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Harrier GR MK7 Hasegawa 1/48 Afganistan Livery and Ordnance


LaurieS

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The Harrier has an all moving tail (which I understand is desirable for trans-sonic stuff) incorporating a single piece spar with the pivot and actuating ram on the underside. This creates some sizable cavities into the fuselage around the area of motion of the central piece. The "bacon slicers" (as I believe they are known on the Hawk - maybe Harrier too?) seal off the cavities throughout the range of movement of the tailplane.

 

Model is really coming together now; nice work and thanks for the tips.

 

Kirk

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1 hour ago, Kirk said:

The Harrier has an all moving tail (which I understand is desirable for trans-sonic stuff) incorporating a single piece spar with the pivot and actuating ram on the underside. This creates some sizable cavities into the fuselage around the area of motion of the central piece. The "bacon slicers" (as I believe they are known on the Hawk - maybe Harrier too?) seal off the cavities throughout the range of movement of the tailplane.

 

Model is really coming together now; nice work and thanks for the tips.

 

Kirk

 

Thanks Kirk for the info. It is a pity that the model manufacturers do not provide more information.

although I suppose it is interesting from my point of view to search. ood for the mind.

 

Wonder if you an help on the weapons. just read an article written by the RAF. It states that the Mk7

carried Sidewinders in Afghanistan for self defense.

 

Seemed a little strange as they are air to air (I believe) What would they need Sidewinders for as

the Taliban did not have (again I believe) any aircraft or helicopters.

 

Laurie

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Hi Laurie,

 

I've only just found this thread and some of your work is going to help my build of the Revell boxing of this kit, thank you [can't find thumbs-up emoticon].

 

One point for you: your jet's  got the early "67%" LERX (either side of the engine access doors, between cockpit & wing) so you'll need to pick a subject with a "ZD-" serial number as those with "ZG-" serials had the later 100% LERX which has a thicker section and intruded into the engine access door area.

 

Steve (honourary member of the Harrier Pedants Society.

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1 hour ago, stever219 said:

Hi Laurie,

 

I've only just found this thread and some of your work is going to help my build of the Revell boxing of this kit, thank you [can't find thumbs-up emoticon].

 

One point for you: your jet's  got the early "67%" LERX (either side of the engine access doors, between cockpit & wing) so you'll need to pick a subject with a "ZD-" serial number as those with "ZG-" serials had the later 100% LERX which has a thicker section and intruded into the engine access door area.

 

Steve (honourary member of the Harrier Pedants Society.

 

Hi Steve

 

Hope I can help in some way. However you being a Harrier Pedant puts me a the point of being a guinea pig

although I am rapidly leaning.

 

Thanks for the point on the serial numbers. Hasegawa got it right the decals provided by Hasegawa have all

the variety of serials prefixed with a ZD.

 

Laurie Harrier Guinea Pig Institute.

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11 hours ago, LaurieS said:

 

Thanks Kirk for the info. It is a pity that the model manufacturers do not provide more information.

although I suppose it is interesting from my point of view to search. ood for the mind.

 

Wonder if you an help on the weapons. just read an article written by the RAF. It states that the Mk7

carried Sidewinders in Afghanistan for self defense.

 

Seemed a little strange as they are air to air (I believe) What would they need Sidewinders for as

the Taliban did not have (again I believe) any aircraft or helicopters.

 

Laurie

 

Hi Laurie.

 

My  wish is that kit manufacturers would at least call out the real world description of the parts on the sprue - it would make finding reference pics so much easier. No doubt it is good old economics.

 

I'm afraid I'm not very knowledgeable on Harrier loadouts during any particular campaign, though share your scepticism about the need for AAMs against foes with no aircraft. Maybe there was an initial concern about helicopters (we all have concerns about helicopters) so I wouldn't be entirely surprised.

 

Steve is almost right about the 65% vs 100% LERX; this gets debated incessantly. I have it on good authority (Alfie at the Harrier Special Interest Group iirc) that some of the earlier UK aircraft were retro-fitted with 100% extensions. Couldn't give you serial numbers though - and the ZD vs ZG is a good rule of thumb.

 

Kirk

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35 minutes ago, Kirk said:

 

Hi Laurie.

 

My  wish is that kit manufacturers would at least call out the real world description of the parts on the sprue - it would make finding reference pics so much easier. No doubt it is good old economics.

