Hannes Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 (edited) Dear Olivier , maybe there was no support for the manifold at the left side at all . ( because there was no steering system ).The following scetch is related to the right side . As I said above the manifolds are well supported by their fixation to the cylinder heads . Sorry again for my wrong conclusions . Hannes Edited July 23, 2017 by Hannes 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannes Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totally Mad Olivier Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 3 hours ago, Hannes said: In my opinion there only was a simple support under the manifold ( as we can see on drawing 1 ) P.S: I don't see this simple support on Drawing 1. On what view do you see it? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totally Mad Olivier Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 (edited) Thanks Hannes for your drawing. That's indeed what I had understood. But don't you see a wrapping support of the exhaust on the left front area on photos 7?? That said, I am not sure there was any support on right side on the front area, even like you suggest in your drawing... Edited July 23, 2017 by Olivier de St Raph 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totally Mad Olivier Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 (edited) 23 hours ago, Olivier de St Raph said: Dear Hannes, the only photo where I can see (with good eyes...) a front exhaust support is on photo 7: I don't see any support on none of our photos front and right. I really wonder if there was one... I quote myself to show, once more the "wrapping" I see on photo 7. Maybe it is not a wrapping but just the first pipe... Finally, I will probably remove the front left support... I don't see why there would be no support right but one left... What a f...g build! Edited July 23, 2017 by Olivier de St Raph 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannes Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 (edited) Dear Olivier , on the sideview of drawing 1 we can see this construction above the triangular plate .Photo 2 shows us how it looked in reality . How and if this was connected with the manifold is pure speculation . On photo 7 the last of the branches can be seen imho If there had been a wrapped sheet we should see it on our photos 4 in my opinion . . Hannes Edited July 23, 2017 by Hannes 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totally Mad Olivier Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 (edited) Ok Hannes, I have seen what you mean: is this a part of a support for the manifold, possible but impossible to be sure. As I said above, I have finally removed my left front support and the extension of the connector engine/frame. In the same time, I have glued in place my right manifold (not simple...), studied our photos 2 and 7 about the rear right support for the exhaust. And I have made this support, different from the left one (I made what I saw): For now, it is metal but I will paint it red after drying of my XF16 alu... Imho, the photo 9 suggests they were painted and not bare metal. Edited July 24, 2017 by Olivier de St Raph 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannes Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 (edited) On photo 7 the rear support does not seem painted so why painting it on the right side ? I would leave both unpainted for esthetical reasons to avoid too much contrast on the pipes A construction as you showed for the right side would only make sense if this suspension would be welded to the pipe . Over the bandages no engineer would allow this kind of construction imho . Many greetings ! Hannes Edited July 23, 2017 by Hannes 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totally Mad Olivier Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 New step taken, even if some weathering and little corrections are still necessary here or there: my left and right exhausts are now totally in place, and also the heatshield: Notice the double suction cup under the car: it is a good solution to limit the stress on the wheels when handling the model. As it is fixed (temporary, of course) to the underbody, it is always here when you replace the model on the wheels. You will recognize the angle of view of our photo 3: And the one of our photo 9: 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannes Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 Your model looks very nice , dear Olivier ! I once built a wooden support for my Protar at exactly the same spot It was situated under the gearbox and was painted matt black . I guess I will have to build internal reinforcements like the fixation of the rear axle to the bottom plate , because my model will become quite heavy ! Many greetings ! Hannes 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickD Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 Olivier - those very grainy pictures do seem to support your view of how the exhaust is suspended. I wonder if they would have been painted as they were attached to the hot exhaust. Paint would have a hard time. Regards Nick 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannes Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 Dear Nick , did you read my reply on page 147 ? Hannes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickD Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 Hannes, I thought I did but you guys cover the ground so fast it's difficult to keep up. If it is about the PM I will reply separately. Your sketch above is really clear. I have been puzzling about the bottom bracket. There are lots of bolts on the bracket (at least 3 at the back - one in the middle and 1 at the front)- none of the photos is really clear here. I can see any bolts throught the chassis which seems strange. How does the bottom bracket attach to the frame. Maybe it is attached to the engine mount. But that it is not clear either. There also appears to be a longitudinal rib on the braket too but it seems to be detached from the chassis and looks like it extends forward of the bracket. Weird. The brake bar and accelerator mounting are no clearer to me either. Oh for a minute with the car - then we could go "Ahhh! that's what they did" - Oh well. Olivier, Really looking good - so impressive considering how much