary ' on the cover boxing.

For Lib's and fighter bomber Mosquito's there's this but probably hard to find

 http://www.hyperscale.com/2008/reviews/decals/ddk7218reviewpm_1.htm

For Lib's there's a DK decals sheet but again maybe hard to find even though it's a recent release.

The Hasegawa Liberator would be my kit of choice but the Academy one is not too shabby .

Tamyia Mosquito,the Hasegawa kit is ok but looks empty.

There was a Blackbird models SEAC decal sheet again hard to find but it had a wide selection of aircraft.

 

Will add more later.

 

The current Airfix Dakota with jeep boxing has a SEAC option.

 

 

Edited January 11, 2017 by Gwart

[tempestfan]

55 minutes ago, Graham Boak said:

 You may not want the...  Airfix Lysander?  

I think it was Frog again with SEAC markings, IIRC the Airfix came with Special Ops and Army Coop. Markings originally,  though Airfix may have replaced the green /brown scheme in one of the final boxings. 

[Hook]

Academy's P-47D bubbletop has a SEAC option:

 

http://www.model-making.eu/products/item_name-107449.html

 

(For your viewing pleasure only - I don't recommend that shop for actually ordering something).

 

Cheers,

 

Andre

[Giorgio N]

Fujimi sure had a XIV with SEAC markings. As this variant arrived when the war was over, it may or not be of interest to the OP.

Generic SEAC roundel sheets were issued by Modeldecal, they could well be still decently available

[Dave Fleming]

1 hour ago, Hook said:

Academy's P-47D bubbletop has a SEAC option:

 

http://www.model-making.eu/products/item_name-107449.html

 

(For your viewing pleasure only - I don't recommend that shop for actually ordering something).

 

Cheers,

 

Andre

 

Chances are it should be green and earth rather than green and graey

[Peter Lloyd]

AZ model do (at least) Lacey's Spitfire XIV, pretty sure they do an earlier Spit as well. Sword did their VC in SEAC markings: the Spitfire was a crucial aircraft in Burma as the Hurricane was near-useless in air combat by autumn 1944 when the VC arrived, while the Japanese had no answer to the VIIIs that arrived a few months later and secured the skies for the Arakan and Imphal-Kohima offensives.  AZ did several Hurricanes, also, and IIRC an Auster. The Hurricane kit is not bad at all.

 

Academy did their Liberator in a 'Cocky Bobby' edition for the RAF in Burma.

 

Blenheims and (early on) Buffaloes were important in Burma, and the AVG deployed some P-40s there in early 1942 as well. The RAF also relied on Mohawks (kitted by Azur but not for Asia) and Vultee Vengeances (Special Hobby) for a long period.

Edited January 23, 2017 by Peter Lloyd

[Graham Boak]

The AVG were formed in Burma in late 1941, not early 1942, and were in at the start of the action.  The Hurricane was not truly "near-useless".  It certainly benefitted from a height advantage at the start of any combat, but this was rarely able to be achieved because of the poor radar warning in the area.  The faster climb rate of the Spitfire meant that they were able to begin with this advantage, but even the Mk.VIIIs suffered if caught low.  To say the RAF "relied" on the Mohawk is an exaggeration given the low numbers involved: it relied upon the Hurricane.  Initially as a fighter and later as a fighter-bomber.  The AZ Hurricane kit is rather nice, but benefits from a replacement canopy (Rob Taurus do one).

Edited January 24, 2017 by Graham Boak
clarification in places.

[Wm Blecky]

Here is a quick search from Hannants' website, the very first item is a decal sheet of roundels by Almark.  Hope this helps.

[Beard]

AZ did a boxing of their Spitifre VIII with SEAC markings. The kit is limited-run but a fairly easy build, although there's something not quite right about the propeller.

 

Here's a review:http://www.hyperscale.com/2012/reviews/kits/az7377reviewmd_1.htm

 

If you want a state-of-the-art Spitfire VIII, Eduard will be releasing their version soon (if it hasn't already been). I think it comes with several SEAC marking options. 

