Hannes Posted January 8, 2017 Share Posted January 8, 2017 The kit´s solution is also over-pointed imho. I know my solution is not yet pointed enough, but I knew , there will be alterings in the future and so I only rounded it a bit. But if it gets slimmer at the rear´s end in a somewhat abrupt way , it looks awful ! Hannes 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharknose156 Posted January 8, 2017 Share Posted January 8, 2017 (edited) Dear Gentlemen, Please no discouragement in the middle of the river. Let us finish what we started. We need to produce the best Fiat 806 possible. I will soon start on mine as soon as the Mef. is finished. i am still travelling right now and little access ( except with the phone but it is not friendly for replying) so apologies if my contributions have been scarce. but will read all the posts and catch up on all i have missed lately. In any case on my side i IMHO i think the thread has to continue and will produce very respectable Fiat 806 as intended from the very beginning. Dear Olivier your car looks absolutely amazing and your progress is very inspiring. Also, your ability to totally undo what you did at great effort and start again. I think this, combined with your rare talent is a guarantee for a fantastic result. ( historical in this case ) Dear Nick your technical drawing work is absolutely essential and fundamental to our success and responding to the challenge we face because of Italeri. Dear Hannes thank you for posting pictures finally, it is very important and your work is immaculate. Dear Harvey same for you, you are part of this adventure like all of us, when do you intend to start ? Dear Black Knight, your contributions have been essential for referencing mechanical reality from the period to our common goal, Dear John, you have your priority project, but i am sure whatever the pace you will produce a very amazing car with many self made and scratch built parts. i hope i did not forget anybody wanting to finish this project. Note to myself: finish your Mef. and start this beautiful car, even if you intend build another F1 on the side and at the same time !! you only live once. Greetings to all Sam Good scale modeling is humility and patience, now more than ever Edited January 8, 2017 by sharknose156 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharknose156 Posted January 8, 2017 Share Posted January 8, 2017 @Hannes Quoting Hannes : "Dear Olivier (sigh ) today I will make an exception regarding my principles , not to show a stage of development , that´s not yet finished ." Dear Hannes, Just a word of thank you for taking this exception, very useful to me ( and am sure all of us ) and very important. IMHO as we all said before, you are very experienced and have a very sharp eye and an instinct for the correct shape from the very beginning of your contributions. So if your photos represent unfinished stages, it does not matter, so much the better for us, on the contrary it will show some insight and techniques ( like the thin plastic rods increments you explained to Olivier ) in any case Vielen Dank Sam 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharknose156 Posted January 8, 2017 Share Posted January 8, 2017 Dear Thierry when do you intend to start your 806 ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannes Posted January 8, 2017 Share Posted January 8, 2017 Dear Sam , many thanks for your encouragement , it means a lot for me ! I ´ll try to show more steps in-between in the future If I would have started and finished this project without this intense research there always a feeling of uncertainesswould have been remained . I´m very greatful for the experience I made together with all of you. Beeing a lone wolf in my work most of the time (and I guess most of the sculptors have a similar fate ) I had to discover the advantage of a community .And that´s a good feeling ! So I will continue with new hope ! Viele liebe Grüsse ! Hannes 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy vd M. Posted January 8, 2017 Author Share Posted January 8, 2017 (edited) On 1/7/2017 at 1:56 AM, vontrips said: You sound similar to me only being able to focus on a couple of projects at a time...we're only blokes after all! True that! Quote Looking forward to seeing the MP4/6 spring to life with some suitably fantastically machined components! Talking if which; you better go and fire that lathe up! ;-) The 'problem' with that is that I have almost all aftermarket stuff I could imagine, already purchased. Although I look forward to building the McLaren in the Delage I also have a nice new reason to practice working on the lathe of course 21 hours ago, Hannes said: No dear Nick you really didn´t catch up . I guess we all are a bit shocked now about Roy´s withdrawal. But he announced it early in this thread ! I guess the research era will get less important in the future and the realisation of the project will become more important . It would be a great new start if some more members would decide to build the real 806. That´s why I´m thinking about a plan to make the whole construction more attractive for some members . I think , the best reward for Roy would be some convincing models buildt by us. That would be great... I agree that the (scratch)building aspect will eventually take over the research aspect and it is already happening now. I do hope that the research will go on though. Wouldn't it be something if the blueprints or drawings of the car were to be retrieved? Perhaps they are Drawing 2, but maybe there is more... Regarding your last remark... so very true! 20 hours ago, NickD said: I have: a Mefistofele, MP4-6, complete a virtual Sea Harrier, complete the virtual 806, then TSR-2 (an awesome creation if not a successful or wise one), a couple of WWI planes that I have a lot of history with and are just about to be issued by WNW, a virtual SR-71 (I saw it for the first time at Duxford recently - unbelievable machine), a Porsche 917K must be made one day and an Alfa 159, oh and this thread has opened my eyes to the wonderful machines and heros of the twenties, and probably others I have forgotton. At my usual rate of one every 2 years that should keep me busy for a while! Lol @Olivier de St Raph and @Hannes you have been progressing impressively! It is really nice to see the work of Hannes for the first time. It seems your 'signature' is that you really work in a neat way. Olivier's latest photos also start to show where he's off to: also getting more and more neat and diligent. 