 

I'm afraid I'm not very knowledgeable on Harrier loadouts during any particular campaign, though share your scepticism about the need for AAMs against foes with no aircraft. Maybe there was an initial concern about helicopters (we all have concerns about helicopters) so I wouldn't be entirely surprised.

 

Steve is almost right about the 65% vs 100% LERX; this gets debated incessantly. I have it on good authority (Alfie at the Harrier Special Interest Group iirc) that some of the earlier UK aircraft were retro-fitted with 100% extensions. Couldn't give you serial numbers though - and the ZD vs ZG is a good rule of thumb.

 

Kirk

 

Thanks Kirk for your time in replying. Very nice of you.

 

Wow this Harrier business is a real walk in the jungle.

 

Laurie

 

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Hi Laurie,

 

Harrier GR9/9As may be grey but they are all unique! 

 

Two things to help you...

A how to build the Hasegawa/Revell kit I put together a while back plus info on seat and pilot:

http://harriersig.org.uk/models/index.htm

 

A very useful reference book, for which I don't get royalties...

Let me know which serial number you intend to finish the model as and I'kll dig out some photos to help you; drop me a PM with your direct e-mail address in it.

 

Cheers,

Nick

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2 hours ago, NG899 said:

Hi Laurie,

 

Harrier GR9/9As may be grey but they are all unique! 

 

Two things to help you...

A how to build the Hasegawa/Revell kit I put together a while back plus info on seat and pilot:

http://harriersig.org.uk/models/index.htm

 

A very useful reference book, for which I don't get royalties...

Let me know which serial number you intend to finish the model as and I'kll dig out some photos to help you; drop me a PM with your direct e-mail address in it.

 

Cheers,

Nick

Nick that is great news and very kind of you to spend the time.

 

Very grateful and I am sending a PM.

 

Laurie

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More progress but this time sorting which and what go on the pylons.

 

Thanks to Nick Greenall, reply above, with all the info. supplied I have made up this list.

The remainder of the pictures are of the weapons listed.

Laurie

 

http://configuartion_zpsdotl5ru0.jpg

 

http://configuration_zps3qvng84w.jpg

 

]http://paveway_zps7im0sxn9.jpg

 

http://fuel tanks_zpsapoaiqwl.jpg

 

http://tiald_zpsgupi2jgb.jpg

 

http://bol_zpsopcwilmb.jpg

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A few more bits of info on the weapons. Gleaned from others. That is for the serial number prefixed ZD designation. May be
also those after ZD but not being an expert to be able to confirm which.

CRV-7 6 and 19 shot can be placed on pylons 2 & 6. The 6 shot was sometimes on one of the pylons the 19 shot on another.
The 6 shot can be fired one at a time. The 19 shot was ripple fired until amended to ripple and single shot.

The Bol 304 can also be used on pylons 1 & 9.

Pylons 1 & 9 can take the GP 540lb bomb. Fuel tank can also go on 3 & 5.

 

Laurie

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Above applies to both ZD and ZG serials. A simplistic summary is that the "ZD"s are earlier production - initially introduced as GR5s and upgraded. "ZG"s generally started life as GR7s and with the larger LERX.

 

The "A" (as in GR7A, GR9A) denotes the more powerful Pegasus 11-61 engine - which can be fitted to an aircraft regardless of what was in there before. For example, ZG862 originally had the 11-21 engine and was a "GR7". At some point it was fitted with an 11-61 and became a GR7A. It was upgraded to GR9 standard and was a GR9A, then got an 11-21 again and became a GR9. Faded "A" letters on the fin are commonplace.

 

The "7" vs "9" denotes a series of upgrades to the latter which primarily upgraded the weapons capability - giving the later aircraft the potential to use various precision guided weapons like Brimstone and various laser-guided stuff (don't ask me which - way above my limited knowledge of whizz bangs) in conjunction with the SNIPER pod and could do real time uploads of their imagery to remote users (imagine Facebook live streaming but with a purpose). I *think* it is correct to say that a GR7 couldn't carry SNIPER and used TIALD for laser designation, whereas a GR9 could use either (but would generally use SNIPER).

 

I understand that there were a few refinements of the loadouts carried during Operation Herrick to reflect changing needs/threats. I have no reason to contradict anything you've said about CRV-7 above.

 

There were all sorts of "Urgent Operational Requirements" that took place during the time period that GR7 to GR9 upgrade was happening that muddy the picture (for me at least) but I hope I've given a fair & useful overview.

 

Cheers,

 

Kirk

PS/ Your pics/charts are great!