 

Here's a post from the Rumourmonger section on here:

CONTENTS:

SPRUES: Eduard

PE-SETS: Yes, color 

PAINTING MASK: Yes

MARKINGS: →32 

BRASSIN: Wheels

DECALS: Cartograf

BOOK: 112 pages 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[dfqweofekwpeweiop4]

I've got a number of SEAC built models and in my stash, so here's what I know for sure! Some kits you'll need to find 2nd hand now.

 

Eduard (Academy/Minicraft) Liberator Mk VI

Airfix Beaufighter X

Revell Hurricane IIc

AZ Models Hurricane Mk IV (*2)

Tamiya P-47 (with decals from another kit)

Academy P-47 (I have spare decals from the Hasegawa RAF P-47 double kit)

Tamiya Mosquito FB VI (with Xtradecal decals)

Eduard (forthcoming) Spitfire VIII (I did have a Hasegawa SEAC Mk VIII)

Sword Spitfire Vc

 

thanks

Mike

 

 

[Nick Millman]

1 hour ago, Beard said:

AZ did a boxing of their Spitifre VIII with SEAC markings. The kit is limited-run but a fairly easy build, although there's something not quite right about the propeller.

 

Here's a review:http://www.hyperscale.com/2012/reviews/kits/az7377reviewmd_1.htm

 

If you want a state-of-the-art Spitfire VIII, Eduard will be releasing their version soon (if it hasn't already been). I think it comes with several SEAC marking options. 

 

Here's a post from the Rumourmonger section on here:

CONTENTS:

SPRUES: Eduard

PE-SETS: Yes, color 

PAINTING MASK: Yes

MARKINGS: →32 

BRASSIN: Wheels

DECALS: Cartograf

BOOK: 112 pages 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

With two exceptions those are all RAAF in SWPA options. There appears to be only one genuine RAF SEAC subject - shown in desert colours!  

 

Nick

[P-3s rule]

Another kit to look for in 1/72 would be the Vultee Vengeance, either in the shape of the ancient Frog (reissued in many forms and brands) or the much newer Special Hobby kits. Pretty sure the Spec Hobby kit contained RAAF and RAF SEAC in one boxing at least.

[Graham Boak]

81 Sq arrived in SEAC in desert colours with the extended wingtips, but they had to be re-equipped with new aircraft after their initial encounters when several of them required rewinging.  The extended wingtips worked well at altitude but placed excessive loads on the wingroots when pulling combat g at lower heights.   It therefore seems unlikely that they retained their desert colours into March.  JF630 is an aircraft that went from the ME in November to India in January: it may be one of their original equipment but I think this a bit uncertain: if so then the colour scheme could well be appropriate even if the date isn't.  The point about including this example on this sheet is presumably because of the Australian pilot, and we can hope for other SEAC examples to come in later releases.

Edited January 24, 2017 by Graham Boak

[Nick Millman]

55 minutes ago, Graham Boak said:

81 Sq arrived in SEAC in desert colours with the extended wingtips, but they had to be re-equipped with new aircraft after their initial encounters when several of them required rewinging.  The extended wingtips worked well at altitude but placed excessive loads on the wingroots when pulling combat g at lower heights.   It therefore seems unlikely that they retained their desert colours into March.  JF630 is an aircraft that went from the ME in November to India in January: it may be one of their original equipment but I think this a bit uncertain: if so then the colour scheme could well be appropriate even if the date isn't.  The point about including this example on this sheet is presumably because of the Australian pilot, and we can hope for other SEAC examples to come in later releases.

 

81 Sqn Spits flew into Broadway in early March with extended wingtips and Temperate Land colours as colour photographs provide evidence of that. Some of their Spits were photographed b/w later at Broadway in what appear to be Day Fighter scheme, in as much as they have rear fuselage bands. I agree that desert colours seem unlikely.   

 

While we're at it, the spinner and cannon fairings on the RAAF nmf ZF-Z should be light blue, as described by the pilot himself. 

 

Nick

[Beard]

20 hours ago, Nick Millman said:

 

With two exceptions those are all RAAF in SWPA options. There appears to be only one genuine RAF SEAC subject - shown in desert colours!  

