Airbrush tip dry

[wanthony]

I thought it was about time to upgrade from my single action aztek airbrush. Naturally, having a lot of the cups and nozzles I thought it wouldn't be all that bad of an idea to stay with the aztek line, and ordered the A470. It's a decent brush, definitely with more precise control than my A320, but I wasn't too impressed with the build quality. It almost feels as fragile as the models I'm building. So I kept looking, and picked up a Badger Patriot 105. I love everything about it except for one thing: I'm getting the worst tip dry.

 

I picked it up and started practicing, getting used to dual action, working on going up close doing fine lines, etc., but I can't go more than 10-15 seconds without building up a tip dry that causes spattering and sometimes even whistling. I'm working with Revell enamels, a 5 gallon tank compressor, and the standard fine needle in the airbrush. With my old aztek I always thinned the paint at about a 1:1 ratio with great results, and with the badger of course I tried thinning the paint up to about 5:1 ratio with negligible change in how fast the tip dry built up. I also tried adjusting the pressure from 8-25psi with no change. I also checked the needle and it's straight and smooth. Sure enough, running the same paint mixture at a 1:1 ratio through the A470 gave me zero tip dry. In fact, I don't remember ever having issues with tip dry with my old aztek.

 

Anyway, I'm trying to figure out the cause of this problem, and how to fix it. So far I have two theories:

 

Theory 1: large surface area of protruding needle, combined with a possible (microscopically) rough texture.

 I know these two airbrushes are performing differently than the other, and clearly have a different build. The aztek's have the interchangeable nozzles with the needles inside. They're about 2 cm long, with only about 1.5mm of the needle sticking out when closed. The badger on the other hand has a much thicker needle running the entire length of the body, and sticking out about 3mm. So there's more than double the surface area on the badger needle for paint to cling on to. On top of that, I noticed the badger needle isn't the shiniest metal out there, even though it's brand new. That being said, it's not by any means rough to the touch.

 

Theory 2: Fast drying paint, possibly worsened by use of non-paint-brand thinner.

Although the I ran the exact same paint through both, I realize I shouldn't expect the same results. Nevertheless, unless I'm spraying pure thinner out of the badger, I'm getting tip dry. I've noticed before that the Revell enamels were often very quick to dry when hand brushing small bits, even when thinned. If I play with the same spot for more than 10 seconds, the paint starts to get pretty gooey. I always wondered whether this had something to do with the thinner I'm using, which is the Testors universal enamel thinner. It mixes perfectly with the paint, but doesn't help with the drying time at all, it might even be hurting it. Should I be using the Revell color mix thinner?

 

I'll be trying some more combinations of things, but in the meantime I appreciate any thoughts or suggestions you guys might have to offer!

[P_Budzik]

 

Paul

 

 

 

Edited January 9, 2018 by P_Budzik

[LotusArenco]

11 hours ago, wanthony said:

use of non-paint-brand thinner

That’ll be my guess, but strange if you have used this combination before. Enamels are usually bullet proof. Not a ‘hot/quick dry’ thinner is it?

It’s usually us acrylic sprayers that have tip dry problems. Might be worth trying Revells’ own enamel thinner.

Mart

 

(Oh yes, Paul Budzik in da house! Top bloke, love your youtube videos. )

[wanthony]

11 hours ago, Paul Budzik said:

Acrylics do have a propensity for tip dry, but it could also be your technique.  Since you seem to be new to a double action airbrush, you might find this hint useful.  This basic action frequently slips by novice users ... check at 9:50 on this video, although you might find the entire video useful ... maybe even a bit enlightening.

 

The legend himself! I've actually been watching your videos over the past few weeks, great stuff really!

 

One of the first tips I ran across when troubleshooting was to not turn off the air flow before letting the needle close, so I've been making a conscious effort to keep the air flow going as long as possible. Unfortunately this didn't seem to help. Starting out with a clean needle, after a few seconds of spraying I can see paint particles crawling down the needle like ants, this last time to point where they would extend the needle by a millimeter. I've tried thinning the paint to where it sprayed transparent, but there just seems to be some particles that don't want to leave the needle.   

 

4 hours ago, LotusArenco said:

That’ll be my guess, but strange if you have used this combination before. Enamels are usually bullet proof. Not a ‘hot/quick dry’ thinner is it?

It’s usually us acrylic sprayers that have tip dry problems. Might be worth trying Revells’ own enamel thinner.

Mart

 

It's not labeled as such. According to the MSDS sheet it contains everything from petroleum, ether, mineral spirits, and naphtha. Does that tell you anything?

It'll cost me $10 and two weeks to get a bottle of revel thinner shipped over, but I do have a bottle of Tamiya laquer thinner laying around. I'll give that a shot, but from what I've read, laquer thinner is won't help me much in the drying department...

[LotusArenco]

49 minutes ago, wanthony said:

It'll cost me $10 and two weeks to get a bottle

Lol, perhaps not then! When I used to thin enamels, many moons ago, I tried to use the proprietary thinners. That was with old school Humbrols. Failing that good old ‘white spirit’, I think that’s what you Colonials call ‘mineral spirits’ it’s not as quick drying as turps or lacquer thinner.

 

Another suggestion would be to have a look at ‘Artists painting medium’, used to prolong the drying time of artists oil paints. A drop mixed with your enamels might do the trick, however I’ve never tried this myself.

Mart

[wanthony]

57 minutes ago, LotusArenco said:

Failing that good old ‘white spirit’, I think that’s what you Colonials call ‘mineral spirits’ it’s not as quick drying as turps or lacquer thinner.

I'll look into that, thanks!

 

As for the medium, I've heard of it but I have a feeling that would just be a cover up instead of actually solving my problem...kind of like someone who is lactose intolerant drinking milk, then taking pills to counter the lactose

[P_Budzik]

A

 

 

Paul

Edited January 9, 2018 by P_Budzik

[wanthony]

On ‎12‎/‎11‎/‎2016 at 9:52 PM, Paul Budzik said:

A great source for information on all things airbrush is Airbrush Action ... if you're not familiar with them take a few minutes and see what the real airbrush artists do ... Here is Terry Hill talking about trouble shooting airbrush issues.  He does have a section on tip dry with acrylics ...

 

That's a whole lot of airbrushes! But a very helpful video anyway, thanks!

 

I finally had a chance to play around with the airbrush today, and what I found was that I'm really only getting the tip dry when I'm working up close doing fine lines, when there's a really low flow of paint going over the needle. When I posted this topic I had just spent most of the night working on lines, so go figure. Anyway, I realize that tip dry is normal when working up close, but I'm finding it hard to believe that I can't paint a continuous line for more than five seconds before the pausing and spattering starts happening. Playing with the air pressure between 15-40 psi did not change anything and thinning the paint more only bought me about another second or two. Is there anything you would suggest?

[P_Budzik]

So

 

Edited January 9, 2018 by P_Budzik