4 hours ago, NickD said: I have made a lot of progress in the last few days and the results look like they might be good enough to even satisfy this group. Still not sorted out the wheels !!! But have enough good quality alignment between a number of pictures, the reference lengths and drawing 2 to be feel it is likely to be closer than I have managed previously. Although it will sadly be a bit late for you and Olivier, I am hoping to to generate some sort of bodywork drawing to replace drawing 1. I will publish a taster in the next few days. My goal is only to stop when I have a 3-view drawing that we all agree is a good representation of the available information. There's always a chance for snags but there is a cause for hope. Very good news, I look forward to seeing your current standing in the replicative designs. 3 hours ago, Olivier de St Raph said: To do the check, I used transfer paper on the photo 3 (modified Roy) at scale on my Macbook. I emphasize that what I did was just 'guess work' until the tyre was circular, more or less. I hope you don't esteem the modified Photo 3 too highly... I didn't even include it in the opening post as it was just an experiment. Edited January 8, 2017 by Roy vd M. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy vd M. Posted January 8, 2017 Author Share Posted January 8, 2017 This is a very interesting video: 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totally Mad Olivier Posted January 8, 2017 Share Posted January 8, 2017 1 hour ago, sharknose156 said: Please no discouragement in the middle of the river. Let us finish what we started. Dear Sam, thank you for your compliments and encouragements. I totally agree with you on that, and you can be sure of my will, even if, as everyone here, I was desappointed by Roy's decision to build the kit later (what I can understand, as he wants to have the most certainties possible). But I want to go on and finish this amazing build as soon as possible, but, obviously, not at a mediocre result expense! So, I know now my kit won't be finished in february, as I wanted first, but there was so much work, and the problem is that we all have to manage this with many other considerations (professionnal life, family, holiday etc.) 1 hour ago, sharknose156 said: I will soon start on mine as soon as the Mef. is finished. I hope I will have enough motivation for this other Italeri kit... Sebastien Faures does not have a lot of consideration for this car (he devotes just a half page to her (p. 117). We can regret Protar (and so Italeri) did not suggest a more legendary car (Delage, or Bugatti, for example), even if the very special design and the very special engine may justify our interest... 55 minutes ago, Hannes said: I ´ll try to show more steps in-between in the future If I would have started and finished this project without this intense research there always a feeling of uncertainesswould have been remained . I´m very greatful for the experience I made together with all of you. Yes, Hannes, I agree with Sam, it will be great if you post more photos of how you go on, and not only the result. It is interesting to see how the other modelers work, especially when they work so well! Thank you to you too, Roy, I am very pleased to see you are still with us on the thread (I had no doubt about that). Don't worry about your modif on photo 3, the conclusions I drew about the overhanging would have been nearly the same on the photo 3 not modified... I have still decreased this of 1 mm and now, this parameter is very good. I will soon post a photo showing my addings on the rear axle arc. Furthermore, I am still wondering if I add rivets on my fairing. Do you see something on the HR photo 9? And, Hannes, did you finally get this HR photo 9?? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannes Posted January 8, 2017 Share Posted January 8, 2017 Dear Olivier , no I did not yet get this photo, but today I was sending a gentle reminder SMS to Mrs. Piccini. I hope ,she will react in the next days . Many greetings ! Hannes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totally Mad Olivier Posted January 8, 2017 Share Posted January 8, 2017 P.S: thank you Roy, the video looks great! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyCrank Posted January 8, 2017 Share Posted January 8, 2017 2 hours ago, sharknose156 said: Dear Thierry when do you intend to start your 806 ? Dear Sam @sharknose156 In parallel with my Bugatti when the chassis of this one will be achieved....so, I hope in the middle of the year 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vontrips Posted January 8, 2017 Share Posted January 8, 2017 5 hours ago, Olivier de St Raph said: Just to give an idea of the kit's tail and of its much too long ong overhanging, this photo of a build OOB (very nice, furthermore), taken in nearly the same view angle than the photo 3. Compare with my tracing paper... Notice that this must be a Protar kit, while the tyres are the Protar's one, right... Yes, Olivier, he built it years ago! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totally Mad Olivier Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 13 hours ago, vontrips said: Yes, Olivier, he built it years ago! ?? Is it your build, John? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vontrips Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, Olivier de St Raph said: ?? Is it your build, John? No, it was built by Mark Oakley! http://www.mrof1engineering.co.uk Edited January 9, 2017 by vontrips 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickD Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 @Roy vd M. - Enjoyed the video - thanks again. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannes Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 Photo Nr 9 arrived today . I printed it out in DIN A 3 . and ordered already a nice silver frame so I can hang one print under glass on the wall. As Roy already mentioned , some of the small rivets of the fairing still can be seen , but most of them are hidden almost invisible under thick paint. I think , I won´t represent them in my own construction for esthetical reasons. The shape of the fairing can be clearly seen now and although it´s very similar to photo 2 the outlines are sharp and it´s a great contribution regarding the fairing´s shape. More comments will follow . Many greetings ! Hannes 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy vd M. Posted January 9, 2017 Author Share Posted January 9, 2017 What do you think of the gap between the two exhaust halves? Pretty huge isn't it? I wonder if this was normal 'wear' or that the car had had a slight collision during the race. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannes Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 The frame for the steering wheel´s " screen " seems to be very thin . It fits to our assumption, a fine mesh was used , not glass ( beware!) or another opaque material. The frontal cross-strut is not painted , same goes for the tips of the frame .I guess the mechanics simply did not have time enough to paint the exchange - strut after the accident. I will paint it red , because I want to show a somewhat idealizised model. Maybe some of you have an idea how this fine mesh could be represented ? Hannes 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannes Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 Dear Roy , the gap is huge indeed ! I wonder why there was no additional wrapping at this spot .The blackening seems to confirm ,exhaust gases evaded ( bad for Bordino´s lungs ! ) Hannes 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy vd M. Posted January 9, 2017 Author Share Posted January 9, 2017 (edited) You agree with me on the wrapping I think... not sure photo 9 can be considered as 100% evidence but I'd say 95% would be a realistic estimate. I'm not 100% sure whether the front cross-strut wasn't painted, the light colour could be a trick of the lighting circumstances. Regarding the steering wheel's screen, it was somewhere in our literature (I think the 1974 article I treated in my last elaborate post) that it was indeed a fine mesh. For filtering my paint prior to pouring it in my airbrush cup I use emptied tea bags. They are available from fine to very fine (matter of experimenting)... I use one of this type: Perhaps that would fit as a scale replacement for the mesh. Or if you really want to keep to the scale principle: Edited January 9, 2017 by Roy vd M. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Knight Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 On 24/12/2016 at 11:44 AM, Black Knight said: Just a quick note afore I go. Its quite normal to NOT have a soild joint between the front and main exhaust tubes. Often the front is a sliding fit into the rear main tube. This is to allow the tubes to flex with the chassis. A solid joint with solidly fixed exhausts leads to fractures at any weak point that the vibration can find. In the picture of my Austin earlier I have a short tube attached for certain events. Its a sliding fit into the expansion box. For long rallies I have an exhaust which runs the length of the car and up over the rear wheel, it too slides into the expansion box and is supported to the car near the rear. My fittings are the reversal of what many others do 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy vd M. Posted January 9, 2017 Author Share Posted January 9, 2017 I'm aware of that post Black Knight but it seems that the gap between the two exhaust parts is perhaps too large. Hence my question about possible collision damage or so. It can be seen in the low resolution version of Photo 9 as well. Centered between vertical steering linkage on the one hand, and hand brake on the other, you see this gap. On the high resolution version you can see that it really is as large as you reckon it would be, looking at the low resolution pic. The whole 'black area' is the gap. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Knight Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 Is it a gap or the pipe blackened by exhaust gas blow-back? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannes Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 Dear Fred of course I remember your statement .I thought about a flexible wrapping to prevent the evasion of the gases.. If the exhaust system is not tight , the power will decrease imho. Dear Roy what about a fine nylon of a lady ? On the other hand the problem with the frame and how to fix it to the steering wheel is not yet solved with a flexible material . Hannes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy vd M. Posted January 9, 2017 Author Share Posted January 9, 2017 (edited) This is what it looks like approximately: Would it be exhaust gases what we're seeing I'd be highly surprised. If I had to make an assessment I'd give it less than 5% chance. And my theories as set out in this topic have always proven to be correct1. What does Hannes think of it? In your opinion, could the blackened area as indicated be exhaust fumes blowing back? 1. Disclaimer: where I meant 'have always been correct' I really mean to say 'have never been correct with one or two exceptions'. My current intention being to be taken seriously in my 'less than 5%-assessment' I chose to slightly abstract from the facts. Edited January 9, 2017 by Roy vd M. Terminology 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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