 

Nick

 

Whoops! I should've looked more closely at the decal options (in my defence I did write 'think' in italics).

 

1 hour ago, Graham Boak said:

81 Sq arrived in SEAC in desert colours with the extended wingtips, but they had to be re-equipped with new aircraft after their initial encounters when several of them required rewinging.  The extended wingtips worked well at altitude but placed excessive loads on the wingroots when pulling combat g at lower heights.   It therefore seems unlikely that they retained their desert colours into March.  JF630 is an aircraft that went from the ME in November to India in January: it may be one of their original equipment but I think this a bit uncertain: if so then the colour scheme could well be appropriate even if the date isn't.  The point about including this example on this sheet is presumably because of the Australian pilot, and we can hope for other SEAC examples to come in later releases.

 

I can feel thread drift coming on so won't add anything except, poor research by Eduard?

[Peter Lloyd]

On 23/01/2017 at 11:42 PM, Graham Boak said:

The AVG were formed in Burma in late 1941, not early 1942, and were in at the start of the action.  The Hurricane was not truly "near-useless".  It certainly benefitted from a height advantage at the start of any combat, but this was rarely able to be achieved because of the poor radar warning in the area.  The faster climb rate of the Spitfire meant that they were able to begin with this advantage, but even the Mk.VIIIs suffered if caught low.  To say the RAF "relied" on the Mohawk is an exaggeration given the low numbers involved: it relied upon the Hurricane.  Initially as a fighter and later as a fighter-bomber.  The AZ Hurricane kit is rather nice, but benefits from a replacement canopy (Rob Taurus do one).

 

My expression was not at its best in that post.  I didn't mean to imply the Mohawk was a major type but I meant it was relied upon in the sense it was being used in front line combat long after something much better was wanted and needed.

 

I stand by my comments on the Hurricane, though.  The Japanese aircraft, mostly Oscars, outclassed it and comparing combat reports during the period before, and after, the Spitfires arrived show an enormous contrast. The JAAF in Burma went from being a formidable force to one that couldn't meaningfully challenge the Admin Box airlift in just a few weeks, entirely due to the performance difference between the Spit and the Hurricane in hacking down enemy aircraft, including ending the invulnerability of the Dinah recce planes.  The RAF in Burma were never going to be able to seriously challenge Japanese air power with the Hurricane, and it is a failure of RAF policy that Spitfires were so late in being sent overseas.

[Graham Boak]

It was the extreme nature of your adjective that I felt was unfair and inaccurate, not that the arrival of the Spitfires was other than overdue.  I had the privilege of being lectured on comparative aircraft performance by AVM (as he was then) Sir Neil Cameron, once a Hurricane pilot in Burma, and one of his examples was on the ways that were used, when possible, to play up the Hurricane's strengths (superior performance at higher altitude, greater firepower) and avoid the Oscar's weaknesses, despite the latter's superiority at low-level.  (Basically, the modern ideas of high energy vs low energy combat, although they can be recognised in the tactics used by SE5s and Camels in WW1!)   I agree that the turn in the respective air forces' fortunes was largely due to the introduction of the Spitfire, although an improvement in RAF training, better early warning and the increased appearance of the USAAF on longer-ranging missions also played their parts, as discussed in several recent works.  It is perhaps ironic that the first loss of a Dinah after the arrival of the Spitfires was to a Hurricane.

 

re the early use of the Mk.VIII: following their first encounter on February 15th, 81 sq was observed to have most of their aircraft unserviceable with wrinkled wings and damaged engine mountings.  These are faults that require replacement aircraft not a few hours in the hands of squadron fitters. The Dinah interception on the 4th March was precisely the kind of mission that the early Mk.VIII with extended tips was most suitable for, and if not a replacement then JF630 may not have been involved in the earlier battle.  Dogfighting with Oscars at low level from Broadway was exactly the wrong kind - retention of the bigger wingtip may have been due to a lack of appreciation of matters or a shortage of sufficient other replacements, but Peart's description of the results on March 17th should have been entirely predictable from the earlier combat.  Hindsight is 100% of course, and there were several known (and must have been more now unknown) factors involved.