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20 minutes ago, Kirk said:

Above applies to both ZD and ZG serials. A simplistic summary is that the "ZD"s are earlier production - initially introduced as GR5s and upgraded. "ZG"s generally started life as GR7s and with the larger LERX.

 

The "A" (as in GR7A, GR9A) denotes the more powerful Pegasus 11-61 engine - which can be fitted to an aircraft regardless of what was in there before. For example, ZG862 originally had the 11-21 engine and was a "GR7". At some point it was fitted with an 11-61 and became a GR7A. It was upgraded to GR9 standard and was a GR9A, then got an 11-21 again and became a GR9. Faded "A" letters on the fin are commonplace.

 

The "7" vs "9" denotes a series of upgrades to the latter which primarily upgraded the weapons capability - giving the later aircraft the potential to use various precision guided weapons like Brimstone and various laser-guided stuff (don't ask me which - way above my limited knowledge of whizz bangs) in conjunction with the SNIPER pod and could do real time uploads of their imagery to remote users (imagine Facebook live streaming but with a purpose). I *think* it is correct to say that a GR7 couldn't carry SNIPER and used TIALD for laser designation, whereas a GR9 could use either (but would generally use SNIPER).

 

I understand that there were a few refinements of the loadouts carried during Operation Herrick to reflect changing needs/threats. I have no reason to contradict anything you've said about CRV-7 above.

 

There were all sorts of "Urgent Operational Requirements" that took place during the time period that GR7 to GR9 upgrade was happening that muddy the picture (for me at least) but I hope I've given a fair & useful overview.

 

Cheers,

 

Kirk

PS/ Your pics/charts are great!

 

Thanks Kirk. As you say muddy waters which for a Harrier novice like me was more like a swamp.

 

Hopefully all the info collected will help any one with mu predicament..

 

Just to confirm I did publish in another topic "my" chart of how I thought it should be. It was so terribly wrong

But I have replaced that with the one here. Looking for pictures of the weapons in Google, in the picture section,

I came across my incorrect chart. It does just show how careful you have to be with the info published.

 

Laurie

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  • 2 weeks later...

"Do [stupidly small bits of PE] enhance the model?"

Yes! - but it's not my model, so omission is up to you.

 

Also, same thing I pointed out on another thread: There are a number of vents on the tail boom that I think facilitate cooling of the reaction control valves (wot let the aircraft move in the hover) that are conspicuously 'see through' in the real thing. No need to address at this point but worthwhile sticking some wash into when done to give the effect.

Likewise those rectangular holes on the deck behind the seat bulkhead are actually the open outlets of the boundary air control ducts (wot manage the airflow over the cockpit sides into the fan). If the canopy will be open they're almost invisible and if closed barely more so, but sticking something dark in there when you're weathering to stop them looking painted pleases pedants like me with nothing better to do with their time. :)

 

Have you settled on a serial/scheme?

 

Cheers,

 

Kirk

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2 hours ago, Kirk said:

"Do [stupidly small bits of PE] enhance the model?"

Yes! - but it's not my model, so omission is up to you.

 

Also, same thing I pointed out on another thread: There are a number of vents on the tail boom that I think facilitate cooling of the reaction control valves (wot let the aircraft move in the hover) that are conspicuously 'see through' in the real thing. No need to address at this point but worthwhile sticking some wash into when done to give the effect.

Likewise those rectangular holes on the deck behind the seat bulkhead are actually the open outlets of the boundary air control ducts (wot manage the airflow over the cockpit sides into the fan). If the canopy will be open they're almost invisible and if closed barely more so, but sticking something dark in there when you're weathering to stop them looking painted pleases pedants like me with nothing better to do with their time. :)

 

Have you settled on a serial/scheme?

 

Cheers,

 

Kirk

 

Thanks Kirk. I always read you plots with trepidation what have you for me next. But keep them coming. I am spending a deal of time on this craft and hope to get as much right as possible.

 

Canopy open but will study detail on the real thing and see what I can do. Same with the tail boom. Unfortunate but a lot of photos just do not depict this detail.  It is a pity photographers do not get close in to the detail.

 

OK Kirk the scheme. Have now the Alliance Decals but they are just pre Afghanistan.

The aircraft ZD 322 3 Squadron Cottesmore.  The Alliance decals has,not to be used, anniversary scheme tail plane sad.

There are options for 13  Mk7 but this is the only one for 3 Squadron.

 

Dark Camouflage Grey/Dark Sea Grey.

