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RAF Hercules Dio


tc2324

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IMG_6038_zpsaekfll0n.jpg

 

 

Your probably thinking, `great..., he`s posted this in the wrong section?`

 

Well let me explain. This is actually the first part of my new long term project for a build on another forum and well, you need to add this little 1/48 scale Landy to this rather space consuming 1/48 scale transport......

 

 

IMG_6035_zpsubh06tzl.jpg

 

 

I think the mug gives you a reasonable perspective on size.....!

 

Yep, this is another of my `inflight` dio`s where the Land Rover will be fixed to a pallett, drogue chute deployed, coming out of this end......

 

 

IMG_6036_zps3wple8mn.jpg

 

 

   ......... in a somewhat similar angle like this ...!

 

 

IMG_6041_zpspnq4mkyr.jpg

 

 

This should be fun......

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Nice idea but the Land Rover you have is a Snatch mk2, which is too tall and to heavy to be air dropped from a Herc once on the correct air delivery pallet. The only ones that were dropped would have been ether the early 1/2 tonnes or the pathfinders cut down Defenders. Standard Defenders tended not to survive being air drop even when on the air delivery pallets.

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6 minutes ago, neil5208 said:

Nice idea but the Land Rover you have is a Snatch mk2, which is too tall and to heavy to be air dropped from a Herc once on the correct air delivery pallet. The only ones that were dropped would have been ether the early 1/2 tonnes or the pathfinders cut down Defenders. Standard Defenders tended not to survive being air drop even when on the air delivery pallets.

 

An excellent point and one I`m very much aware of.

 

I just needed the shape of a Landy as it will be `tarped` over for the `drop`.

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In my time dropping MSPs and double MSPs (Medium Stressed Platforms) on Albert the Landys were never 'tarped' but usually stacked with a trailer GS.

 

Additionally, if it came out at the angle you suggest we'd have probably lost the tail!

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The tarp idea just seemed ideal to me so that it hide the fact that I`m using the incorrect Landy.

 

Always happy to be advised on SOP chaps, I`m not an expert, so feel free.

 

 

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1 hour ago, tc2324 said:

The tarp idea just seemed ideal to me so that it hide the fact that I`m using the incorrect Landy.

 

Always happy to be advised on SOP chaps, I`m not an expert, so feel free.

 

 

 

I seem to recollect that the Pathfinder Defenders were 90's rather than 110s - you may want to double check, and they all had bent chassis!!   

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Landy`s were/are dropped from a Herk inside a Medium Stressed Platform rig or MSP for short;

Here is one exiting the ramp;

Image result for msp parachute hercules

Here is one from the front;

Image result for msp parachute hercules

Here is one with somebody`s missus;

Image result for msp parachute hercules

Here is one with some modern `thingy' in it;

Image result for msp parachute hercules

Here is another with a Landy and trailer;

Image result for msp parachute hercules

When we rigged our MSP`s up the Landrover and trailer were usually heaped with kit and we also had extra Airborne Trolley`s added too along the sides. Took days to rig properly and minutes to de rig on the DZ. Saw one land on top of a cow once!! 

Good luck with your dio and hope this helps,

 

Cheers

           Tony

PS,....I Have seen them dropped with 2 x Landrovers in one MSP but from memory they may have been short wheelbase? One had very old knackered petrol Landy`s and landed fine,...the other contained brand new diesel Defender`s which were just coming into service and being cleared for dropping,.......guess which one had a parachute malfunction!

Edited by tonyot
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Thanks for those Tony, very much appreciated with the MSP pictures.  

 

I quite like the the 2nd picture and falls into line with what I had in mind. I`m not going to get it all exactly right, but those pictures are very helpful. 

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Hi Tony,

 

Was the picture of the Landrover atop the yellow lifter taken at Brize Norton?  I presume it's a mid '70s shot going by the olive and black on the Landrover and overseas transport scheme on the Hercules.

Edited by JosephLalor
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8 hours ago, JosephLalor said:

Hi Tony,

 

Was the picture of the Landrover atop the yellow lifter taken at Brize Norton?  I presume it's a mid '70s shot going by the olive and black on the Landrover and overseas transport scheme on the Hercules.

 

And the Denison!

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13 hours ago, tc2324 said:

This should be fun......

I would say..  the Italeri 48th Hercules is the only kit that I ever gave up building!

 

Great shots from Tony, they all (apart from the Pinzgauer) appear to be Series III 109s with Sankeys, the Tamiya/Italeri Pink Panther Landrover kit is probably the best way to replicate these, especially the one in the 2nd pic down.

 

The last shot isn't Brize as the architecture is wrong, thinking more Abingdon or Upper Heyford?