abuse the kit has taken. Regards Nick 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannes Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 (edited) Dear Nick ,my reply was about your questions regarding the distance part and the brake cable Hannes Edited July 23, 2017 by Hannes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickD Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 On 20/07/2017 at 23:30, Hannes said: I cannot tell you how exactly this cable was connected with the frontal brake drum . There seems to be no lever on the outside of the drum ( contrary to the rear brake drums ! ) that´s why I believe there had been an internal mechanism. We can see the two guide pulleys on the plan view ( maybe connected with the lower mounting points of the rear shock absorbers ) and - as you said - the cable seems to be connected somewhere below the center of the drum hidden under the frontal axle .There seems to be something as we can see on photos 12 and 21 . Maybe comparisons with other contemporary racing cars could help to solve this problem . I think I responded to this - if this is the right section. Having reread your comment I am of the same view that Drawing 2 is the only real source of information and it does not show the drums!. Frustrating. I can't make anything new from photos 12 and 21 though they are the best we have. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannes Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 Dear Nick , I cannot see a bracket in this region.. The plan-view of drawing 2 shows the steering arm , the engine mounting tube and a rod for the brake mechanism . This rod is not connected with the chassis in my opinion,. It must have been a massive rod as we can see on engine drawing 5 .On the other side of the crankshaft case it´s connected with the booster wheel on the gearbox by a rod and this booster wheel is connected with the crossbeam for the brake levers. There´s no bracket necessary imho because the engine with it´s mounting tubes is some kind of bracket itself . Many greetings ! Hannes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannes Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 (edited) Dear Olivier , I made a mistake and wrote my answer regarding Knupfer in my conversation with Nick .. I´m not used to write PM´s and I believed our internal thread is open for all listed members , that´´s the reason for my error .I ´ll edit my list on page 148 so please read my answer in my former post !! Hannes Edited July 23, 2017 by Hannes 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totally Mad Olivier Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 Ok Hannes, thanks! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannes Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 (edited) Dear Olivier , one important issue : Before you will fasten your brake cables please consider to make a scratchbuild of the distance part for the frontal brake cables . I´ll draw a scetch later on . Because you are a fan of cinema , I want to divulge my own personal favorite : It´s " Les Enfants du Paradise " , in geman " Kinder des Olymp " For me it´s the best film that´s ever been made . Many greetings ! Hannes Edited July 24, 2017 by Hannes 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannes Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannes Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 This is only a schematic scetch , in reality this " cramp" seems to be very close to the distance part , sorry. Hannes 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharknose156 Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 On 7/23/2017 at 7:17 PM, Hannes said: Over the bandages no engineer would allow this kind of construction imho . totally agreed with Hannes. this being said very nice build, but i am not convinced of the bandages being ever placed under the hood at all. the color is spot on IMHO and for this alone you deserve a medal Olivier 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totally Mad Olivier Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 (edited) 58 minutes ago, sharknose156 said: totally agreed with Hannes Ok I will wrapp my rear right exhaust, just a little modif, not difficult. It is on the other hand a bit too late to remove the bandages under the hood (not impossible but more difficult now). Are you sure this is impossible? We had many debates about these bandages, the photo 9 shows the same color between the manifold and the beginning of the pipes, that's why I decided to extend the bandages on them. The color is simply the X7 Tamiya enamel (no mixing) applied on a metal alu base (as you know, you get very different results following the primer you use under a red color) and thinned with the great Tamiya X20 enamel thinner. It was not the hardest of my build... But your arguments were very convincing and, me who had first chosen a darker color (kind of Alfa one), I finally changed it for this very nice "Italian red". The description, in the article of "l'auto italiana", of the "fiammante rosso" finished to convince me. I don't think the term "fiammante rosso" would have been applied to the Alfa red. Edited July 24, 2017 by Olivier de St Raph 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannes Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 (edited) Dear Olivier , if a color is flammante or not also depends on the wheather conditions . I found my color : It can be seen on two videos of the Fiat S 76 ( the car I showed last christmas ) The first video is about the restauration works and the second video is named : "Firey beast of Turin returns to the highway ." Even if there was only cloudy wheather ( like the racing day )the color changes depending on the circumstances . Have a look ! Many greetings ! Hannes Edited July 24, 2017 by Hannes 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickD Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 @sharknose156 - good to hear from you. On exhaust wrapping - generally I don't have a view but I think I saw a pre-war car (modern restoration) with wrapping under the hood. I think it was in the magazine Octane this month - but I did not buy it and cannot find a reference so I might be wrong. Sorry not much help! Nick 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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