 

Laurie

 

 

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Sorry - don't mean to cause trepidation. It's supposed to be fun! :)

Feel free to entirely ignore any of my suggestions; this will clearly be a great model with or without them. I've just spent too long looking at Harriers not to want to share little details that make even smaller difference!!

 

Looking forward to the next instalment.

 

Kirk

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7 minutes ago, Kirk said:

Sorry - don't mean to cause trepidation. It's supposed to be fun! :)

Feel free to entirely ignore any of my suggestions; this will clearly be a great model with or without them. I've just spent too long looking at Harriers not to want to share little details that make even smaller difference!!

 

Looking forward to the next instalment.

 

Kirk

 

That is OK Kirk appreciate your input very much. Trepidation a big exaggeration. Up for anything thrown at me.

 

A fascinating build. Definitely the most difficult as far as information is concerned. Nothing compares to the research

I have covered on the Harrier as it has for any previous models.

 

Laurie

 

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Well I am deranged. I have used Tamiya paint for the first time. I expected a disaster.

 

Got to say I am surprised being a Vallejo Fan. Slightly smoother than Vallejo. Strange

though as the lighter grey is much smoother than the dark grey. any reason for that ?

 

The other advantage which is a boon the Tamiya paint is so much more robust

compared to Vallejo.

 

So here is my Tamiya type Harrier so far. Just realized why "Harrier" and of course the

Harrier bird which can hover. How naive can you get ? Seems quite deeply. Even

the the Harrier air has the wing shape of a Harrier bird.

 

Laurie

 

http://1_zpshoexvocz.jpg

 

http://2_zps5dbiwjyr.jpg

 

http://3_zps3qll2jo6.jpg

 

http://4_zpsib2yleh4.jpg

 

http://5_zpsxu0lua8a.jpg

 

http://6_zpsextjjhwf.jpg

 

http://7_zps4szhdqe8.jpg

 

 

 

 

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(It was the much larger P.1154 that was expected to be the "Harrier". These derive from one expected to only ever be a "Kestrel". When they cancelled the P.1154 the "Harrier" name was going begging so the little, subsonic, proof of concept aircraft nicked it, along with a fancy (for the time) inertial navigation and attack system and moving map display. Well, according to my library anyway.)

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24 minutes ago, Kirk said:

(It was the much larger P.1154 that was expected to be the "Harrier". These derive from one expected to only ever be a "Kestrel". When they cancelled the P.1154 the "Harrier" name was going begging so the little, subsonic, proof of concept aircraft nicked it, along with a fancy (for the time) inertial navigation and attack system and moving map display. Well, according to my library anyway.)

 

Thanks Kirk for that snippet I just love the names for the British aircraft. So much more interesting than names like Z56 or even B17.

 

One for you Kirk Paveway II. Could you point me towards how the RAF colour scheme would be for the Paveway and the Bol 304.

I have found virtually every other weapon on a Harrier but these two. Also have the Harrier Interest Group pictures of a Paveway

but they are the manufacturers.

 

Grateful if you could assist.

 

Thanks

 

Laurie

 

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Sorry, Laurie. with few exceptions, I only seem to accumulate useless information, largely unrelated to model building.

You need one of the many armourer types that hang around here. Normally, you just have to post something like:

 

"Paveway VII is the correct name given to the dorsal bracket of the US designed and produced snakefoot weapon 1st used by the Lithuanians at Waterloo."

 

...and you'll attract a few into your web where you can grill them about the difference between drill rounds, live rounds, marking colours, stencils etc. Most seem friendly enough but I wouldn't leave them alone with your nearest/dearest for long. :winkgrin: 

 

If you need answers about how to select the engine management page on the MPCDs I can probably help...

 

Kirk

 

 

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59 minutes ago, Kirk said:

Sorry, Laurie. with few exceptions, I only seem to accumulate useless information, largely unrelated to model building.

You need one of the many armourer types that hang around here. Normally, you just have to post something like:

 

"Paveway VII is the correct name given to the dorsal bracket of the US designed and produced snakefoot weapon 1st used by the Lithuanians at Waterloo."

 

...and you'll attract a few into your web where you can grill them about the difference between drill rounds, live rounds, marking colours, stencils etc. Most seem friendly enough but I wouldn't leave them alone with your nearest/dearest for long. :winkgrin: 

 

If you need answers about how to select the engine management page on the MPCDs I can probably help...

 

Kirk

 

 

 

Thanks Kirk

 

Advice- do not give away your address on here :yikes:

 

Regards

 

Laurie

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