Edited by 71chally
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My best man's Dad was at Odiham when the Puma entered service.  On one occasion the Army requested a lift of their vehicles and kit, including the CO's shiny new Land Rver.  Puma arrives, Land Rver is hooked on underneath and Puma departs smartly.  At a height greater than 500 feet Pilot Officer Prune executes a smart, hard turn: Land Rover and Puma part company, shortly after which Land Rover and Earth meet at some speed.  When the dust settled the Land Rover looked like it had been through the crusher, I.e. approximately cube shaped.  Curious minds noted that all four wheels were still touching the ground and that the steering wheel was still n place.  Experimentation showed that the engine could be started and unbelievably the vehicle could still, just, be driven.  Land Rver missed out on a brilliant marketing opportunity I think.

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1 hour ago, perdu said:

Isn't the Tamiya Pinky a 1/35 scale kit?

 

I built that years ago

 

That is correct, it would seem that the Airfix versions are the only ones in 1/48?? Looks like it will just have to do.

 

I think it`s safe to say i`m not going to get this one entirely 100% in terms of accuracy, but the thread seems to have generated a bit of interest, chat and useful references. 

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Doh, yes you're right, you're going to need a bigger Herc!

 

3 hours ago, perdu said:

 

 

Doesn't look like Abingdon to my ancient memory though 

The more I look at it the more I think it is, white painted A type aeroplane sheds with green doors, slightly angled from each other, I think the tower would have been to the left, just out of shot.

Edited by 71chally
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A couple of shots of MSPs going 'out the back':

 

BLACKANDWHITEMSPALMVIEW_zpsmwmbcg8y.jpg

 

MSPDROPFROMALMVIEW2_zpsy40tdxmi.jpg

 

Slightly off topic:

 

During RAF C-130 operations, the drop would be controlled by the Nav. He (or she) would produce a CARP (Calculated Air Release Point) which gave a distance offst from the required landing point on the DZ. The CARP was based upon the ballistics of the load being dropped (MSP, Double MSP, ULLA, Harness Packs, or Paras), the height of the drop, and the conditions of the day (ie wind drift). He or she would then stand either to the side of the Co or the Captain (dependant upon the drift) and operate the jump light switches - if a load was going out the back such as an MSP the Nav would call it and the Loadie would intiate with his or her controls in the freight bay.

 

When we went to competitions such as 'Airlift Rodeo' at Pope AFB in North Carolina, the Americans couldn't believe this - they would put a man on the DZ who would tell their crews when to drop (we invariably beat them). The following photo' was taken at (I believe) an earlier 'Volant Rodeo' excercise at  Pope and resided for many years on the wall in STS (Support Training Squadron - the airdrop part of the Herc OCU). It serves to indicate just how accurate RAF crews could be!

 

MSPcrushesDZSOsJeep1_zpsj1cpsmwk.jpg

 

 

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MSP's, now this is a subject I can bore for England about.

Did you know they were first dropped from USAF C-119 prior to the Beverley entering service.

The platforms are stressed for the parachute loads so that the vehicles and stores don't have to be.

They were first specified as having a 7000 lb capacity and over the years that grew to 18000lb.

The side frames were introduced when the extraction system was changed from extractor retarder to reefed mains extraction and the side frame extensions appeared when the Herc arrived with its higher roof compared to the Argosy.

MSP Minimum drop height is 500 ft but when they tried the HALO concept with the MSP they were dropped fro 17 000 ft.

BTW I have a photo of a HALO MSP with its Pink Panther load that didn't deploy its main canopies (the Landie only recognisable by a very bent number plate) I also have a photo of Debs flattened cow. For some reason there are more photos of airdrops gone wrong than those that work. :)

The MSP was a useful piece of kit (if somewhat expensive) and its ability to accept double decked loads meant that when compared to the US's Type 5 platform the UK needed half the number of aircraft to drop the same amount of equipment.

Now its big brother the Heavy Stressed Platform...........................

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We used to see test pallets with loads over at JATE, Brize all the time. I used the JATE Drawing Office's big photo copier quite a bit as it was the biggest I could find for our full size (1/1 scale) VC10 repair drawings. Shame I'm not there, obviously there was stacks of kit and info to be seen.

16 hours ago, JosephLalor said:

Hi Tony,

 

Was the picture of the Landrover atop the yellow lifter taken at Brize Norton?  I presume it's a mid '70s shot going by the olive and black on the Landrover and overseas transport scheme on the Hercules.

 

Not Brize. Hangars don't look like that, the offices on the side aren't right either. Its an early  70s pic ,before the 75/76 move to Brize..Yellow Condeck. They were Dk green before 76. Its probably RAF Abingdon when JATE was there 1965-75/76.

Edited by bzn20
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Without a doubt it's Abingdon.

 

JATE (Joint Air Transport Establishment) didn't get to Abingdon until 1971 (you're thinking of the ATDU - Army Air Transport Development Unit), prior to that it was at Old Sarum, having been formed in 1968.

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